What's on the Horizon: Future Ford/Lincoln products

[630land]

Here's some that I "heard" about.

 

Return of Pinto, Elite, Granada, LTD II, and Tempo as 'retro-tribute' cars,

Re-boot of Edsel brand for those that love badge engineering and styling trivia.

Landau vinyl tops, opera windows, and fake spare tire hump standard on all new Lincolns, for that classic look.

Ride control tuned for 'marshmellow setting' since people don't like road feel anymore.

[Hugh]

Great, no road feel. Can I dial a 'Sea State' setting on the road so I can gack on my windshield? Nice...

[mustang84isu]

Lincoln "Super Duty" (possible)

"A Lincoln-badged Super Duty would likely be the most luxurious and expensive pickup in Ford’s truck lineup. The idea is said to be based on the three-quarter-ton F-250 with exterior sheet metal that would be significantly different from the current Super Duty. The interior would also be unique, highlighted by a stretched cab similar to the Ram 3500 Mega Cab configuration. Only a single-rear-wheel version of the truck would be available."

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2010/10/sources-say-lincoln-considering-new-luxury-pickup-truck.html

 

This is incredibly dumb if true, but I highly doubt Ford will make this same mistake for a third time. Lincoln never has and never will be associated with trucks.

 

I really hope Ford has more in the works for Lincoln through 2014 than what we know. Refreshes and MCE's of the current Ford corporate cousins aren't going to set sales on fire nor reinvent the Lincoln brand. I think this new-found focus on C-segment vehicles for Lincoln is not going to take off they way they expect. Moving forward luxury manufacturers will power more of their vehicles with sophisticated hybrid-electric systems that won't force luxury buyers to compromise size or performance. Lincoln should be looking into how to make the MKS lighter and achieve world-class MPG numbers instead of messing around with compacts that will probably end up selling 1000/month and would be better suited under the Ford brand.

Edited February 26, 2011 by mustang84isu

[Kris Kolman]

This is what I would like to see:

 

MKC Compact - 5 door hatch/coupe based on the Focus

- 172 in Long, 72 in Wide & powered by 2.0L Ecoboost and Hybrid

 

MKZ Midsized Sedan - Sedan based on Fusion/Mondeo

- 190 in Long, 74 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and Hybrid

 

MKX Midsized SUV - 5 seat SUV based on Edge

- 188 in Long, 76 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 3.7L Ecoboost

 

MKT Large MPV - 6 seat MPV based on new Galaxy minivan (itself based on Taurus)

- 198 in Long, 76 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 3.7L Ecoboost

 

MKS Large Sedan - Sedan based on Aussi Falcon

- 196 in Long, 76 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 5.0L V8

 

MKN Large SUV - 7 seat SUV based on Aussi Territory

- 196 in Long, 78 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 5.0L V8

Edited February 26, 2011 by Kris Kolman

[Edstock]

Lincoln should be looking into how to make the MKS lighter and achieve world-class MPG numbers

Of course, you are aware that Ford is on a program to reduce the weight of all of its products?

[atvman]

I heard a rumor that Ford was working on a higher displacement Coyote with a taller deck, perhaps in the 5.8L (351ci) range. Any substance to that?

[Hugh]

Under the circumstances, a loss of 100 lbs (Explorer), or a gain of 1 mpg (Duratec 30 vs. Duratec 35) are small victories but a good step in the right direction.

[2b2]

This is what I would like to see:

 

MKC Compact - 5 door hatch/coupe based on the Focus

- 172 in Long, 72 in Wide & powered by 2.0L Ecoboost and Hybrid

 

MKZ Midsized Sedan - Sedan based on Fusion/Mondeo

- 190 in Long, 74 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and Hybrid

 

MKX Midsized SUV - 5 seat SUV based on Edge

- 188 in Long, 76 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 3.7L Ecoboost

 

MKT Large MPV - 6 seat MPV based on new Galaxy minivan (itself based on Taurus)

- 198 in Long, 76 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 3.7L Ecoboost

 

MKS Large Sedan - Sedan based on Aussi Falcon

- 196 in Long, 76 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 5.0L V8

 

MKN Large SUV - 7 seat SUV based on Aussi Territory

- 196 in Long, 78 in Wide, & powered by 3.7L V6 and 5.0L V8

no KuGa(MKG)??

 

 

Of course, you are aware that Ford is on a program to reduce the weight of all of its products?

