jpd80 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 (edited) Now that GM has announced that the Gen 6 Camaro will have a 455 HP and 455 lb ft 6.2 V8 available in SS Trim, should Ford offer a warmed over 3.6 3.5 Ecoboost V6 as something different to keep the competition guessing? Thoughts...... Edited May 22, 2015 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 3.6? I'm guessing the 3.5 might not fit. 2.7 might though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMSA-XJR9 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I'd love to see how the GTs (DP Prototype) engine would perform in a Mustang, but don't see where it would fit in the lineup, especially if FMC isn't taking the Mustang GTLM or GT3 racing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 If a supercharged 5.4L fits the engine bay I don't see a problem with a 3.5L EB. The 5.2L FPC V8 already makes over 500 hp. And a supercharged 5.0L would make more sense than a 3.5L EB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coupe3w Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 If a supercharged 5.4L fits the engine bay I don't see a problem with a 3.5L EB. The 5.2L FPC V8 already makes over 500 hp. And a supercharged 5.0L would make more sense than a 3.5L EB. The GM boys will call foul if comparing the GT 350 to the SS or even the Z 28. And why not offer both the 5.0 S/C and the 3.5 TT? I don't see a reason not to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Isn't the 5.2L "flat plane crank" motor debuting next year?? That'll put the 6.2L from GM on it's ear for sure.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 There's a gap between 310HP of the 2.3L, and 435HP from the 5.0L that could benefit from a middle engine. Somethings like 360-370HP but being light as well without going to the extreme 5.0L, that would allow the 5.0L to grow in power as well. Granted, provided that the sales are there for it. My belief is the current V6 was just offered till people warm up to the EB I-4, then it would be ditched or maybe kept to rental fleets if at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 The GM boys will call foul if comparing the GT 350 to the SS or even the Z 28. And why not offer both the 5.0 S/C and the 3.5 TT? I don't see a reason not to. Why should Ford care what GM fans say? It doesn't make sense to have 6 different engines - too much overlap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 There's a gap between 310HP of the 2.3L, and 435HP from the 5.0L that could benefit from a middle engine. Somethings like 360-370HP but being light as well without going to the extreme 5.0L, that would allow the 5.0L to grow in power as well. Granted, provided that the sales are there for it. My belief is the current V6 was just offered till people warm up to the EB I-4, then it would be ditched or maybe kept to rental fleets if at that. I was thinking the 2.7L EB would fill that gap nicely. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpvbs Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I absulutely think it should be available. As good as the 5.0 is, I don't know how much more is left in it. The new 3.5 should be able to out power the 5.0 rather easily - both peak power and area under the curve. The 3.5 EB is the low hanging fruit. Ford can keep trying to ring more power out of the 5.0 but the new EB should be able to make 500hp pretty easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coupe3w Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Why should Ford care what GM fans say? It doesn't make sense to have 6 different engines - too much overlap. Replace the NA V6 with the TT and replace the NA 5.0 with a 5.0 S/C or TT still have 4 engines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I absulutely think it should be available. As good as the 5.0 is, I don't know how much more is left in it. The new 3.5 should be able to out power the 5.0 rather easily - both peak power and area under the curve. The 3.5 EB is the low hanging fruit. Ford can keep trying to ring more power out of the 5.0 but the new EB should be able to make 500hp pretty easily. What's impressive is how Ford has gotten as much out of the Coyote as it has without using DI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 As good as the 5.0 is, I don't know how much more is left in it. Me, either. 700 hp is just pathetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 If it's only making 450 hp in the new Raptor, don't expect much more than that from a 3.5L EB mustang. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coupe3w Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Me, either. 700 hp is just pathetic. I know what you mean 2.3 HP / CI is just crazy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpvbs Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 (edited) Me, either. 