Mercury Dead, Lincoln Lineup to Expand

[saintlaz1]

They do. It's called Mustang. :poke:

 

The Mustang is harsh, its never going to be a Cougar that is built upon style and speed.

[saintlaz1]

Even if it means an unsustainable business for Ford Motor Company? How very considerate of you. :P

 

Its not unsustainable. Mercury has sold every car that has been made for them, 93,000 Mercurys were sold last year because thats all that was made.

[96towncarcartier]

I'll tell you, I'm not happy about this decision either, especially since there's been all this talk about how the brand was here to stay.

 

One thing is for sure, it makes me want to hang on to my 2004 Sable even more than ever before... and my mom with her 08 Marquis.

 

I think that while I understand the business side of the equation and why it makes sense to end Mercury, at the same time, it's their own fault that the brand is dying because they never invested in it.

 

Cutting models, reducing options, and focusing elsewhee... NO WONDER the sales have dropped. You have to spend money to make money... and if you ignore something, it's going to wither. Sound familiar? Look at all the other wonderful launches that withered and died... like the Lincoln LS.

[timmm55]

They do. It's called Mustang. :poke:

 

No, the Mustang was never a Cougar.

[timmm55]

I guess Ford could make a Cougar without Mercury :shades:

 

They called the "chicklet" Cougar a Ford in Europe.

[ausrutherford]

They called the "chicklet" Cougar a Ford in Europe.

 

I was thinking, just make a Cougar and sell it at Lincoln dealers.

[saintlaz1]

I was thinking, just make a Cougar and sell it at Lincoln dealers.

 

I doubt it would happen but if they did a cougar with no lincoln disgnation and the Cougar head emblem and name be the mark on the car it could work but i dont think a cougar will see again.

[AlRozzi]

Even if it means an unsustainable business for Ford Motor Company? How very considerate of you. :P

You seem to be a Mercury hater? I feel as if the bashers were hired to do damage control. Merc was only unsustainable because of poor management, the Mercury name wasn't to blame.

 

Alan and the boys' rhetoric about unsustainable business or whatever, is just a political line to appease the electorate. They have done a rather effective job of persuasion with their "mid-price" brands can't make it. Well rather than abandon, why not reformulate?

 

I recall when Alan first joined Ford in 2006 and one of his comments was that he was told that a small car like Focus will never make money and is just a loss leader. Alan told management that was no excuse, to find a way to make the segment profitable, not abandon the Focus.

 

There are so many comments here by some about how it was time to get rid of Mercury for whatever reason, but I find it hard to believe that any real Ford guy could love the company so much that he could cheer the demise of a brand.

 

Mercury as a brand had desirable attributes. Should Ford in the future wish to establish a third brand it will incur high startup costs on top of Mercury brand's closure costs.

 

(sorry Nick, I am not trying to attack anybody, just some thoughts I've had)

[Pioneer]

How many people that are upset at the closing of Mercury even own one?

 

And, of the people that own one, how many purchased it new?

 

I bet not many. It's kind of like most parents and teachers around where I live. They complain that the school districts around my area are losing money and have to cut programs and possibly close schools. When I ask what they drive, and they reply an import, I explain to them that they are the problem. The prevailing industry around me is Big 3 automotive. No jobs = no tax money to support the local economy.

 

For Mercury it's: No buyers = no need.

 

 

 

[AlRozzi]

How many people that are upset at the closing of Mercury even own one?

 

And, of the people that own one, how many purchased it new?

 

I bet not many. It's kind of like most parents and teachers around where I live. They complain that the school districts around my area are losing money and have to cut programs and possibly close schools. When I ask what they drive, and they reply an import, I explain to them that they are the problem. The prevailing industry around me is Big 3 automotive. No jobs = no tax money to support the local economy.

 

For Mercury it's: No buyers = no need.

 

Own 2 and bought new. Was ready for a new one this fall.

 

And I'm upset. I just want to know when Ford will stop shrinking?

