Why have an ignition key?

[RangerM]

Not really a complaint, but I've been noticing that no matter how I turn the key of my F150, the starter/engine responds the same. The starter turns, the engine starts, regardless of how long I have the key turned to the start position. I can just do a quick key turn (like less than a second), and the behavior is the same, which mimics what a start button would do.

 

I don't have an upper echelon F150, but do they have a start button as opposed to a turn-key switch?

 

Does the key actually do anything other than "boot up" the truck?

[EBFlex]

Not really a complaint, but I've been noticing that no matter how I turn the key of my F150, the starter/engine responds the same. The starter turns, the engine starts, regardless of how long I have the key turned to the start position. I can just do a quick key turn (like less than a second), and the behavior is the same, which mimics what a start button would do.

 

I don't have an upper echelon F150, but do they have a start button as opposed to a turn-key switch?

 

Does the key actually do anything other than "boot up" the truck?

 

It's all electronic. My Ram doesn't even have a "key", just a plastic thing with a chip in it. Once the starter is engaged, the vehicle takes over until it's running.

 

Awesome sig quotes btw!

Edited September 1, 2013 by EBFlex

[RangerM]

It's all electronic. My Ram doesn't even have a "key", just a plastic thing with a chip in it. Once the starter is engaged, the vehicle takes over until it's running.

Assuming my truck is the same as your Ram, then I assume the key is there because Ford believes buyers expect it.

 

It also probably means that the key is chipped, meaning the option of getting a key made anywhere other than the dealer impossible. I inquired about getting a valet key and a separate fob, so I don't have to carry the large key-fob-in-one in my pocket. But the salesman I spoke with didn't think it was available.

[akirby]

The key is for security - it has to be the right one to turn the ignition. But once the starter is engaged the computer takes over. Prevents over cranking. To get push button start you also need intelligent access for security and that's expensive.

 

Many Ford vehicles started doing it a few years ago.

[EBFlex]

Assuming my truck is the same as your Ram, then I assume the key is there because Ford believes buyers expect it.

 

It also probably means that the key is chipped, meaning the option of getting a key made anywhere other than the dealer impossible. I inquired about getting a valet key and a separate fob, so I don't have to carry the large key-fob-in-one in my pocket. But the salesman I spoke with didn't think it was available.

 

Yeah, it's chipped...so a simple key costs $75 dollars versus $2.00. Brilliant idea to drum up cash on the automakers part.

 

The best part about my Ram is that in the plastic fob thing, there is an actual door key should the fob battery die. It's like reinventing the wheel with another circular device.

 

And the cost of replacements, at least on my Chrysler product, is such an issue, they tried to sell me a replacement plan for 5 years or so that would cover any lost keys when I bought it.. That's insane.

[StLght3]

My Avenger has that, it's a 2008, they call it Tip Start. Just a quick tap to the Start position will start the vehicle. I thought it was the coolest feature 5 years ago. I would get confused on my wife's car because it didn't have that and would just tap it to start the car and it wouldn't start.

 

But yes with all of this technology Ford is putting in their vehicles, you would think Push Button start would at least be an option if not standard on all vehicles or even at least a folding key.

[BrewfanGRB]

I am on of the approximately 2% of buyers that RTFM. When I read mine, I discovered the quick start feature (it has an actual name, but I'm forgetting what it is). And once I did, I loved it. Basically a 1 second flick to start and I can let go and let the car do the work. It just means less stress on all the parts because the computer is going to be better at starting the car than I am.

[jpd80]

Not really a complaint, but I've been noticing that no matter how I turn the key of my F150, the starter/engine responds the same. The starter turns, the engine starts, regardless of how long I have the key turned to the start position. I can just do a quick key turn (like less than a second), and the behavior is the same, which mimics what a start button would do.

 

I don't have an upper echelon F150, but do they have a start button as opposed to a turn-key switch?

 

Does the key actually do anything other than "boot up" the truck?