- hope Ford's diet is very effective

- hope Lincoln gets alloy/c.f./whatever parts&body panels way beyond what Ford gets ... luxury isn't just about Bridge of Weir leather ^ real wood (imho)

 

 

&

speculation;

I made a new chart of possible/ideal Lincoln engines/models for 2012

&

am wondering if Lincoln could someday be ALL EB?

here's an old chart of actual&possible HP for various EB's

note: I've NEVER heard anything from a Ford person about a 2.5EB

tho Barb Samardzich DID mention a 2.7v6 ONCE and Media.Ford.com did say Lincoln was getting a unique engine at least ONCE

click for bigger

 

^^ just for discussion ^^

Edited February 27, 2011 by 2b2

[FordBuyer]

@SportTrac... Didn't they kill the SportTrac because they couldn't find a market for it... It fails as an SUV and fails as a truck... It was a hybrid of the wrong kind.

 

@Lincoln Explorer... I thought Lincoln was supposed to get its own identity with less Ford spin-offs. Did the Aviator sell well enough to justify another one?

 

@Lincoln SuperDuty... Why would they do this? An optioned-out SD is already $60k+; Lincoln is a luxury brand.

 

@Lincoln Mark... They tried this three times already and failed, in my opinion, all three times. Besides, wasn't the philosophy behind the F-150 Platinum trim-line was that it would provide Lincoln luxury w/Ford's nameplate.

 

I'm starting to loose faith in Ford's ability to revitalize Lincoln. I just don't find their products appealing with awkward styling and average performance. It seems their only saving grace is good technology that still doesn't make it a must have.

 

Being a 23 year old, there is no way I would consider a Lincoln product after I finish college. I don't want to be seen in the same hearse that Grandpa Rivers down the street drives

 

Good post. Yep, more of the same is not going to get it done. What a waste of resources coming up with more McNuggets like Explorer and Escape Lincoln versions. Ford needs to come out with a way of making Lincoln unique or forget it. I feel so sorry for Lincoln dealers. I would rather see Lincoln have only two or so unique vehicles than see more McNuggets with premium leather and heated and cooled seats. I understand that Lincoln dealers need something more short term to keep going, but long term this plan leads to more of the same......7 vehicles selling in the 500-2,000/month range rather than four. Big deal. By the time these new McNuggets hit dealerships, Lincoln will barely be a blip on radar screen if that. 2011 and '12 are going to be even more brutal than 2010 which was bad enough.

[Harley Lover]

Good post. Yep, more of the same is not going to get it done. What a waste of resources coming up with more McNuggets like Explorer and Escape Lincoln versions. Ford needs to come out with a way of making Lincoln unique or forget it. I feel so sorry for Lincoln dealers. I would rather see Lincoln have only two or so unique vehicles than see more McNuggets with premium leather and heated and cooled seats. I understand that Lincoln dealers need something more short term to keep going, but long term this plan leads to more of the same......7 vehicles selling in the 500-2,000/month range rather than four. Big deal. By the time these new McNuggets hit dealerships, Lincoln will barely be a blip on radar screen if that. 2011 and '12 are going to be even more brutal than 2010 which was bad enough.

Ford has already stated that future Lincolns will have bespoke bodywork. No one call tell that the Flex and MKT share a chassis because the bodywork is unique for both. That will be the norm going forward with each new vehicle (note I'm leaving out refreshes, as obviously the sheet metal won't change for those). So therefore we should expect an Escape-based Lincoln to have unique sheet metal in addition to all the upgraded content and hopefully engines.

 

I really think Ford has some great ideas for differentiating Lincoln with technology (and I don't mean limited to electronics). Ford has access to all sorts of capabilities on a global basis; if Ford can offer DCT in a Focus and Fiesta, imagine what they might be willing to offer at Lincoln's price point!

[jpd80]

Good post. Yep, more of the same is not going to get it done. What a waste of resources coming up with more McNuggets like Explorer and Escape Lincoln versions. Ford needs to come out with a way of making Lincoln unique or forget it. I feel so sorry for Lincoln dealers. I would rather see Lincoln have only two or so unique vehicles than see more McNuggets with premium leather and heated and cooled seats. I understand that Lincoln dealers need something more short term to keep going, but long term this plan leads to more of the same......7 vehicles selling in the 500-2,000/month range rather than four. Big deal. By the time these new McNuggets hit dealerships, Lincoln will barely be a blip on radar screen if that. 2011 and '12 are going to be even more brutal than 2010 which was bad enough.