[lincmerc51]

Even if it means an unsustainable business for Ford Motor Company? How very considerate of you. :P

 

Not going to subjugate my wants and desires to the profitability of a company. Mercury is not unsustainable now. They just figure they can save some money (read: LAYOFF SOME WHITE COLLAR WORKERS) by killing Mercury, that's all. It's going to cost them a ton to wind it down. So that money is not avail for development. UAW thieves are a big part of this story. If they had voted to do the right thing and get in line with all other American auto workers, that would have helped to company. But the greedy hub cap installers wont budge. They think they are owed a king's ransom. Someone should make them all watch newsreels of Greece.

 

As for Lincoln, for this present incarnation of Ford's 'Lincoln vision' to be the one that benefits from the gutting of Mercury is truly sad. Kill Merc to bring out more cow-catcher grilled, nonsensical letter-named FWD appliances to compete with .... .... Buick? .... Chrysler? .... Anyone? is truely ironic. With all Lincoln aspired to be and could have been back around the turn ot the century to have turned to this - a badge-engineered volvo and a badge-engineered mazda and some trucks is pathetic. And they promise us more of this? Led by the little green shrek machine? Are you kidding me Mulally? You'd have gotten FAR more milage out of a well-done upscale Mustang called 'Cougar'. What is up your sleeve for Lincoln that could possibly be a better seller and newsmaker than a redone Cougar? The MKS is a FLOP. The MKZ sells I guess, but does it compete? The Navigatgor is great (I love mine) but it's a dying segment. The MKT? Who is supposed to buy that thing anyway? The Flex is also a failure and it looks like the T will follow.

 

So, yeah, Lincoln needs help all right. But it's still years away, unless you like the Lincoln MK-MINI thingy. THis thing too, would sell better as a Merc. How many Scion and element buyers can move up to a Lincoln after all.

 

Well, as obama said to BP, 'I'm the expert and I'll make the decisions around here' so say Ford marketeers and managers 'we know best - after all, we gave you the Flex AND the Taurus-X at the same time, eh? Not just any marketing team could do that.' Yep, they know best I'm sure. They know so much, they've driven a life-long Fomoco fan out of the fold. But where to go? ...

[syrtran]

I guess Ford could make a Cougar without Mercury

 

 

They do. It's called Mustang.

 

 

The Mustang is harsh, its never going to be a Cougar that is built upon style and speed.

Well, add a 3" increase in WB, put an IRS under it, and totally change the "boy-racer" styling...

 

They called the "chicklet" Cougar a Ford in Europe.

Are you referring to the Mondeo Coupe?

 

 

I was thinking, just make a Cougar and sell it at Lincoln dealers.

That would work, but the bigwigs would want it to have an Lincoln MKWhatever name, say, for example, MKR, and they would want it to have Lincoln pricing, say, around 45 - 50Gs, and, most importantly, it would have to have proper Lincoln power, which means it would have about 100 HP less than the equivalent Ford - the GT500.

[Fgts]

This is a wrong move, if making Mercury that diffrent could had been done cost wise. What they could had done imo is:

 

Have the Tracer come out with options and bodystyles not avalible on a Foucs (ex. an Ecoboost convetible or / and wagon with smaller lux styling)

 

Have an Stang based Cougar as the new flagship until a G/M replacement is made with options and styling not avalible on a Stang (ex: not being a Mustang, adult styling, an ecoboost v-6)

 

Mariner was good to go

 

Milan was good except engine chioces. Should had got a I-4 Ecoboost to seperated from Fusion

 

G/M should had got a 5.0 Muraduer package as an send off gift for the Panther platform.

 

Oh well.

[Chester]

My brother had one of the best Mercury's ever -- a 68 cougar 302. I learned to drive on that car, and am amazed I'm still around. My brother regrets getting rid of it, as he sold it to a neighbor collector. I bought a new Mercury Sable in 96. It was a decent car, but seriously, I would have been just as happy with a Tuarus.

 

I'm a little sad to see Mercury go, but in reallity it was time to put the company to sleep. The only products that I'd love to see would be a rehash of the Cougar, but that's not a reason to keep the car company alive. In reality, their were very few cars Mercury made that are at all memeorable since that 68 Cougar. The rest of linup is not at all needed. Milan -- Eh just get a fusion or MXZ. Mariner -- eh just get the Escape etc.