It's part of a new system that Ford has introduced, when you hit the starter button or key,

you don't have to keep it at start, the computer keeps cranking the engine until it fires.

 

The one advantage a key has is when or if you suffer a completely discharged battery

and you need to get into your vehicle, a key pad is useless then...

[RichardJensen]

Few tidbits:

 

The key has a chip in it to prevent theft. Starting the vehicle requires both the proper key shape AND the proper radio signal. If you don't have both, the engine won't turn over.

 

And for those who think this is a ploy by auto manufacturers to raise money, think about how rarely keys have to be replaced, and think about how your vehicle can no longer be stolen with a screwdriver and a slimjim. Or just a screwdriver if you were dumb enough to leave the windows down or the doors unlocked. And think about how you can buy replacement keys from a number of manufacturers, not just the car company.

 

Regarding the starter---basically, the vehicle start sequence is programmed now. To save wear and tear on the starter, and because the noise insulation on vehicles is such that it's easier than ever to forget your car is on, turning the key to 'start' does not directly actuate the starter solenoid. It runs a decision tree in the PCM before hitting the starter long enough to start the car.

 

And yes, this is basically, the same as having a start button. But as long as manufacturers can make more money by selling you an upgrade package that includes a component that is almost certainly cheaper to manufacture than a key cylinder, they'll continue to make keys standard.

[StLght3]

The scene is quickly shifting to phase out keys. Many manufacturers have started switching to push button start and its only a matter of time until it becomes the standard.

[fordtech1]

This one touch start is designed also to keep from customers half starting the engine. If you have ever let off the key on an older vehicle too soon, then it's harder to start the second attempt. Also, on the f150, it still has a column lock so the key actually mechanically actuates it also. I bet the next body style will have IA

[blazerdude20]

The one advantage a key has is when or if you suffer a completely discharged battery

and you need to get into your vehicle, a key pad is useless then...

Every IA key I've ever seen has a key built into the fob somewhere. The ford fobs pull apart to reveal a key to unlock the car. On the new fusions you stick the key into the bottom of the keyhole cover on the door handle, the cover slides off revealing a old school key hole.

 

Manufacturers have made sure to provide a secondary means to unlock and start the vehicle on most IA vehicles.

[fordtech1]

Every IA key I've ever seen has a key built into the fob somewhere. The ford fobs pull apart to reveal a key to unlock the car. On the new fusions you stick the key into the bottom of the keyhole cover on the door handle, the cover slides off revealing a old school key hole.

 

Exactly, that will get you in the vehicle. To start a IA vehicle, there is a slot or pocket to put the dead remote in so an antenna can read it.

Edited September 2, 2013 by fordtech1

[kenp77]

Few tidbits:

 

The key has a chip in it to prevent theft. Starting the vehicle requires both the proper key shape AND the proper radio signal. If you don't have both, the engine won't turn over.

 

And for those who think this is a ploy by auto manufacturers to raise money, think about how rarely keys have to be replaced, and think about how your vehicle can no longer be stolen with a screwdriver and a slimjim. Or just a screwdriver if you were dumb enough to leave the windows down or the doors unlocked. And think about how you can buy replacement keys from a number of manufacturers, not just the car company.

 

Regarding the starter---basically, the vehicle start sequence is programmed now. To save wear and tear on the starter, and because the noise insulation on vehicles is such that it's easier than ever to forget your car is on, turning the key to 'start' does not directly actuate the starter solenoid. It runs a decision tree in the PCM before hitting the starter long enough to start the car.

 

And yes, this is basically, the same as having a start button. But as long as manufacturers can make more money by selling you an upgrade package that includes a component that is almost certainly cheaper to manufacture than a key cylinder, they'll continue to make keys standard.Thanx for the tid bit Rich will try it in the morn. on my week old lariat, guess I did not read the manual close enough....

