LincolnV Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I now hope that Ford ditches the current Lincoln grill. Every time I see an MKX or MKT now it reminds me of this...except around here there are no cows to push off the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnV Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Awesome article and some interesting photos too....makes me believe that any future Thunderbird should be flown under the Lincoln banner. And to quell any back-lash...it should be presented as "Thunderbird, by Lincoln." The name is primary in this case, the brand...second. "How Stuff Works" actually has a lot of interesting car articles - there are couple of good ones on the Mustang. I wish Ford would start to publicize some of their archives on the web. I'd be really interested in seeing all the clay models the design studios worked on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I now hope that Ford ditches the current Lincoln grill. Every time I see an MKX or MKT now it reminds me of this...except around here there are no cows to push off the road. I always thought it looked like a Baleen whale myself... Anyways, I perfer the look of Lincoln's grill to the orgiami style that Caddy has...its already tired looking and doesn't look to have much of a shelf life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I always thought it looked like a Baleen whale myself... Anyways, I perfer the look of Lincoln's grill to the orgiami style that Caddy has...its already tired looking and doesn't look to have much of a shelf life. I can understand the concerns.....while the "split bow" grille works on the MKZ....it seems smallish on the MKS and gigantic on the MKT....the MKX is about right too....but for a new re-invigorated Lincoln, a new design should be considered......and if Thunderbird sees the light of day under the Lincoln banner, lets hope it gets its own styling that is as unique as the car and name itself.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grbeck Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 (edited) Was the '39 Continental an embarrassment? The 56? The 61? The Mark III? They were great cars, but most of the people outside of this forum who will immediately remember them when the words "Lincoln Continental" are uttered are in an assisted living facility (if they're not dead yet). It's the same as the GM fans who kept saying it was a shame to kill the brand that brought us the Wide Track concept, the GTO and the glorious Bonnevilles of the 1950s and 1960s. Those cars were 40-50 years ago...most people, when asked about Pontiac today, would mention the hideous Aztek or Sunfires and Grand Ams with wheezy four-cylinder engines and cheap-looking cladding. Edited January 12, 2011 by grbeck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I don't mind the Lincoln naming scheme the way it is, but I've witnessed the constant confusion with customers and dealers enough to know it's just not ideal. And Lincoln returning to heritage/retro naming is a great way to remind people that Lincoln is your Grandpa's luxury car and in no way competes with youthful and aspiring brands from Germany and Japan. If Lincoln wants to keep the status quo and fail, go ahead with hertiage naming, it's marketing suicide. This is one brand where nostalgia isn't compatible with the market they are seeking. Keep in mind, the market they are seeking (like me) knows the Continental is that ugly plastic chrome barge with the broken air suspension that their deceased grandpa use to own. They were great cars, but most of the people outside of this forum who will immediately remember them when the words "Lincoln Continental" are uttered are in an assisted living facility (if they're not dead yet). As slvrsvt already said: I think your giving yourself too much credit and other people our age...this same idea has infested the thinking of Detroit for the past 30-40 years...something with a new name is automatically better (for great example, look at what Chevy has done in the B and C Segments just in the past 10 years). If something is done right or even done halfway right and improved upon, it doesn't matter what its named, as long as there is contuntiney in the name. How many times have you heard people hey I need a new car, and someone automatically blurts out buy a Camry or Accord? Both those cars wheren't anything special in the 1970's. The Continental you hate so much is from the Taurus platform, which was resurrected recently. Like the Taurus, the Continental name has strong recognition value. Also like the Taurus, the vehicle has had a few rough times in the past. The MKS is really an extension of the last Continental. But it's a much better car....as is the Taurus. I DON'T hear people griping about the early 90's Taurus history when looking at the new Taurus. They know it's a different car from a different company. People like winners and a success story. Ford and Hyundai are good examples.......people no longer think of the 96 Excel when looking at Hyundai. And THAT was truly a piece of s#it. Ford has already done "historical revision" with the 68.5 Mark III, effectively erasing the tuna boat 58 Mark III. The Continental name, especially as a European/American car, makes sense. Definition of CONTINENTAL 1a : of, relating to, or characteristic of a continent <continental waters>; specifically often capitalized : of or relating to the continent of Europe excluding the British Isles b often capitalized : of, relating to, or being a cuisine derived from the classic dishes of Europe and especially France 2a often capitalized : of or relating to the colonies later forming the United States <Continental Congress> b : being the part of the United States on the North American continent; also : being the part of the United States comprising the lower 48 states — con·ti·nen·tal·ly \-tə-lē\ adverb See continental defined for English-language learners » Examples of CONTINENTAL They will be touring Continental Europe. differences between Britain and its Continental neighbors The hotel combines American comfort with continental elegance. [/b Lincoln is not a German or Japanese luxury car. They don't need to follow their LSRTSEC/250456321 series designations, not that MK& did. There is a higher example: the Bentley Continental (which preceded our Continental by 3 years). (............of or relating to the continent of Europe excluding the British Isle?s) it actually makes more sense for an American line. If it's a great car the Continental name would be great too, but I still think they need a RWD platform to compete against Mercedes, BMW, Lexus, Jaguar etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I think that Lincoln buyers are mature enough to know