 

 

There's no room for Mercury now. I'd much rather see Ford and Lincoln with a larger lineup, than have Mercury sandwiched in between. Lincoln can get any development that was slated for Mercury now. I'd love to see a 3 series competitor from Lincoln. Love to see a five series compeitor from Lincoln. I think the new MKX will already be competitve with the CUV's from BMW and Audi.

 

How about a upscaled slighty stretched stang. High class with a drop down hardtop and IRS. The next generation stang will need to share it platform with some other vehicles. Lincoln should get this.

 

Lincoln really needs to drop the MK naming though. It's too confusing, and has no sense to it. The only thing that's different on any name is one letter. What does a T, X, Z, S stand for anyway?

[rmc523]

The MKS is a FLOP. The MKT? Who is supposed to buy that thing anyway? The Flex is also a failure and it looks like the T will follow.

 

You mean the same MKS that's one of the top sellers in it's segment?

 

Who's supposed to buy the MKT? The same people that buy any other large luxury brand crossover.

 

Flex has been discussed a billion times before - how is it a failure when it's profitable and has brought in very large percentages of new buyers to the Ford brand? It was never meant to be a huge seller - that 100,000/year figure was an "it could sell X" number, not the actual sales projection. It was released in the worst financial times in a very long while which I'm sure is limiting it's sales, even still. Flex was one of the first vehicles that represented what Ford could really do.

[lincmerc51]

You mean the same MKS that's one of the top sellers in it's segment?

 

Who's supposed to buy the MKT? The same people that buy any other large luxury brand crossover.

 

Flex has been discussed a billion times before - how is it a failure when it's profitable and has brought in very large percentages of new buyers to the Ford brand? It was never meant to be a huge seller - that 100,000/year figure was an "it could sell X" number, not the actual sales projection. It was released in the worst financial times in a very long while which I'm sure is limiting it's sales, even still. Flex was one of the first vehicles that represented what Ford could really do.

 

What else is in the "MKS segment"? Oldsmobile? Pontiac? Seriously, what does it compete with? And "one of the top sellers in its segment" really is not high praise.

 

Well, I wasn't here for all those Flex discussions. Ford must have been reading my predictions of they said Flex is "not supposed to be a huge seller". Why would they want a big success anyway?

 

MKT - I just dunno about that thing. And here I am a happy Navigator driver.

 

Have u seen any comparos on MKS or MKT? In the case of the S, the car is not rated very well at all. A typical Ford half-effort is what it is. Just good enough is good enough. Reviewers like the twin-turbo. They just don't lke what happens when the road curves.

[Edstock]

Have u seen any comparos on MKS

No, I haven't, and Google search doesn't list any. You obviously have, so could you please post some links to these comparos?

 

It will be interesting to see how the S compares to other full-size luxos like the 7-series, A-8, Cadillac, Lexus, whatever.

[jpd80]

Have u seen any comparos on MKS or MKT? In the case of the S, the car is not rated very well at all. A typical Ford half-effort is what it is. Just good enough is good enough. Reviewers like the twin-turbo. They just don't lke what happens when the road curves.

Why?

Because they want it to behave like a $70,000 7 Series or maybe a $62,000 CTS-V.

[rmc523]

What else is in the "MKS segment"? Oldsmobile? Pontiac? Seriously, what does it compete with? And "one of the top sellers in its segment" really is not high praise.

 

Well, I wasn't here for all those Flex discussions. Ford must have been reading my predictions of they said Flex is "not supposed to be a huge seller". Why would they want a big success anyway?

 

MKT - I just dunno about that thing. And here I am a happy Navigator driver.

 

Have u seen any comparos on MKS or MKT? In the case of the S, the car is not rated very well at all. A typical Ford half-effort is what it is. Just good enough is good enough. Reviewers like the twin-turbo. They just don't lke what happens when the road curves.

 

Oldsmobile, Pontiac, really? Well, since MKS is sorta between vehicles like E-class, 5-series, A6 and S-class, 7-series and A8, it arguably competes against all of those.

 

Ford never said "it's not supposed to be a top seller" - it just wasn't supposed to sell in huge numbers, and certainly not the 100,000 mark in this economy.