700 hp is just pathetic. And what production vehicle is this in? I'm not doubting the coyote can make lots of h/p with forced induction, but doing so isn't free. I would consider a 3.5EB to potentially be either the GT engine or a minimal cost optional GT engine. A forced induction 5.0 would have to be a special edition. We don't know for sure how much hp the Raptor will be making, but with a couple thousand less pounds to haul around and no towing expectations, a slightly hotter tune wouldn't be out of the question for a Mustang version. Edited May 22, 2015 by jpvbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Well the Raptor engine is just a detuned GT engine, which should be putting out 600+ HP...but at the same time I don't see Ford offering that 3.5L Ecoboost under the GT...maybe as a GT500 down the road..though I think Mustang fans would get their panties in a wad over that one. A performance tuned 2.7L Ecoboost wouldn't have an issue hitting 375-400 HP and might be a bit lighter then the 3.5L....couldn't find weight specs, but several articles stated is around the physical size of I4 engine in the competition. I can see this engine replacing the 3.5L Ecoboost in other car based performance variants like the SHO or MKS...err Continental. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 And what production vehicle is this in? I'm not doubting the coyote can make lots of h/p with forced induction, but doing so isn't free. I would consider a 3.5EB to potentially be either the GT engine or a minimal cost optional GT engine. A forced induction 5.0 would have to be a special edition. We don't know for sure how much hp the Raptor will be making, but with a couple thousand less pounds to haul around and no towing expectations, a slightly hotter tune wouldn't be out of the question for a Mustang version. Any number of tuner mustangs (Roush, Steeda, etc.). It isn't rocket science to supercharge a 5.0L Coyote V8. And it wouldn't be more expensive than a high output 3.5L EB. Ford has quoted the 3.5L EB Raptor at 450 hp. You're not getting 600 out of a regular production version. I could see the new production 3.5L EB slotted above the 5.0L IF they didn't already have the FPC 5.2L at 500+ hp. I see this lineup: 2.3L EB - 305 hp 2.7L EB - 350 hp 5.0L - 412 hp 5.2L FPC - 500 hp SC 5.0L - 600-650 hp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMSA-XJR9 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Any number of tuner mustangs (Roush, Steeda, etc.). It isn't rocket science to supercharge a 5.0L Coyote V8. And it wouldn't be more expensive than a high output 3.5L EB. Ford has quoted the 3.5L EB Raptor at 450 hp. You're not getting 600 out of a regular production version. I could see the new production 3.5L EB slotted above the 5.0L IF they didn't already have the FPC 5.2L at 500+ hp. I see this lineup: 2.3L EB - 305 hp 2.7L EB - 350 hp 5.0L - 412 hp 5.2L FPC - 500 hp SC 5.0L - 600-650 hp Reports are the GT will be between 600-650hp, though it may not qualify as 'regular production.' http://www.hotrod.com/features/1505-exclusive-look-at-the-engine-that-could-power-fords-all-new-gt/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Reports are the GT will be between 600-650hp, though it may not qualify as 'regular production.' http://www.hotrod.com/features/1505-exclusive-look-at-the-engine-that-could-power-fords-all-new-gt/ The same new engine in the Raptor is reported at 450 hp so I doubt a Mustang version would be much over 500 hp. You can do a lot in a $400K vehicle that you can't do in a $60K vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMSA-XJR9 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 The same new engine in the Raptor is reported at 450 hp so I doubt a Mustang version would be much over 500 hp. You can do a lot in a $400K vehicle that you can't do in a $60K vehicle. I understand, just providing some additional information. Though with the GT/DP engine featuring the following (below), the engine wouldn't appear to be a major cost factor contributing to the anticipate $400K cost . . . What you may not know is that the 600hp race version—built by Roush Yates Racing Engines (RYRE)—uses a production block, heads, direct injection, cam drive, gaskets and valvesprings. It also uses stock bore and stroke, compression ratio, and valve sizes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 22, 2015 Author Share Posted May 22, 2015 (edited) My original point was that Ford has regular production Ecoboost V6s available that could be slotted to offer a different kind of driving sensation. Now whether that ends up being the 2.7 EB replacing the base V6 or a Raptor tuned E3.5EB is up for grabs but seing that F150 is "sponsoring" both of these engines, I think it's an amazing opportunity for Ford to offer engines that GM either can't or won't. A 2.7 EB teamed to a 6-speed or new 10-speed auto would certainly get the rental companies interested as well as a lot of new buyers who wouldn't normally consider the Mustang. Equally, the 3.5 EB is an opportunity for Ford to offer a ton of torque to those buyers who want a no nonsense daily commuter that has so much punch off the line that it can't be ignored... Edited May 22, 2015 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 There are other parts that could be more costly but that race engine also doesn't have to last 150K miles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I think it's an amazing opportunity for Ford to offer engines that GM either can't or won't. You mean like a 5.2L FPC V8 that outperforms their pushrod 6.2L? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMSA-XJR9 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 There are other parts that could be more costly but that race engine also doesn't have to last 150K miles. Again, I understand. I forget sometimes to qualify my responses on certain forums. We're all just speculating for fun(?) anyway . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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