 

Why on earth would Ford want to turn Lincoln into another Jaguar Land Rover after selling them?

 

No, Ford doesn't want high budget luxury brands and unique cars - been there done that and it doesn't work,

they take more in infrastructure development costs than they return.

Edited February 27, 2011 by jpd80

[rmc523]

This is incredibly dumb if true, but I highly doubt Ford will make this same mistake for a third time. Lincoln never has and never will be associated with trucks.

 

I really hope Ford has more in the works for Lincoln through 2014 than what we know. Refreshes and MCE's of the current Ford corporate cousins aren't going to set sales on fire nor reinvent the Lincoln brand. I think this new-found focus on C-segment vehicles for Lincoln is not going to take off they way they expect. Moving forward luxury manufacturers will power more of their vehicles with sophisticated hybrid-electric systems that won't force luxury buyers to compromise size or performance. Lincoln should be looking into how to make the MKS lighter and achieve world-class MPG numbers instead of messing around with compacts that will probably end up selling 1000/month and would be better suited under the Ford brand.

 

That's why most other luxury brands (Mercedes, BMW, Lexus, Audi, etc) are continually introducing smaller and smaller vehicles, right?

 

Good post. Yep, more of the same is not going to get it done. What a waste of resources coming up with more McNuggets like Explorer and Escape Lincoln versions. Ford needs to come out with a way of making Lincoln unique or forget it. I feel so sorry for Lincoln dealers. I would rather see Lincoln have only two or so unique vehicles than see more McNuggets with premium leather and heated and cooled seats. I understand that Lincoln dealers need something more short term to keep going, but long term this plan leads to more of the same......7 vehicles selling in the 500-2,000/month range rather than four. Big deal. By the time these new McNuggets hit dealerships, Lincoln will barely be a blip on radar screen if that. 2011 and '12 are going to be even more brutal than 2010 which was bad enough.

 

FB, you're criticizing vehicles you've not even seen yet, assuming they'll be nothing but rebadges. What about a vehicle like the MKT makes you think that future Lincoln products will be rebadges?

[Kris Kolman]

no KuGa(MKG)??

 

Not sold yet on a Lincoln version of the Escape/Kuga... I'm getting warmed up to a car like the C-Concept based off the 5-door Focus, or maybe the smaller C-Max. I can see a social media, urban focused marketing campain being quite successful if the product is worthy. I see the marketing working better if everything was focused on a single "small car revolution" not two. Limited resources and lack of market penetration would point me to putting all the effort into 1 great car. Else you're liable to end up with two so-so cars that fail to get the market penetration required to be sustainable.

 

But then I'm biased and can't stand the tiny useless crossovers... To me an AWD C-Max or Focus wagon seems far more interesting. Of course we don't get the wagon, and AWD doesn't seem to be in the cards for any C-Class cars other than the Escape/Kuga.

[2b2]

...coming up with more McNuggets** like Explorer and Escape Lincoln versions. Ford needs to come out with a way of making Lincoln unique or forget it...

...I would rather see Lincoln have only two or so unique vehicles than see more McNuggets with premium leather and heated and cooled seats...

** excellent word play

Ford has already stated that future Lincolns will have bespoke bodywork...

I'm in favor of keeping super-McNuggets** on the menu

but also offering lobster & steak etc:

Continental + Mustang-architecture coupecabrio & sportsedan

 

hopefully all of them will have bodywork that will be at least partly alloy/c.f./etc

They KNOW how to do it cough*Jaguar*cough

 

** mmmmm ... aluminIum McNuggets :drool:

 

 

Why on earth would Ford want to turn Lincoln into another Jaguar Land Rover after selling them?

 

No, Ford doesn't want high budget luxury brands and unique cars - been there done that and it doesn't work,

they take more in infrastructure development costs than they return.

