Stray Kat Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 (edited) Did anyone else see Diesel Power magazine's test of the 6.7 Power Stroke against the latest Duramax. To summarize it was a pulling test up a grade with an 11,000 pound payload on a gooseneck trailer. I hate to say it but the Duramax out performed the Power Stroke in this test by a strong margin. It was hard to believe while I was reading so I checked back and sure enough it was the 400hp upgraded version of the Power Stroke. In fact the results were exactly opposite of the side by side tests that appear on the Ford website. Somethin's fishey here, in the article it states that Ford would not provide a vehicle for the test so GM stepped up and purchased the Ford and Chevy right off of dealer lots for the test. Hmmm something is wrong with this picture. I'd like to see both trucks on a chassis dyno to see what's up. Thoughts? Edited January 13, 2011 by Stray Kat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
focus05 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Did anyone else see Diesel Power magazine's test of the 6.7 Power Stroke against the latest Duramax. To summarize it was a pulling test up a grade with an 11,000 pound payload on a gooseneck trailer. I hate to say it but the Duramax out performed the Power Stroke in this test by a strong margin. It was hard to believe while I was reading so I checked back and sure enough it was the 400hp upgraded version of the Power Stroke. In fact the results were exactly opposite of the side by side tests that appear on the Ford website. Somethin's fishey here, in the article it states that Ford would not provide a vehicle for the test so GM stepped up and purchased the Ford and Chevy right off of dealer lots for the test. Hmmm something is wrong with this picture. I'd like to see both trucks on a chassis dyno to see what's up. Thoughts? Is this the test at altitude? I thought it had to do with the turbo configuration on the engines - the Duramax would always outperform at altitude. Sort of like putting the ecoboost MKS at altitude against the Genesis or some other NA car (well, maybe not that bad since there's at least a turbo set up on the PS). That said, Ford needed a good smack - here's hoping they take the licking and create a better truck/powertrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stray Kat Posted January 13, 2011 Author Share Posted January 13, 2011 Don't have the copy here to check what altitude the test was performed at. The trucks seemed to be equally spec'd out. Same rear gear same body config etc. The Ford was 200 pounds heavier which seems pretty insignificant when talking about vehicles this large. Like I said I'd like to see what those trucks were putting out at the rear wheels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 There was a thread about this a couple of weeks ago but I can't find it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdp1123 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 (edited) There was a thread about this a couple of weeks ago but I can't find it now. I think it was due to the difference in turbo setup. The isuzu in the chevy has variable vane. The powerstroke inhouse deisel has a variable double compressor wheel not sure why this would be better obviously not. wiki ford 6.7 specs=Honeywell’s single-sequential turbocharger features an industry-first double-sided compressor wheel mounted on a single shaft. Combines the benefits of a small turbocharger (faster response) and a large turbocharger (ability to compress and force more air into the engine for more power) in one unit.[3] Edited January 13, 2011 by jdp1123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Every time I see "Duramax", i can't help but thinking it's some sort of feminine hygiene product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Every time I see "Duramax", i can't help but thinking it's some sort of feminine hygiene product. I think it sounds like an erectile dysfunction product. However, I suppose Powerstroke and Cummins do as well..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atvman Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 GM has had 10 years to get the Duramax to the level it's at, give Ford a little time to nail everything down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettech Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 GM has had 10 years to get the Duramax to the level it's at, give Ford a little time to nail everything down. And the world will standstill for Ford to catch up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atvman Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 And the world will standstill for Ford to catch up. Obviously not, but the basic bones of the 6.7L PSD are better than those of the Duramax. It just needs a little fine tuning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Don't have the copy here to check what altitude the test was performed at. The trucks seemed to be equally spec'd out. Same rear gear same body config etc. The Ford was 200 pounds heavier which seems pretty insignificant when talking about vehicles this large. Like I said I'd like to see what those trucks were putting out at the rear wheels. I think it was due to the difference in turbo setup. The isuzu in the chevy has variable vane. The powerstroke inhouse deisel has a variable double compressor wheel not sure why this would be better obviously not. wiki ford 6.7 specs=Honeywell’s single-sequential turbocharger features an industry-first double-sided compressor wheel mounted on a single shaft. Combines the benefits of a small turbocharger (faster response) and a large turbocharger (ability to compress and force more air into the engine for more power) in one unit.[3] The two trucks are pretty evenly matched. The turbo design on the Duramax does gives it an advantage in high altitudes. GM did the test in the Rockies to exploit this advantage. Now GM can brag that their lesser powerful truck outperforms Ford's so called more powerful truck. Had it been done anywhere else, it probably would have been a virtual tie. Apparently the buying public likes the Ford Super Duty better as out sells the GM HD's by a large margin. Nothing more to see here, move on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8-X Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 (edited) Did this article use the data provide by Mike Levine with pickuptrucks.com on their Rumble in the Rockies feature? The GM pulled better on inclines as well as held gear and braking better on declines. It's clearly superior as of today, due to the fine tuning GM has done over the years. Give Ford some time to learn the quirks of the new SD & PSD to find the right balance. Either way, the wrapper that the Duramax/Allison come in is well below the quality of the SD, which is a huge selling point. The Ram Cummins 6.7L is nice too (not as nice as the old 5.9L IMO), but the truck around the diesel is a huge issue. I'm for the overall truck. I'll take a little more pulling time and the need for a little more brake application/down shifting to get the best quality truck. Edited January 13, 2011 by V8-X Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Did this article use the data provide by Mike Levine with pickuptrucks.com on their Rumble in the Rockies feature? The GM pulled better on inclines as well as held gear and braking better on declines. It's clearly superior as of today, due to the fine tuning GM has done over the years. Give Ford some time to learn the quirks of the new SD & PSD to find the right balance. Either way, the wrapper that the Duramax/Allison come in is well below the quality of the SD, which is a huge selling point. The Ram Cummins 6.7L is nice too (not as nice as the old 5.9L IMO), but the truck around the diesel is a huge issue. I'm for the overall truck. I'll take a little more pulling time and the need for a little more brake application/down shifting to get the best quality truck. +1 Chevy won the battle, but Ford is winning the war! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extreme4x4 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Ford holds 52% of the HD market. Dodge holds 20%, and GM holds 28% between 2 brands. Dodge has been moving up on GM, but noone is threatening Ford. I think what this means................. even today................. is the entire package means more than a few tenths of a second when racing. Also, as the GM trucks (not powertrains) have always been far below the SD's......................... but the powertrains have been far ahead for years................... straight performance is not the major buying criteria for a HD truck. Ford will get there with the new PS. The Duramax is at the end of its lifespan (read, tapped out), and a new Duramax will will be coming in the next few years. However, if I have to watch one more "Max and Al" commercial, making fun of the baby (PS), I think I will puke. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) They really have to send this truck back to the drawing board, this is one product where reputation is everything and being so severely outclassed by GM is going to cost them lots of sales, especially with that extremely garish fascia which now looks even more ridiculous now that it's the class wimp. Edited January 14, 2011 by BORG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Versa-Tech Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I don't see anything good about these results. GM beat Ford in a towing test at high altitude. Moving along... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 They really have to send this truck back to the drawing board, this is one product where reputation is everything and being so severely outclassed by GM is going to cost them lots of sales, especially with that extremely garish fascia which now looks even more ridiculous now that it's the class wimp. Ford holds 52% of the HD market. Dodge holds 20% of the HD market. Chevrolet + GMC holds 28% of the HD market. Ford's SD is preferred by the majority of the market, that's not changing in the near future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettech Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Motor Trend show the Chevy/GMC HD beating the SD in most test for the Truck of the Year Award. Both gas and diesel engines trucks where tested at the Nissan Arizona Test Center near Phoenix, AZ. Elevation is app 1260 ft The Chevy/GMC diesel beat the SD in every acceleration and brake test. The test were conducted with a empty bed, loaded payload, and pulling a 12000 lb trailer. NOTE: the SD had a 3406 lb payload vs 3388 payload for the Chevy/GMC. The Chevy/GMC diesel also had better MPG in each of the test than the SD. MT test does seem to be the opposite of what Ford has on their web site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Motor Trend show the Chevy/GMC HD beating the SD in most test for the Truck of the Year Award. Both gas and diesel engines trucks where tested at the Nissan Arizona Test Center near Phoenix, AZ. Elevation is app 1260 ft The Chevy/GMC diesel beat the SD in every acceleration and brake test. The test were conducted with a empty bed, loaded payload, and pulling a 12000 lb trailer. NOTE: the SD had a 3406 lb payload vs 3388 payload for the Chevy/GMC. The Chevy/GMC diesel also had better MPG in each of the test than the SD. MT test does seem to be the opposite of what Ford has on their web site. Link? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goinbroke2 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Well the last time I was drag racing a fully loaded powerstroke at the mile high nationals, I thought "gee, if it was only a tenth quicker I could of won" :shades: Cause...you know....the quickest truck is obviously best....right..... How the hell did we ever survive with f-650/750 dump trucks and 300 6 cyl's? 230hp cummins in a 74 autocar, 5&4. we got a 300 big cam cummins and thought it was the end-all and be-all. Now pick ups have 400hp/800tq and think THAT'S not enough? Step away from the internet racers and actually drive the truck, in the real world the dodge would be right there with the ford and gm. All three would be doing 60mph following each other. One might be to the floor and another at 15/16th. Really, who frikken cares? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Really, who frikken cares? Its all adveristing and bragging rights....to try and win sales Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettech Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I care.. and I buy 1 ton trucks. If Ford is posting information on their site that is disputed by several independent raters.... For the people that are unable to search Motor Trend for the data.Motor Trend:reading: I originally gleaned the data from the Jan 2011 issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I care.. and I buy 1 ton trucks. If Ford is posting information on their site that is disputed by several independent raters.... For the people that are unable to search Motor Trend for the data.Motor Trend:reading: I originally gleaned the data from the Jan 2011 issue. Ford's information is probably based on tests under conditions that skewed the "facts" in their favor. This "showdown in the Rockies" was GM's test under conditions that also skewed the "facts" in their favor. Who knows what the conditions were for Motor Trend's test, and I really don't care. When it comes to one ton trucks, truth is the Ford, GM and Dodge are all pretty damn close. Maybe the GM is just that much better, big deal. Fan boys will buy their favorite brand, internet racers will brag about the the one with the best numbers (but they all probably drive 10 year old Civics with fart can exhaust) and people that do research away from the drag strip apparently, based on sales numbers, like the Ford Super Duty best. I know Ford and the others will keep working to out do each other and in the end the consumer wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 If Ford is posting information on their site that is disputed by several independent raters.... Call a lawyer or shut up. For the people that are unable You got any explanation why we should do your leg work for you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 (edited) The only test that matters is satisfied customers, Ford's SD is outsells GM HD by nearly two to one. and, if SD isn't a better truck then there must be some other reason people don't want to buy GM...... A plausible reason escapes me as to why truck buyers would be so offended to enter a GM dealership... Edited January 15, 2011 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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