Bryan1 Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 PHOENIX — When you make big investments in a pickup to improve fuel economy — think Ford's aluminum-body F-150 or the mild-hybrid system on Ram's 1500 — you expect significant results. So how does General Motors explain shifting to a four-cylinder turbo for its redesigned full-size pickups and getting little gain in combined EPA fuel economy ratings over the previous generation's V-6? As a work in progress. link: http://www.autonews.com/article/20181119/OEM06/181119749/gm-chevy-silverado-mpg-4-cylinder-engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan1 Posted November 20, 2018 Author Share Posted November 20, 2018 (edited) https://twitter.com/mrlevine/status/1064514168173338624 "Don't look at the label," said Herrick. "We're as good or better than them in every step." Edited November 20, 2018 by Bryan1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 This is certainly a PR miss for GM. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 But they've won every quality reliability super award in the history of ever according to that guy in the ads! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 (edited) GM's 2.7 I-4 T is in great danger of becoming a "who cares engine" that could will get lost in a crowd of much better choices.. Edited November 20, 2018 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 36 minutes ago, jpd80 said: GM's 2.7 I-4 T is in great danger of becoming a "who cares engine" that could will get lost in a crowd of much better choices.. And in typical GM fashion they'll build way too many of them.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 GM needs to stop screw-balling around and put that motor in the Traverse/Enclave/Acadia triplets with their nine-speed transaxle....that would be the "smart" thing to do...luckily for Ford and everyone else, it would seem that GM is not thinking very "smart" lately. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 8 minutes ago, twintornados said: GM needs to stop screw-balling around and put that motor in the Traverse/Enclave/Acadia triplets with their nine-speed transaxle....that would be the "smart" thing to do...luckily for Ford and everyone else, it would seem that GM is not thinking very "smart" lately. As much as this pains me to say this, we've been pointing out the issues of all three companies, but yet they still make $$$ inspite of themselves. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 (edited) Car and Driver wrote a review of the 2.7 liter turbo engine in 2019 Silverado. They said the engine performs impressively well. But they also acknowledged the stigma of a 4-cylinder engine to full size pickup truck buyers who love V8s .https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2019-chevy-silverado-1500-four-cylinder-drive Quote Of the many highlights found in the new-for-2019 Chevrolet Silverado 1500, from the bold new styling to its cleverly optimized cargo box to a factory-lifted off-road variant, the addition of an available four-cylinder engine—a first for a modern full-size pickup—is certainly the most controversial. Beyond incurring the stigma of a wheezy four-banger in a big, burly pickup, can just four cylinders effectively motivate that much tonnage? The simple answer is yes, impressively so, even if the combination will take some getting used to." Edited November 20, 2018 by rperez817 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 The reviews I've seen have all pretty consistently said this engine is going to be a tough sell. Fuel economy numbers probably being the biggest one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 The problem is the disappointing fuel economy on the window sticker. It should be able to at least match the F150 2.7L V6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 (edited) The 2.7L 4 cylinder turbo would likely benefit from a mild hybrid system and maybe a "start/stop" tech package to get those numbers up where they belong. Edited November 20, 2018 by twintornados Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 9 minutes ago, twintornados said: The 2.7L 4 cylinder turbo would likely benefit from a mild hybrid system and maybe a "start/stop" tech package to get those numbers up where they belong. But it already has stop/start capability. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 3 hours ago, silvrsvt said: As much as this pains me to say this, we've been pointing out the issues of all three companies, but yet they still make $$$ inspite of themselves. Based on GM moves of late I'm not sure how great the underlying company is doing. I have a feeling they are worse off than Ford is at in product cycle and future growth. Ford has a ton of new volume product coming in the next 2 years. GM really doesn't have anything new that is in a volume segment and what they have brought out in the past year has really been just "Eh" the XT4, Traverse, Blazer, Silverado have all been far from class leading product at introduction. Hopefully they didn't screw up the Tahoe/Yukon, and if FCA gets back into that market they will continue to lose volume in what is probably GM most profitable segment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 1 hour ago, akirby said: But it already has stop/start capability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 1 hour ago, jasonj80 said: Based on GM moves of late I'm not sure how great the underlying company is doing. I have a feeling they are worse off than Ford is at in product cycle and future growth. Ford has a ton of new volume product coming in the next 2 years. GM really doesn't have anything new that is in a volume segment and what they have brought out in the past year has really been just "Eh" the XT4, Traverse, Blazer, Silverado have all been far from class leading product at introduction. Hopefully they didn't screw up the Tahoe/Yukon, and if FCA gets back into that market they will continue to lose volume in what is probably GM most profitable segment. Thats the point I'm making, not matter how they muddle through the market, it doesn't seem to hurt them (well ok BK about 10 years ago, but they bounced back) Gm just seems to muddle on through with a convulted product plan that doesn't really have a world beating run of the mill product. FFS the Silverado is number 3 in the game and 1 and 2 is more or less a dead heat between Ford and RAM, depending on what you look at-I'm sure Ford will be fixing that with the next F-150 though. Considering all the shit that FCA did/does-you'd think they would be dead by now, but due to dumb luck because of Jeep and lesser extent RAM they are still in the game Ford was on a good path and then trashed it just because. