Alan Mulally's Crusade to save Ford

[jpd80]

I have friends that have had to move from Norfolk and St. Louis to Detroit to keep their jobs. I don't remember Ford flying them home to keep their homes.

 

My point, just when Fields was jet-setting between Detroit and Florida every weekend, is if you want to commute that far it should be on your own dime. Either that or move. Just because you have a gold spoon in your mouth, you shouldn't ask an hourly worker to sacrifice when you wont.

Compared to most executives, Fields and Mulally are giving up regular perks.

Field's voluntarily reduced his $517,000 annual travel bill to $29,000 by flying first class.

Mulally flys on a chartered aircraft and probably shares with other execs flying from Seattle.

His family fly coach and Ford pays for it.

 

Nothing to see here folks.

Edited May 14, 2009 by jpd80

[probeGT]

I have to say that as an official bleeding-heart liberal, I'm normally with Pioneer on this kind of issue. But the fact of the matter is that Mulally is perhaps the one person on earth who is capable of saving Ford. Without him up to now, we can pretty much be sure that Ford would be in AT LEAST as bad of shape as Chrysler and GM. So, I'm pretty much of a mind that he is worth every cent and every perk.

[fordmantpw]

I have friends that have had to move from Norfolk and St. Louis to Detroit to keep their jobs. I don't remember Ford flying them home to keep their homes.

 

My point, just when Fields was jet-setting between Detroit and Florida every weekend, is if you want to commute that far it should be on your own dime. Either that or move. Just because you have a gold spoon in your mouth, you shouldn't ask an hourly worker to sacrifice when you wont.

 

I understand what you are saying, but without those perks, Mulally would NOT be working for Ford. If Mulally were NOT working for Ford, chances are, a lot of hourly workers would have had to sacrifice more than some benefits.

 

And, don't take offense to this, but hourly workers are much easier to come by than top notch CEO's...you gotta pay to get what you want.

 

But the fact of the matter is that Mulally is perhaps the one person on earth who is capable of saving Ford. Without him up to now, we can pretty much be sure that Ford would be in AT LEAST as bad of shape as Chrysler and GM. So, I'm pretty much of a mind that he is worth every cent and every perk.

 

Precisely!

Edited May 14, 2009 by fordmantpw

[RichardJensen]

if you want to commute that far it should be on your own dime.

It IS on his dime. He has to pay taxes on it. It is 'service in lieu of compensation'.

[Pioneer]

It IS on his dime. He has to pay taxes on it. It is 'service in lieu of compensation'.

 

Not according to THIS article.

 

Ford still covers the tax on this perk

[Hydro]

it's funny, Yahoo puts out a front page article today (same one you linked Pioneer) and the title on Yahoo's front page said "Ten of the most egregious executive perks" and the sub title says "Ford CEO spent 500k on flights"and show a airplane picture. They go right to the car companys again. Not the 38k toilet or the 8 other higher ranking CEO's.

[fordmantpw]

it's funny, Yahoo puts out a front page article today (same one you linked Pioneer) and the title on Yahoo's front page said "Ten of the most egregious executive perks" and the sub title says "Ford CEO spent 500k on flights"and show a airplane picture. They go right to the car companys again. Not the 38k toilet or the 8 other higher ranking CEO's.

 

That's because all the automakers are getting bailout money. Oh wait...

 

The media has to kick 'em while they're down!

[jpd80]

It's obvious Pioneers see the compensation to Ford executives as being outrageous, especially

when he and his brother workers are being asked to take cuts in conditions at every turn.

 

Unfortunately, Ford Motor is not a democracy and executives get special treatment.

Welcome to America.

[Pioneer]

It's obvious Pioneers see the compensation to Ford executives as being outrageous, especially

when he and his brother workers are being asked to take cuts in conditions at every turn.

 

 

I see the compensation of all CEO's excessive when they are asking hourly workers to give things up and they refuse to.

 

 

Dick Dauch is probably the worst. Scumbag.

[Deanh]

hell how dare these guys make money being responsible for one of the largest companies in the world , hell, last i looked NONE of them could even swing a baseball bat, dribble a basketball, throw a football, or get photographed with no panties...how DARE they make any money or get rewarded....

[jpd80]

There's been a lot of hard work going on behind the scenes at Ford to get that recurring $5 billion reduction in expenses.

The constant deroggatory references to Mulally and Fields non cash benefits is getting pretty tiresome,

everyone at Ford has done a great job pulling the company back from the edge.

 

Fly in fly out is acceptable in corporate circles when you're getting the right people.

There's a couple of good examples going around at the moment of what not to do in the auto industry.

[RichardJensen]

Not according to THIS article.

Okay, whatevs. So he makes $2.5M per year instead of $2M. Big deal.

 

You think he'd be making more as a figurehead for a successful company? I do. He'd probably have stock options that were actually worth something.

 

He's making sacrificies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And geeeeeeeeeeez what is it with you and airplanes????? I swear, I hate flying, and for all his training as an aircraft engineer, Mulally probably has had his fill of corporate jets back to Seattle. Flying ain't romantic. It's drudgery. It's either forced downtime, being cooped up with work, or some other annoying combination of the two.

