JasonM Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 (edited) http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20131028/AUTO01/310280081/Consumer-Reports-U-S-automakers-struggle-reliability?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE Ford basically unchanged from last year, up one spot. Cadillac fell 14 spots to one spot above Ford. Toyota Camry, RAV4, Prius V all removed from CR Recommended list due to poor safety ratings. Honda Accord V6 removed from CR Recommended list due to poor reliability. Nissan Altima removed due to poor reliability. "Ford Motor Co., General Motors Co. and Honda Motor Co. saw the reliability of many of their vehicles suffer because of unresponsive infotainment systems and faulty voice recognition commands, said Jake Fisher, director of auto testing at Consumer Reports, during a presentation at an Automotive Press Association event" CR's Director of auto testing "Fisher said Monday that most of Ford’s problems are software-related — instead of a nuts-and-bolts hardware issue — which means the Dearborn automaker should have an easier time fixing glitches." Edited October 28, 2013 by JasonM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 But Tesla = 9999999.9999999999999999999999999999!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBirdStangSkyliner Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 (edited) But Tesla = 9999999.9999999999999999999999999999!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The guy whose burnt must have had sticks and brats handy. Edited October 28, 2013 by TBirdStangSkyliner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydro Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 (edited) That's way softer than the article on Yahoo I read. They blasted the Cmax stating it was the worst hybrid on the market and don't let it discourage you from buying any hybrid from the other auto makers. It's Ford's problems not hybrids. Also, "the high-test scoring Tesla scored earned an avg in reliability, thus earned a recommended rating." Looks like GM's new campaign "no more crappy cars" is paying off. They ranked pretty damn high (9 & 17) Edited October 28, 2013 by Hydro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 mmmmmmmmmmmm.......BACON............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 I guess I shouldnt criticize CR too much, their magazine involving car Ratings are good for one thing.....lining the bottom of my Birds cage.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4d4evr-1 Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 (edited) That's way softer than the article on Yahoo I read. They blasted the Cmax stating it was the worst hybrid on the market and don't let it discourage you from buying any hybrid from the other auto makers. It's Ford's problems not hybrids. Also, "the high-test scoring Tesla scored earned an avg in reliability, thus earned a recommended rating." Looks like GM's new campaign "no more crappy cars" is paying off. They ranked pretty damn high (9 & 17) That is a frigging shame. My wife and I bought an SEL last November and we love it. Averaging over 47 MPG since purchase and we use MyFordTouch everyday without any problems. CR must have the most ignorant test drivers in the world as we are not test drivers and have had no problems with the car. ETA: my comments are not included by CR because I do not pay for their mag. Edited October 28, 2013 by 4d4evr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 (edited) That is a frigging shame. My wife and I bought an SEL last November and we love it. Averaging over 47 MPG since purchase and we use MyFordTouch everyday without any problems. CR must have the most ignorant test drivers in the world as we are not test drivers and have had no problems with the car. ETA: my comments are not included by CR because I do not pay for their mag. IRONIC ISNT IT...the individuals I have sold C-Maxs and C-Max Energis to, happen to be amoung the happiest, and a majority of them were conquest sales from vehicles certain rags recommend higher...ahem! Edited October 28, 2013 by Deanh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadManMoon Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Add another positive vote for the C-MAX! Over 5K miles, 44mpg average, easy to get 50+ mpg trips (short drives to/from stores kill it, I've seen low 20s)...MyFord Touch works like a charm, and it's a fun, great-handling car! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBirdStangSkyliner Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 MFT obviously has issues, which Ford is self destructive in not resolving, but should infotainment freezes really be weighted the same as driveline issues in ranking vehicles? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 MFT obviously has issues, which Ford is self destructive in not resolving Ford is trying to resolve those issues. Reference the latest several updates of MFT and how much it has improved from V1. should infotainment freezes really be weighted the same as driveline issues in ranking vehicles? No, absolutely not! Are they issues? Sure. Is it the same as your car leaving you stranded along the road? Hardly. As cars get more and more complex, there needs to be a weighted system for these types of things to really determine what's important. But, this is CR, so they don't really care what anyone else thinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 MFT obviously has issues, which Ford is self destructive in not resolving, but should infotainment freezes really be weighted the same as driveline issues in ranking vehicles? in a word no, and Ford is constantly releasing updates, so they are working on it. Ive said it once, and i will say it again, CR has a propensity for recommending the simplest cars possible, they will be in a world of hurt when manufacturers such as Toyota and Honda ( to name two of their faves ) adress CONSUMER demand for infotainment systems...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonM Posted October 28, 2013 Author Share Posted October 28, 2013 " Looks like GM's new campaign "no more crappy cars" is paying off. They ranked pretty damn high Sorry Hydro, but by your definition, Cadillac and Chevy did not get the "no more crappy cars memo" Cadillac sank 14 spots, from 11 down to #25 of 28. By your definition, the newly released XTS is the "crappiest" vehicle produced by GM. So Hydro, if you are saying the CR list is a measure of crappiness, then no, Cadillac did not get the "no more crappy cars memo". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonM Posted October 28, 2013 Author Share Posted October 28, 2013 But Tesla = 9999999.9999999999999999999999999999!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And to celebrate, Tesla held yet another Car-B-Q !!! Second Tesla Model S fire sparked by crash in Mexico http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/second-tesla-model-fire-sparked-crash-mexico-141237816.