[SoonerLS]

Not really a complaint, but I've been noticing that no matter how I turn the key of my F150, the starter/engine responds the same. The starter turns, the engine starts, regardless of how long I have the key turned to the start position. I can just do a quick key turn (like less than a second), and the behavior is the same, which mimics what a start button would do.

I've gotten used to that feature of my STX over the last three months. Today, I got the LS out for a round trip of a few hundred miles; on two of the three times I had to start the car, the first try failed because I just bumped the starter like I do in the truck...

[kenp77]

I've gotten used to that feature of my STX over the last three months. Today, I got the LS out for a round trip of a few hundred miles; on two of the three times I had to start the car, the first try failed because I just bumped the starter like I do in the truck...

I went in and re read my 2013 f-150 starting instructions and it makes no mention of this feature, so I tried it today seems to work kind of hard to tell just hit key and let go starts immediately??

[StLght3]

Most if not all new vehicles will probably have this feature because it's electronic ignition now. It's all computer controlled - beware of SKYNET.

[BB390fe]

just wait till you are late leaving work to pick up your son at daycare... you get into the car turn the key and... the dash lights up and the anti theft blinks.

Guess who had to get a perfectly good car towed because the coding went bad on the key... and his irate wife had to pick up the 2 year old at daycare late.

[RichardJensen]

Meh. Life is complicated.

 

Would your wife have been less irate if you walked out and found out that a thief had started your car with a screwdriver pounded into the ignition cylinder?

[Deanh]

Meh. Life is complicated.

 

Would your wife have been less irate if you walked out and found out that a thief had started your car with a screwdriver pounded into the ignition cylinder?

mine was two alligator clips with a small piece of wire after he had busted the ignition, thanks to a wonderful Blue Merle Aussie barking after hearing the car start, my neighbors were entertained by a small white guy, wearing Spongebob boxers, brandishing a wooden Wilson Pro-Staff Tennis Racket chasing a huge Black Guy down the road, that made a Washington Redskin nose tackle look small...( true story barring utilizing Spongebob (( artistic licence for dramatic effect )) boxers, they were actually striped )

[RichardJensen]

Hmm. I would've assumed he had a weapon and called the gendarmes. After all, that's why I pay taxes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Of course, I also live in a town and in a location where the cops would've been on the scene PDQ.

Edited September 5, 2013 by RichardJensen

[Deanh]

Hmm. I would've assumed he had a weapon and called the gendarmes. After all, that's why I pay taxes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Of course, I also live in a town and in a location where the cops would've been on the scene PDQ.

didnt think at the time if he had a weapon, but a crazy white guy brandishing a wooden raquet is scary stuff......he was backing out of the Complexs parking structure when he caught a glimpse...funny, that car was stolen 3 times!!!!!!

[RichardJensen]

Ah. My thoughts are that life insurance is cheap, as compared to auto insurance, because the company only pays out once per policy holder....

 

But ultimately, that's why I think PATS keys are a good idea. Occasional snags aside.

 

 

 

Speaking of occasional snags, If memory serves, Pioneer taped a key to the underside of his Focus's steering column in order to get remote start to work without having to pay for an expensive PATS workaround.

Edited September 5, 2013 by RichardJensen

[EBFlex]

just wait till you are late leaving work to pick up your son at daycare... you get into the car turn the key and... the dash lights up and the anti theft blinks.

Guess who had to get a perfectly good car towed because the coding went bad on the key... and his irate wife had to pick up the 2 year old at daycare late.

 

Exactly. Why reinvent the wheel?

[papilgee4evaeva]

just wait till you are late leaving work to pick up your son at daycare... you get into the car turn the key and... the dash lights up and the anti theft blinks.

Guess who had to get a perfectly good car towed because the coding went bad on the key... and his irate wife had to pick up the 2 year old at daycare late.

 

That happened to my wife when she was getting ready to head to work one morning a couple of years ago. (Well, except for the daycare part.)

 

As I later found out, it was a common problem with 4th-gen (95-99) Maximas.