 

I mean Alan basically has a 6 hour commute to Seattle and back, and he ain't up there partying with Playboy bunnies, or sippin' gin and juice with Snoop Dogg. You think he's got flight attendants giving him massages or serving him caviar with duck under glass while he laughs at the proles working at his factories? I don't think so. He's going to work, or coming back from it, and if he's not working on the flight, maybe he gets some beer or wine with his meal. On the way to Seattle.

 

So he gets to ride in a friggin' plane. Big deal.

[Pioneer]

And geeeeeeeeeeez what is it with you and airplanes?????

 

It's not about the airplane. It's about the lopsided sacrifices.

 

I think he's doing a great job. Don't forget that. I just think the sacrifices have been one-sided.

[RichardJensen]

I just think the sacrifices have been one-sided.

What sacrifices have you made as it relates to your status as a current employee of Ford? I mean, when you go to work, what's changed vs. 5 years ago?

 

You've had to give up some pretty posh unemployment benefits (and don't you dare call them anything else--you'd have to go to France to find a place where the unemployed got more money with fewer expectations than UAW members), but those unemployment benefits ain't wirth a dime to you right now.

 

You haven't gotten a pay raise in a good long while and you probably won't get one any time soon either.

 

Well, shoot, Alan probably ain't getting a raise until you do.

Edited May 15, 2009 by RichardJensen

[Pioneer]

What sacrifices have you made as it relates to your status as a current employee of Ford? I mean, when you go to work, what's changed vs. 5 years ago?

 

 

Me, personally? Not very much. I have twice as long of a drive.

 

Others have given up a lot. Uprooted families because their plant have closed. I don't see them or their families getting free airplane rides around the country to visit home, go shopping, or just plain 'ol commute because they didn't want to move when they accepted the job.

 

I don't see upper level management giving up executive perks like free/heavily discounted vehicles, while others that have been transferred have 1 hour+ long drives. They don't have to pay for gas or insurance on them either, while some peoples fuel bills have doubled. And don't even think about suggesting we move. In this economy, right now, it's not an option.

 

I took the concessions and have no problem with them. I am still paid pretty well and have great benefits compared to most people that I know. I just don't see parity between the concessions of the hourly, and concessions of upper management. They still get their bloated salaries, they still get their stock options, they still get their free travel and company vehicles. Hell, everything the Union has given up has to be renegotiated again in 2 years, and there is no reason to expect that we gain anything back when the economy improves. Meanwhile, management gets everything back automatically.

 

This is my last post on this. Everybody knows my position. It just seems that everybody is for the upper class on this board, and that is truly disheartening.

[RichardJensen]

It just seems that everybody is for the upper class on this board, and that is truly disheartening.

I'm not 'for' the upper class, rather, I can't fathom your inability to get past the fact that well-compensated people will always be well-compensated. Duh. They're well-off! Doesn't mean they're happy, doesn't mean they're good at their jobs, and even if they get all the perquisites of their job, if they're of a mind to complain, they can complain just as loudly as you about the stuff they've had to give up (like, for instance, a defined benefit pension plan and retiree health care).

Edited May 15, 2009 by RichardJensen

[xr7g428]

Pioneer, thanks for stopping. You were getting dumber with every post. Some people are going to make more than you, work less than you, and probably deserve it less than most. I like to call them professional athletes. Some call them rock stars. For you it is auto execs. Mom said there would be days like this.

[silvrsvt]

Others have given up a lot. Uprooted families because their plant have closed. I don't see them or their families getting free airplane rides around the country to visit home, go shopping, or just plain 'ol commute because they didn't want to move when they accepted the job.

 

Goes back to demand...its far easier to find someone to replace someone who works on an automotive line then it is to find someone who has good business sense to run a company that was as fucked as Ford was/is

 

Meanwhile, management gets everything back automatically.

 

Your assuming again, do you think that Fields is going to get his free airplane rides back when Ford starts posting a profit?

 

This is my last post on this. Everybody knows my position. It just seems that everybody is for the upper class on this board, and that is truly disheartening.

 

No its not that...isn't the whole point of having a job is to improve upon yourself and make more money? If you take away perks or other things that the "upper class" have, where is my motivation to keep improving myself if I'm just gonna have the same shit that everyone else has?

 

Sounds like your unhappy with your job and your stuck in a rut with no future.

[Blue II]

It's not about the airplane. It's about the lopsided sacrifices.

 

I think he's doing a great job. Don't forget that. I just think the sacrifices have been one-sided.

 

At this point would you rather work for GM or Chrysler? Mullaly has saved a company and jobs. You have no argument.

[probeGT]

I know he has withdrawn from the discussion now, but I think some are being a little hard on Pioneer. It does always amaze me in this country how quick we are to jump on union members and "little guys" about their perks, but we're basically OK with the CEOs backing the trucks up and loading them up. You saw this exact thing in the "liberal media" with the way they latched onto UAW wages with the auto bailout but initially didn't give a rat's a** about all the Wall Street perks and bonuses.