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBirdStangSkyliner Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Bet it won't be investigated, either, by those who have investigated so much political crapital in this company. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonM Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share Posted October 29, 2013 You can count on CR looking the other way, just like CR did when ignoring Toyota's sludge problems year after year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20131028/AUTO01/310280081/Consumer-Reports-U-S-automakers-struggle-reliability?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE Ford basically unchanged from last year, up one spot. In other words, still in the cellar along with Lincoln. Ford and Lincoln had more models rated among the "least reliable" in their classes than any other manufacturer: Least reliable subcompacts & compacts: Focus, Fiesta Least reliable hybrids/electric cars: C-Max (including Energi) Least reliable midsize sedans: Fusion 1.6L EcoBoost Least reliable large cars: Taurus Least reliable Sporty cars: Focus ST Least reliable small SUVs: Escape Least reliable midsized SUVs: Edge, Explorer Least reliable large/luxury SUVs: Flex EcoBoost, MKT EcoBoost, MKX Least reliable pickup trucks: F-Series Super Duty (gasoline engine) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 In other words, still in the cellar along with Lincoln. Hey, they last long enough that Ford seems to get a couple of payments, so it's not over yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 They're ranked "least reliable" because of buggy infotainment systems. What a load of horseshit. When Sync doesn't listen to me saying "USB" the first time, that's annoying, but it's not going to leave me on the side of the road or put my life in danger. An annoyance is something that should be noted, but it shouldn't be weighted nearly as heavily as "the wheel falls off at highway speeds"... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92LX302 Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 What's so unreliable about the 6.2 Super Duty? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonM Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share Posted October 29, 2013 They're ranked "least reliable" because of buggy infotainment systems. What a load of horseshit. When Sync doesn't listen to me saying "USB" the first time, that's annoying, but it's not going to leave me on the side of the road or put my life in danger. An annoyance is something that should be noted, but it shouldn't be weighted nearly as heavily as "the wheel falls off at highway speeds"... Agreed Three points, 1) It is "Predicted" reliability, rather than actual reliability. CR will not disclose what they use to predict the future nor will CR present the actual data measured. 2) Infotainment systems from ALL manufacturers are the #1 "reliability" issue per CR and the #1 item that drives CR's rankings. Vehicles that don't have infotainment systems are rated higher than those with infotainment systems all else being equal. CR counts 'confusion' using the system as a "reliability" issue. 3) CRs director of testing noted that CR's survey was conducted BEFORE Ford introduced an improved version of MFT. ============================ To put things in context, here are two statements A) CR's director of testing: "Fisher said Monday that most of Ford’s problems are software-related — instead of a nuts-and-bolts hardware issue — which means the Dearborn automaker should have an easier time fixing glitches." B) BONer's hypothetical director of testing said Monday ....'the problem with the Camry, RAV4 and Prius V are hardware/structural related -- instead of an upgradeable software issue with an MP3 player-- which means the Japanese automaker should have a more difficult time fixing their poor safety ratings" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonM Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share Posted October 29, 2013 (edited) Least reliable luxury sedan: Cadillac XTS Cadillac declined more than any other manufacturer in the study, losing 14 positions It's funny how adding an Infortainment system (CUE) skews the results isn't it ? To further put things in perspective, note this percentage from CR's director of testing: More than 15 percent of vehicle owners reported problems with their infotainment systems in the Ford Taurus, Ford C-Max and Cadillac XTS. Fisher said, "failures at that frequency are not something we're used to seeing." I'm suprised the percentage is only 15%. I'm suprised they call an Infotainment issue a "failure", and su[rised they count it the same as an engine blowing up. 15% is enough to dramatically alter the results and really makes the info provided useless when it comes to what a reasonable person would consider a "relaibility" issue, i.e engine, transmission, braking type issues Edited October 29, 2013 by JasonM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 Bad news sells. So, when infotainment systems are no longer an issue, I'm going to guess that CU is going to start bellyaching because a vehicle either has too many drivers' aids, or not enough. Or the wrong kind. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 (edited) This can't be right, so many obviously good vehicles form different brands being rated so poorly. Gone are the days when you used to get really atrocious build quality and tru;y poor reliability The term, "least reliable" seems to get thrown around by CR to cover general displeasure rather than any actual mechanical failure. Edited October 29, 2013 by jpd80 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyd Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 (edited) That's way softer than the article on Yahoo I read. They blasted the Cmax stating it was the worst hybrid on the market and don't let it discourage you from buying any hybrid from the other auto makers. It's Ford's problems not hybrids. Also, "the high-test scoring Tesla scored earned an avg in reliability, thus earned a recommended rating." Looks like GM's new campaign "no more crappy cars" is paying off. They ranked pretty damn high (9 & 17) I think Ford should start a media blitz with owners of CMAX vehicles and maybe My Ford Touch Commercials. Real people being honest about their love for Ford! Consumer Reports obviously has an attitude towards Ford! They will kill CMAX unless something positive comes out soon. CMAX inventories are growing. (I wonder if CR has a watchdog overlord that is independent and verifies their claims?) Edited October 29, 2013 by bobbyd 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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