 

So a luxury sedan that is NOT a pure sport sedan doesn't handle extremely well in the curves? Big deal - it is NOT meant for that, even with the EB motor. Same with the MKT - it's not meant to be a Porsche Cayenne Turbo/S or a X5 M -- it is a luxury crossover.

[2005Explorer]

I expect Lincoln to die soon the way Mercury did. One of the biggest reasons they gave for dumping Mercury is the decline in sales over the years. If you look at Lincoln you will see the same kind of decline. Giving Lincoln a full line which includes small economy vehicles sitting next to larger luxury vehicles will only dilute the brand. Look at Chrysler if you want to see what happens to a luxury brand when it becomes a brand which tries to cater to both economy and luxury buyers. I think Ford's plan of using the Mercury brand for small economical (yet somewhat upscale) vehicles and leaving Lincoln for larger luxury vehicles was a better plan. Taking all of the vehicles that should have been Mercuries and slapping a Lincoln badge on them will not help the brand. If anything it will hurt it.

 

Just watch what happens over the next few years. The small Lincolns will not do well. People looking for small economical vehicles are also looking for the best price. Why pay thousands more for a Lincoln Focus when you can get the same car at your Ford dealer. People will pay more for larger, more powerful luxury vehicles that say "hey look at me!" but economy car buyers won't care if it has a Ford oval or a Lincoln logo on it.

 

Taking Lincoln down the path of trying to cater to all different markets won't do anything to help it. Sorry to be negative, but compact economical Lincolns are a TERRIBLE idea!

[rmc523]

I expect Lincoln to die soon the way Mercury did. One of the biggest reasons they gave for dumping Mercury is the decline in sales over the years. If you look at Lincoln you will see the same kind of decline. Giving Lincoln a full line which includes small economy vehicles sitting next to larger luxury vehicles will only dilute the brand. Look at Chrysler if you want to see what happens to a luxury brand when it becomes a brand which tries to cater to both economy and luxury buyers. I think Ford's plan of using the Mercury brand for small economical (yet somewhat upscale) vehicles and leaving Lincoln for larger luxury vehicles was a better plan. Taking all of the vehicles that should have been Mercuries and slapping a Lincoln badge on them will not help the brand. If anything it will hurt it.

 

Just watch what happens over the next few years. The small Lincolns will not do well. People looking for small economical vehicles are also looking for the best price. Why pay thousands more for a Lincoln Focus when you can get the same car at your Ford dealer. People will pay more for larger, more powerful luxury vehicles that say "hey look at me!" but economy car buyers won't care if it has a Ford oval or a Lincoln logo on it.

 

Taking Lincoln down the path of trying to cater to all different markets won't do anything to help it. Sorry to be negative, but compact economical Lincolns are a TERRIBLE idea!

 

 

Lincoln's sales have been increasing, though over the past months/years(?).

 

 

[FLLMTR]

I am disappointed to see Mercury get axed. Under the One Ford Plan, I imagine the Lincoln will be facing the same scenario soon. After all, if a Mustang GT can hit $42,000 with options, then what would a Lincoln have to cost in order to be "above" a Ford name plate?

[suv_guy_19]

Taking Lincoln down the path of trying to cater to all different markets won't do anything to help it. Sorry to be negative, but compact economical Lincolns are a TERRIBLE idea!

 

They are...that's why you don't make them economical. They should be luxury cars and carry luxury car prices.

[jpd80]

They are...that's why you don't make them economical. They should be luxury cars and carry luxury car prices.

Bearing in mind that the current C1 Focus has 2" more hip/shoulder room than current US Focus, Ford might even

be able to "Tempo" the Focus by increasing the wheelbase and making just under the limit for a Mid Sized vehicle.

[silvrsvt]

 

Taking Lincoln down the path of trying to cater to all different markets won't do anything to help it. Sorry to be negative, but compact economical Lincolns are a TERRIBLE idea!

 

 

It might be a terrible idea, but also you have to worry about CAFE ratings in the future...every little bit helps...and many Luxury makes are in serious trouble because they don't have small cars that get good MPG.