I agree that FoMoCo shouldn't venture into the over-$100k area

but

- anything up to that is fair game

&

- the GRwdP is the way to go imho (ie mostly/partly Falcon-based architecture)

[Kris Kolman]

I think Ford is headed for a bad mistake by abandoning any and all RWD platforms as has been rumored... It puts the Mustang, the company's icon, in a very bad position and I believe it limits Lincoln greatly. An all FWD/AWD lineup has not gotten any luxury market penetration and likely never will. Doubt that? Tell me how well Volvo and Acura do? Audi doesn't apply because it uses a unique all AWD lineup with a longitudinal engine layout which looks RWD. How many so-so Continental/MKS critical and sale responses does Ford need to see that their large sedan needs to be moved to RWD. Also Ford needs to recognize that in order to get a good return on investment on Mustang it needs to be able to have platform mates... This isn’t an expensive $50k sports car, but affordable car that will wither on the vine if left to pay for all of its own development . I think that platform mate should be the Falcon/Territory in Australia and a Lincoln sedan/SUV twin to be built here. What I'd like to see is:

 

Falcon and Territory would each grow slightly in size to 116in Wheelbase, 76in Wide, and 196in Long (benchmarked off the Commodore)

A significantly modified version of that platform would be the new Mustang with 110in Wheelbase, 76in Width, and 188in Long

Lincoln would then take the Falcon and Territory and add on bespoke interior and exterior

All will be compatible with the 3.2L TDI, 3.7L V6, 3.7L Ecoboost, and 5.0L V8

 

Oh ya... The Falcon Ute would still be there with a 6in Wheelbase & Length strech... Those demensions look about right for a Lincoln flagship. But that would come later.

 

To be honest I've driven a Falcon on vacation, loved the damn thing, and have been wishing Ford NA to bring it here for years... So it seems a tragedy to replace it with the bland D3.

Edited February 28, 2011 by Kris Kolman

[rmc523]

Not sold yet on a Lincoln version of the Escape/Kuga... I'm getting warmed up to a car like the C-Concept based off the 5-door Focus, or maybe the smaller C-Max. I can see a social media, urban focused marketing campain being quite successful if the product is worthy. I see the marketing working better if everything was focused on a single "small car revolution" not two. Limited resources and lack of market penetration would point me to putting all the effort into 1 great car. Else you're liable to end up with two so-so cars that fail to get the market penetration required to be sustainable.

 

But then I'm biased and can't stand the tiny useless crossovers... To me an AWD C-Max or Focus wagon seems far more interesting. Of course we don't get the wagon, and AWD doesn't seem to be in the cards for any C-Class cars other than the Escape/Kuga.

 

Hmm, for me it's the other way - I completely get the case for an MKKuga, but am not sold on the C-concept yet.

 

Audi doesn't apply because it uses a unique all AWD lineup with a longitudinal engine layout which looks RWD.

 

Audi definitely does NOT have an all AWD lineup. AWD/Quattro may be available on just about the entire lineup, but it's definitely not standard on the whole range.

[wish4newstang]

Why on earth would Ford want to turn Lincoln into another Jaguar Land Rover after selling them?

 

No, Ford doesn't want high budget luxury brands and unique cars - been there done that and it doesn't work,

they take more in infrastructure development costs than they return.

 

 

Then why keep lincoln and kill mercury? maybe, just maybe ford is not real sure what direction to take lincoln. do they compete against cadillac. or lexus? quite different markets, i think and rebadging f150 and escapes as licolns, is not the answer.

[PREMiERdrum]

Then why keep lincoln and kill mercury? maybe, just maybe ford is not real sure what direction to take lincoln. do they compete against cadillac. or lexus? quite different markets, i think and rebadging f150 and escapes as licolns, is not the answer.

 

And if the MKT/Flex program is any indication, they aren't interested in rebadging anything.

 

It looks like they're going more towards the Lexus model, which is good. Cadillac is a mess and shouldn't be copied by anybody looking for success.

[wish4newstang]

And if the MKT/Flex program is any indication, they aren't interested in rebadging anything.

 

It looks like they're going more towards the Lexus model, which is good. Cadillac is a mess and shouldn't be copied by anybody looking for success.

 

 

i agree to a certain extent, however, many shoppers still cross shop cadillac and lincoln. i want people to think of lincoln and lexus or acura in the same vain. by the way, we live in akron right now, but lived in columbus for quite awhile, lived in new albany.

[PREMiERdrum]

i agree to a certain extent, however, many shoppers still cross shop cadillac and lincoln. i want people to think of lincoln and lexus or acura in the same vain. by the way, we live in akron right now, but lived in columbus for quite awhile, lived in new albany.

NIce! We're in Blacklick, my wife works in New Albany.

 

I'm confident in the will to bring Lincoln to its full potential. The new MKX is easily best in class, and that was just an MCE that is still chained to the Edge's greenhouse until the full redesign.

