CJRivera Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 My wife's Toyota Sienna is having more problems, and I'm thinking it's time to start looking for a new vehicle for her. My neighbor has a Flex (and I love it), but the wife hates the exterior. So today I took her to look at the MKT at one of the local STL Lincoln dealers. Got there and greeted by a friendly, but a little new, salesman who showed us one of the 2 MKTs he had on the lot. For anyone who thought the exterior looks ugly in any of the pictures on the internet, you really need to see one in person. The huge snout in the pictures, really looks ok in real life (and especially in a dark color, like the black we were looking at), The rest of the exterior was extremely nice. The wife said she liked it a lot better than the Flex. So far so good. Climbed in and the salesman did a pretty good job of showing all the features in the MKT, especially since the vehicles were new and so was he. I had done a lot of research on the MKT so a few of my questions may have stumped him (not my intent), but he found the info we needed quickly. Front seats and all the gadgets were excellent. The quality of the front seats/leather/trim were as good as BMW/MB/Lexus. Instrumentations/LCD display all better than anything else out there for a people mover. Finish was very nice. Middle row (bench) also very nice and spacious with excellent quality of materials. Would have liked to see the captains chairs with fridge, but they didn't have it on the lot. As much as I loved the interior, the test drive easily sold it for me. Took it out and got into traffic and I was extremely shocked at how quickly a vehicle this size got up to speed. Nothing like the piglike handling the Sienna has. And nothing like the anemic (virtually nonexistent) acceleration in the Sienna. This thing took the onramp onto the freeway nice and firm. The wife was also impressed with how the MKT drove. For anyone that doubts the EcoBoost engine, test drive one of these and you'll see why it is lauded in so many reviews. Love the power. No turbo whine heard at all in the dead quiet cabin. The bad news... she was only 2/3 impressed - the front 2/3, that is. The last row of seats and storage behind the 3rd row might be deal breakers. She sat in the back row (and at 5'4") had her head almost touching the roof. I got back there to show her that she must've been sitting wrong (I don't even know what that meant, but I was determined to get this car), but when I sat back there at 5'10", even I couldn't keep a straight face as I had to sit with my head tilted to the side (with my head pushing into the ceiling) and said, "See, this isn't so bad." Behind the back seats, the storage area was smaller than the Sienna (which is long enough to hold a full sized spare tire and 2 suitcases and many travel bags) and because we visit family who live 3-8 hours away with 3 kids, the luggage storage is a must. I think the storage issue may have a somewhat awkward solution, but I think that 3rd row seating problem will likely break the deal. Damn that 3rd row! I want this car so badly after driving it, but unless test drives of some of the vans she wants to look at (Sienna, Odessey, Town & Country - sadly no Ford on the market) go bad, I don't see an MKT in my garage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Apparently the MKT lost 5 inches of headroom from the Flex. Wasn't the MKT designed to be a 4/5 passenger CUV originally? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Sounds like the next Explorer might be more appropriate for your needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryQW Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) Wow, it's like they didn't intend for anyone to use the third row except for kids! My Taurus X on the same frame (as well as the Flex) can handle me at 6'2" in the third row just fine with plenty of head room in the 'stadium' seating. I've even had a 6'4" friend back there once. It's a bit tight on leg room (like the second row in many cars) but fine for an hour or two of driving. I thought the MKT trim looked beautiful inside and could be my next car, but not now. Like BORG said, my next car is now more likely be the new Explorer in a few years. Edited October 22, 2009 by LarryQW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelsonlu Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Damn that 3rd row! I want this car so badly after driving it, but unless test drives of some of the vans she wants to look at (Sienna, Odessey, Town & Country - sadly no Ford on the market) go bad, I don't see an MKT in my garage. Wife doesn't like the Flex? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I think when she told him she "hates the exterior of the Flex" he had his first clue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 The last row of seats and storage behind the 3rd row Uh, that would be the 4th row . . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Wife doesn't like the Flex? My neighbor has a Flex (and I love it), but the wife hates the exterior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I'm surprised that 3rd row seating is that high on your priority list. Very few customers are going to be driving around with 6 adults. I'm disappointed with the storage of the Flex after the 3rd row. I was half thinking of replacing my 12 year old Econoline. I would like something that could carry 4 adults and twin grandchildren and still have reasonable storage. I don't think I can get a double stroller, diaper bags, toys and enough adult luggage for a weekend trip in the rear of a Flex. Sigh. Nothing replaces an Econoline for interior volume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) Sounds like the next Explorer might be more appropriate for your needs. Why ? Current Explorer has poor 3rd seat head room and almost zero storage behind the 3rd seat ! I don't except either to get better. The Flex and the MKT are the "people movers". Edited October 22, 2009 by theoldwizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-150 Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Sigh. Nothing replaces an Econoline for interior volume. Sprinter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJRivera Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 I'm surprised that 3rd row seating is that high on your priority list. Very few customers are going to be driving around with 6 adults. With the kids in so many activities, carpooling with other families is essential, otherwise you have to drive to every practice, piano lessons, party, etc. So if you have a group of your kids' friends that you carpool with (5 or 6 of them), then you only have to drive once every 5-6 times. Saves gas, time, and money. That's why you see "soccer moms" driving around with empty cars at times, because they don't need the seating all the time. And these kids are getting taller. My daughter is 12 (7th grade) and is 5'6 (so would be just brushing her head against the roof). She's one of the shorter girls in the class. Some of the girls in her class (5'8" or so) would have to ride with the heads against the roof and cocked to the side. Heck, on boy in my boy's class (5th grade) is already taller than my wife and so wouldn't be able to sit straight up in the back seat and he's only 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAC_Sparky Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Sigh. Nothing replaces an Econoline for interior volume. True, but you pay for that room at the pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 If you need 3rd row headroom AND storage behind the 3rd row, you need a minivan or an Expedition. If you're only hauling kids in the 3rd row most of the time you can solve the space problem with a roof rack or hitch rack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJRivera Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 If you need 3rd row headroom AND storage behind the 3rd row, you need a minivan or an Expedition. A minivan is likely the vehicle we need. The problem is Ford (or Lincoln) doesn't make a minivan, and I'd prefer to buy a Ford product, due to my good experiences with Ford in the past. An Expedition is overkill as I don't tow, and not as fuel efficient. Just not the vehicle we need. If you're only hauling kids in the 3rd row most of the time you can solve the space problem with a roof rack or hitch rack. I have often thought of tying those kids to the roof rack during long drives (and it had nothing to do with storage issues... ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 A minivan is likely the vehicle we need. The problem is Ford (or Lincoln) doesn't make a minivan, and I'd prefer to buy a Ford product, due to my good experiences with Ford in the past.An Expedition is overkill as I don't tow, and not as fuel efficient. Just not the vehicle we need. I have been making that argument for years, and have been flamed for it the whole time. Good luck trying to find somebody compassionate on this board to your needs. They will point you to product you don't want, all the while not knowing what you need because they don't even have kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJRivera Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 I have been making that argument for years, and have been flamed for it the whole time. Good luck trying to find somebody compassionate on this board to your needs. They will point you to product you don't want, all the while not knowing what you need because they don't even have kids. Yeah, I've seen that here. I usually just lurk through these forums, and have often seen those arguments. Just haven't had the energy to post any rebuttals to the arguments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryQW Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) If you need 3rd row headroom AND storage behind the 3rd row, you need a minivan or an Expedition. If you're only hauling kids in the 3rd row most of the time you can solve the space problem with a roof rack or hitch rack. My wife's Ford Freestar minivan is the same length as my Taurus X (~200"), which is also the same length as the Flex and MKT. The current Explorer is shorter (193"), but I expect the new uni-body version on the same chassis as the Flex to be about as long. (Expedition is 221" long.) The difference between Minivans/T-X/Flex/MKT is mostly in head room, not length. That extra height provides useful storage volume and passenger comfort. Minivans are quite nice if you can get away from that stigma. (Even Soccer Moms won't drive them now.) I find my T-X has plenty of room for strollers and small amounts of luggage behind the third row with six people. The Flex actually has a little less. As suggested, for a weekend trip for six people, I'd break out the overhead cargo box (or maybe charter a bus). And for a camping trip for only 4 people, I'd still want the cargo box, to allow room to see through the back. (The cargo box is great for light fluffy voluminous things like sleeping bags.) Fortunately, this car chassis is low enough to make the roof top box practical to reach. Oh, and with that much load, I pump the tires up to 38 psi instead of 34 psi. Edited October 22, 2009 by LarryQW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I have been making that argument for years, and have been flamed for it the whole time. Good luck trying to find somebody compassionate on this board to your needs. They will point you to product you don't want, all the while not knowing what you need because they don't even have kids. THANK YOU Pioneer! Some of the negative comments in other threads just on the subject of sliding doors really puzzled me (as did the anti van sentiment generally). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Why ? Current Explorer has poor 3rd seat head room and almost zero storage behind the 3rd seat ! I don't except either to get better. The Flex and the MKT are the "people movers". The next Explorer is taller, there may be more room back there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I have been making that argument for years, and have been flamed for it the whole time. Good luck trying to find somebody compassionate on this board to your needs. They will point you to product you don't want, all the while not knowing what you need because they don't even have kids. I think we have all told you that a mini van is the ONLY vehicle that will fit your needs, and obviously the same goes for this gentleman, NOTHING, and I mean NOTHING can replace a minivans utility, but it does come with its compromises...the biggest being the same styling that gives it the utility in the first place....and THATS what people bitch about, styling and driving dynamics...something a minivan will/ can never have... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Wow, it's like they didn't intend for anyone to use the third row except for kids! My Taurus X on the same frame (as well as the Flex) can handle me at 6'2" in the third row just fine with plenty of head room in the 'stadium' seating. I've even had a 6'4" friend back there once. It's a bit tight on leg room (like the second row in many cars) but fine for an hour or two of driving. I thought the MKT trim looked beautiful inside and could be my next car, but not now. Like BORG said, my next car is now more likely be the new Explorer in a few years. That's what happens when they make the designs different and went with a more swoopy design on the MKT. Uh, that would be the 4th row . . . . no wonder he's having space issues then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 The next Explorer is taller, there may be more room back there. will STILL be a compromise to an all out Mini-van...but it will look and drive substantially better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY93SHO Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 will STILL be a compromise to an all out Mini-van...but it will look and drive substantially better. My sister-in-law just bought a Traverse specifically because it's NOT a minivan. Doesn't help that her sister is taking her Terraza in to get the sliders fixed AGAIN. Different strokes for different folks. It's been stated a thousand times, the minivan pie is shrinking. Why fight over a smaller slice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 My sister-in-law just bought a Traverse specifically because it's NOT a minivan. Doesn't help that her sister is taking her Terraza in to get the sliders fixed AGAIN. Different strokes for different folks. It's been stated a thousand times, the minivan pie is shrinking. Why fight over a smaller slice? one can gauge market shifts of fickle buyers by product that either gets nixed or ignored.....no profits means a death noll....( insert Panther barb ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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