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan1 Posted November 20, 2018 Author Share Posted November 20, 2018 From Car & Driver: "we did not have the opportunity to evaluate the 2.7T when saddled with a payload in the Silverado's bed or when towing a trailer, it proved more than a match for a 2019 Ram 1500 with the standard 305-hp 3.6-liter eTorque V-6 that Chevy had on hand for comparison drives." --------------- They and other outlets haven't hauled and towed with it yet. And of course Chevy is going to rig the test with their optional engine against a base engine from Ford when the optional 2.7T from Ford is also available. REPLY 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 2 hours ago, silvrsvt said: Thats the point I'm making, not matter how they muddle through the market, it doesn't seem to hurt them (well ok BK about 10 years ago, but they bounced back) Gm just seems to muddle on through with a convoluted product plan that doesn't really have a world beating run of the mill product. FFS the Silverado is number 3 in the game and 1 and 2 is more or less a dead heat between Ford and RAM, depending on what you look at-I'm sure Ford will be fixing that with the next F-150 though. Considering all the shit that FCA did/does-you'd think they would be dead by now, but due to dumb luck because of Jeep and lesser extent RAM they are still in the game Ford was on a good path and then trashed it just because. Well GM has had the luxury over the past 10 years of not really paying any tax and using that extra cash flow to maintain everything. It is still mind blowing to me how debt was basically wiped off because you started a new company but you're still allow to carry those loses from the old company forward but none of the liability. I also feel they are getting a large pass on what is going on because they have a female CEO and in this environment no one is going to want to be seen picking on female CEO. Roomers are a big layoff is coming after the first of the year on the salary side as they haven't gotten close to the buyout numbers they hoped, they are rapidly consolidating offices around the world, and have put on hold major renovations projects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 14 hours ago, jasonj80 said: ...I also feel they are getting a large pass on what is going on because they have a female CEO and in this environment no one is going to want to be seen picking on female CEO. .. POTUS #45 would have no issue doing that.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Here's a review from Automobile Magazine. This article has a good technical overview of dual volute turbo. Also it quotes Kevin Luchansky, chief engineer of the new GM full size trucks. Mr. Luchansky says Silverado 2.7L turbo target audiences are people who own cars with 2.0L turbo gasoline engines. https://www.automobilemag.com/news/2019-chevrolet-silverado-four-cylinder-review-first-drive/ "Add it all up, and it’s not hyperbole to call the direct-injection, 2.7-liter, turbocharged engine a wonder, maybe the most technologically advanced powerplant from General Motors in a decade. The fact that it’s a four-cylinder isn’t surprising. That it’s debuting in the full-size Silverado is. “We’re not trying to convert V-8 customers,” Luchansky says. “We’re trying for converts that are coming out of either cars or sedans or another application that has a 2.0-liter turbo. If you have a turbo engine, you’re going to want another turbo engine.” That’s a shame, because the only thing stopping this 2.7 from supplanting the 5.3 entirely is the rusty old falsehood that V-8s are for trucks and four cylinders are for cars. That mountain of instantly available torque means that there’s power everywhere. We’ve grown accustomed to responsive turbocharged engines, but this is something new, the instant rush of a small-displacement diesel in a gasoline powerplant." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted November 22, 2018 Share Posted November 22, 2018 (edited) GM is trying to leap frog Ford and get to the next group of full sized truck buyers without sacrificing or replacing any existing V6 or V8 sales. Time will tell if this strategy worked for GM or whether it was just controlling the narrative on embracing its own TT V6s for the twins... Edited November 22, 2018 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted November 26, 2018 Share Posted November 26, 2018 (edited) On 11/21/2018 at 11:49 AM, rperez817 said: Here's a review from Automobile Magazine. This article has a good technical overview of dual volute turbo. Also it quotes Kevin Luchansky, chief engineer of the new GM full size trucks. Mr. Luchansky says Silverado 2.7L turbo target audiences are people who own cars with 2.0L turbo gasoline engines. https://www.automobilemag.com/news/2019-chevrolet-silverado-four-cylinder-review-first-drive/ The problem with this way of thinking is that GM is assuming those people want a I4 turbo. I switched over to forced induction about 10 years ago and never looked back so in theory, I'm the type of buyer that GM wants to target with a I4 turbo pickup truck. But look at my fleet now... I have a V6 turbo and an I6 turbo and no I4 turbo - if you are addicted to turbo power, you want more of it! The buyer GM wants to attract are not buying the Silverado in a information bubble. They probably know that Ford has a V6 turbo and it costs about the same as GM's I4 turbo but makes a lot more power AND get better MPG. I could go back to I4 turbo but why? When V6 turbo get just as good MPG and make more power and sweet sweet WOT sound that no I4 can duplicate. Edited November 26, 2018 by bzcat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 On 11/20/2018 at 10:07 AM, rperez817 said: Car and Driver wrote a review of the 2.7 liter turbo engine in 2019 Silverado. They said the engine performs impressively well. But they also acknowledged the stigma of a 4-cylinder engine to full size pickup truck buyers who love V8s .https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2019-chevy-silverado-1500-four-cylinder-drive Update from Car and Driver. They tested 2019 Silverados and Sierras with 2.7L 4, 5.3L V8, and 6.2L V8. Here are the real world highway fuel economy numbers. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a25953794/chevrolet-silverado-four-cylinder-fuel-economy-test/ 2.7L Silverado RST 4x4 Double Cab: 18 mpg 5.3L Silverado RST 4x4 Crew Cab: 21 mpg 6.2L Sierra Denali 4x4 Crew Cab: 18 mpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 8 minutes ago, rperez817 said: Update from Car and Driver. They tested 2019 Silverados and Sierras with 2.7L 4, 5.3L V8, and 6.2L V8. Here are the real world highway fuel economy numbers. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a25953794/chevrolet-silverado-four-cylinder-fuel-economy-test/ 2.7L Silverado RST 4x4 Double Cab: 18 mpg 5.3L Silverado RST 4x4 Crew Cab: 21 mpg 6.2L Sierra Denali 4x4 Crew Cab: 18 mpg What is the carbon foot print of each vehicle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 43 minutes ago, twintornados said: What is the carbon foot print of each vehicle? Look them up here. https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/epadata/19data.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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