 

The next MKZ is supposed to be quite a looker, as is the next MKS (which will also ride on the MKT's 5" longer wheelbase, further separating it from the Taurus). I'm optimistic that the C-segment crossover will be done well, and there's quite a bit of potential there in a segment that could explode. The Navigator is getting an update and new engines shortly, though the next gen is apparently in jeopardy. The MKT, which in itself is a great effort if you can ignore the awful front and rear ends, is set to get a freshening soon. And, keep in mind, all of this was in the works before they hired a new dedicated design boss for Lincoln.

[ds91776]

How are Lexus and Cadillac in different markets? They are both luxury makes. True Lexus' success is largely based on the RX and ES....but so what? They are still luxury products.

[papilgee4evaeva]

Audi definitely does NOT have an all AWD lineup. AWD/Quattro may be available on just about the entire lineup, but it's definitely not standard on the whole range.

Correct.

[PREMiERdrum]

How are Lexus and Cadillac in different markets? They are both luxury makes. True Lexus' success is largely based on the RX and ES....but so what? They are still luxury products.

 

Approach to the market might be a better way to look at it... they're all "luxury" products (which is a vague descriptor, that could range from a Hyundai Genesis to a Maybach), but they go about things very differently. There's been much fighting about whose business model Lincoln should follow.

[2b2]

^ imho the Luxury market requires fine distinctions

so Audi - Lexus - Cadillac COULD seem nearly completely different to Luxury buyers

and so must Lincoln

 

(this thread is 'cooking' right now...

:D

gonna post what I got so I'm not left behind :eek:)

 

 

I think Ford is headed for a bad mistake by abandoning any and all RWD platforms as has been rumored...

...How many so-so Continental/MKS...

...Mustang it needs to be able to have platform mates... This isn’t an expensive $50k sports car...

 

...Falcon and Territory would each grow slightly in size to 116in Wheelbase, 76in Wide, and 196in Long...

- I refuse to believe that the GRwdP is dead - call it my blind spot.

- I will NEVER sanction "Continental" on a F-AWD (unless perhaps it's hydrogen powered)

- afaik (some) Mustang prices EXCEED $50k already & have for some time

- afaik Falcon, if it survives, will shrink slightly THO what you wrote sounds just like my Continental/Fairlane

& from what I've read, there will/might be 2 Rwd platforms sharing one architecture:

-- Mustang and Lincoln 3-series-alternatives; coupecabrio & sportsedan

-- GRwdP Continental (& possibly another) and the Falcon (& possibly the Fairlane) and maybe a Tbird too

(the Falcon imho Can Be "over-built" to suit AU's rugged requirements)

&

(yes, there's a good deal of wishful thinking in ^ that)

 

I'm very much in favor of BOTH a MKG(KuGa) CUVlet and Focus/GCM-based MKE sporty sedan (NOT the "C"concept abomination)

esp when considering Lincoln going GLOBAL eventually

afaik the C-segment is the main one outside the U.S. ... currently

&

altho we can always draw comparisons

I hope Lincoln finds a way to carve out its own identity

(yeah...I imagine Audi+Lexus primarily

but taken to the extent that purchasing MB or BMW seems foolish/shallow!!

Acura is as good as dead right now & too low-rent imho)

 

 

Then why keep lincoln and kill mercury?...

that (of course IMHO is a sore point) is unknowable

 

...I'm confident in

the will to bring Lincoln to its full potential...

I really REALLY hope you're right, PREMiERdrum!

[Kris Kolman]

"Luxury" is a wide market... It extends from Acura up to Rolls... Lincoln needs to find its place in the market. For that I would bench mark Audi and Lexus, all but the top end and sports car adventures... That means:

 

Compact - A3 & CT

Midsized - ES

Compact Executive - A4 & IS

Executive - A6 & GS

Compact Crossover - Q5

Midsized Crossover - RX

Fullsized Crossover - Q7

Midsized SUV - GX

Fullsized SUV - LX

 

As for the Aussi RWD playform... I don't think the Falcon should shrink. It needs to show differentiation from the Mondeo/Focus which is being established as the midsized car offering in Australia. Mondeo/Focus is right in the midsized wheelhouse at 190 in and 74 in... They will merge platforms soon, but will be esentially be he same size. Making me think a Falcon at 6in longer and 2in wider is perfect... Little strech for better shoulder and leg room to differentiate it as the large sedan offering. RWD and traditional Aussi powerplants (V6, turbo V6, and V8) are a must as are the Territory SUV and Ute.