that any vehicle sold in the future with a traditional Lincoln name won't be the same as the old vehicles sold years ago. This thought that Continental or Versailles will conjure up negative connotations in new car buyers minds is just plain absurd, enough time has lapsed for those buyers to look at those vehicle names with open minds and judge the new vehicles fairly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnV Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 (edited) I think that Lincoln buyers are mature enough to know that any vehicle sold in the future with a traditional Lincoln name won't be the same as the old vehicles sold years ago. Older customers can purchase the "Lincoln Incontinental." Edited January 12, 2011 by LincolnV 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 This thought that Continental or Versailles will conjure up negative connotations in new car buyers minds is just plain absurd, enough time has lapsed for those buyers to look at those vehicle names with open minds and judge the new vehicles fairly. I care for the Zeypher or Versailles name is just horrible...Any other good names out there besides the Continental that have been used in past with Lincoln? Someone suggested Atlantic, which I think has a nice ring to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Probably find new names offer more connection with buyers, you may be able to squeeze Continental but none of the older name probably fit on newer vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I care for the Zeypher or Versailles name is just horrible...Any other good names out there besides the Continental that have been used in past with Lincoln? Someone suggested Atlantic, which I think has a nice ring to it. Aviator, Premier, Mark series, Capri, Cosmopolitan, Sentinel (concept) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingBender Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 (edited) Future small crossover should be Viagra Oh dear. Edited January 12, 2011 by WingBender Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Lincoln Levitar might be a little more discreet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Here's the Viagra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richy Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I agree with Timmm55. I think his examples of Taurus and especially Hyundai prove that people can forget negative connotations to a degree if the new car is good enough. Now, I did say "to a degree". I don't think Hyundai would ever be foolish enough to come out with another car called the Pony. Some memories do last that long. Just like the name Edsel had such a bad connotation for decades. I'm in my late 40's and even I remember that growing up. I don't think you'll ever see that name revisited even thought it's been like 50 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 What? No pictures of Bob Lutz screaming "BMW Fighter"!!!??!?!?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZanatWork Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 If Lincoln's supposed to enjoy the rare air of BMW and Lexus, they need to get some RWD chassis work done...which seems unlikely with the Falcon going AWD next time 'round. Only Audi even pretends to play at the height of luxury car status with FWD-based architecture, and the S8 is almost always losing points on the quality of its driving experience. Mullaly had a Lexus LS430 when he joined Ford...maybe someone should explain how RWD helped make that car what it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 What? No pictures of Bob Lutz screaming "BMW Fighter"!!!??!?!?! What BMW and Lexus have that Mulally wants is respect. There's a difference between saying, 'We want our brand to have that kind of respect' and saying, 'Buick is our Lexus fighter and Cadillac is our BMW fighter. Saturn is our import fighter.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Mulally and Ford have to change Lincoln's image to one that BELONGS in that company, and stop being a "wanna be but I don't really belong here but I'm competing" brand. ^^^^ To me that's the problem with GM brands, they undermine their own image. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 What BMW and Lexus have that Mulally wants is respect. There's a difference between saying, 'We want our brand to have that kind of respect' and saying, 'Buick is our Lexus fighter and Cadillac is our BMW fighter. Saturn is our import fighter.' sidenote...3, yes, 3 Lexus Rs300's last night in the HOV lane had either one or both tailights blown....shades of VW.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 sidenote...3, yes, 3 Lexus Rs300's last night in the HOV lane had either one or both tailights blown....shades of VW.... IMHO, except for headlights, all the lights in a Lincoln should be LED or OLED or somesuch long-life tech. Looks like Lincolns will get active suspension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
30 OTT 6 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 What? No pictures of Bob Lutz screaming "BMW Fighter"!!!??!?!?! Maximum Bob was on Autoline Afterhours last Thursday (great episode). He said that Pontiac was set to become GM's RWD division. He also said that Pontiac had plans for a BMW 3-Series sized RWD car with a GDIT 4 cylinder engine. That would have been the kind of car I'd like to own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 All of those cars evaporated without the foundation of a stable well run GM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Those cars were evidence that there was *not* a stable well run GM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 (edited) Those cars were evidence that there was *not* a stable well run GM. Regardless of what Lutz says now, I chose to believe they were never going to eventuate. While he had his moment in the sun with Zeta, car after car was canceled when Gm execs realized that RWD wouldn't cover the products and snow belt driving characteristics required by customers. That was why Zeta was dead in the water but GM also did nothing about replacement FWD vehicles that still havent been delivered for Lucerne and Impala.... 4 years and counting is a goddam joke. I don't know what the environment for developing product was like at GMNA but looking form the outside it seemed like ther was no sound product plan based on proper market research, either that or Lutz was overruling good judgment at every turn to install his pet projects. I believe he actually did more to derail GM and send them broke than any other exec. It was his anti-planning that put GM in limbo. Edited January 13, 2011 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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