 

Having said all that, I reiterate that I support Mulally in this. The other thing, to me, is that my sense is that Mulally is probably already financially set--he could just walk away from this (he didn't have to come here in the first place)--and just go an be in Seattle full-time if he wanted to.

[jpd80]

I know he has withdrawn from the discussion now, but I think some are being a little hard on Pioneer. It does always amaze me in this country how quick we are to jump on union members and "little guys" about their perks, but we're basically OK with the CEOs backing the trucks up and loading them up. You saw this exact thing in the "liberal media" with the way they latched onto UAW wages with the auto bailout but initially didn't give a rat's a** about all the Wall Street perks and bonuses.

 

Having said all that, I reiterate that I support Mulally in this. The other thing, to me, is that my sense is that Mulally is probably already financially set--he could just walk away from this (he didn't have to come here in the first place)--and just go an be in Seattle full-time if he wanted to.

I believe Mulally lost something like $11 million in Boeing stockwhen he left them,

Ford had to compensate him for that loss.

 

See, if a worker leaves an employer and loses a benefit worth 5 times his annual salary, that's a big drop

but nobody sees that with executives and they think riding on planes is luxury - it's an absolute pain.

Edited May 15, 2009 by jpd80

[probeGT]

True, true. I agree that it takes a special kind of person to WANT TO be a CEO in the first place. Not everyone is cut out for it, for sure. I'm just dismayed at a huge swath of this country seems to get a lot more fired up about a guy who does sweat-work all day long getting a little extra while we celebrate hogs like Jack Welch and Wall Street types.

 

It's not hard to guess where Glenn Beck would come down it all this, I guess.

[SkapeGote]

Sup,

 

I agree that the prices of these upper CEO types seems outrageous. I practice law, specifically in the labor field, and have to tell you, even with a law degree, my wages is dwarfed by what these guys make. Then again, I am not sure I could run a multinational corp. I thought I was being frivolous when I hired a professional assistant to write down everything I say. Now I am dyslexic, and it made more sense. Even so, I felt "icky" about it. I felt like I was flashing my coin around.

 

I have worked with, and against, the CAW in Canada for the past while, by the way love you Canadians. Anyway, both sides have the same issue. They both have reasonable and unreasonable demands. The CAW employees want more than they deserve, but it is no more blatant than the compensation the CEO's and upper level managers get. They think they deserve what they get. Pioneer is a decent guy, we have clashed before on opinion, but he is never without fact or an intimate perspective of the unionized employee. Calling him dumb or stupid just makes your argument look weak. We all view the world through a different look glass. My looking glass said "Get an big education so you can make big money". I will not apologize for my wage, even if I better most of my factory worker friends by 6 - 10 times. The cost of all this was my first marriage. You give something up when you pursue a career like mine. 18 hour day, sometimes months on end. I was away from home 6, sometimes 7, days a week. I have to buy rounds at bars when me and the guys go out, and get badgered about how since I make the big buck I should have too.

 

I am just as disgusted with CEO compensation as Pioneer, but again I am no less disgusted by say the UAW having a private golf course. You should be proud to know someone like Pioneer. Hard working union employees are becoming an endangered species, and to see someone like Pioneer who has that passion just shows how dedicated he is to the job. And not just his job, but for all people in a similar line of employment.

 

If anything, people like Pioneer should be congratulated for their stalwart refusal to engage in the underhanded, seedy, world of big business politics. If the world had more people with is conviction, it would be a better place. My hat goes off to him. His family is lucky to have that kind person to look up to, when so many of us cannot say the same. This is just my opinion so take it for what it is, but he is right. He is right on a level a lot of us just can't, or refuse, to understand.

 

Skape

[Ovaltine]

I received my new copy of Fortune yesterday and eagerly read the cover story on Ford and Mulally.

 

Having spent 3+ years working as a contract IT person at Ford's FPSD and NAA0 HQs (both buildings now are gone) back in the late 80's and early 90's, it was truly mind boggling to see the amount of CYA-ing and personal fiefdoms that went on.

 

It was SO refreshing to read how Mulally came in, figuratively fired up the "chainsaw", and started hacking at deadwood and brush.

 

The man seems to be a genuine light and postive force for change in the dreary labyrinth of Ford's traditional halls of power.

 

If Ford comes out of the current quagmire profitable and free of government "imperial entanglements", I say this one particular man is worth every dime he's been paid.

 

As Bill Ford rightly notes in the article, the BIG problem is going to be keeping the forward momentum when Mulally finally does call it a day and retires.

 

Is Mark Fields up to the job? I think the verdict is still out on that one.

 

-Ovaltine

[silvrsvt]

I agree that the prices of these upper CEO types seems outrageous. I practice law, specifically in the labor field, and have to tell you, even with a law degree, my wages is dwarfed by what these guys make.

 

You underrate yourself, I was speaking a Lawyer friend of mine who worked for Vonage at one point in his Career...he was telling me that another lawyer from a firm that was working for Vonage was doing something and worked a weekend to get it done...and charged Vonage something like $79K for the work!

 

Then I have another friend who has a friend who makes 600K a year...I was bored and punched the numbers into a payroll calender....that works out to 12K every two weeks! Thats just insane