Ex-Ford Drivers in Toyotas

[bobbyd]

Bill Elliott, Dale Jarrett and now Mark Martin. Ford invested and supported these 3 drivers and made them rich and successful. So what are these EX-Ford drivers driving now....Toyotas! There is no loyalty in NASCAR....and there sure isn't any patriotism. Its all about the money. Unfortunately, true Ford fans who have all the memorable collections and memories are disappointed. As many of us know, Martin has his Toyota on the pole for todays race. Lets hope he fades fast...like Jarrett and Elliott did.

[transitman]

Bill Elliott, Dale Jarrett and now Mark Martin. Ford invested and supported these 3 drivers and made them rich and successful. So what are these EX-Ford drivers driving now....Toyotas! There is no loyalty in NASCAR....and there sure isn't any patriotism. Its all about the money. Unfortunately, true Ford fans who have all the memorable collections and memories are disappointed. As many of us know, Martin has his Toyota on the pole for todays race. Lets hope he fades fast...like Jarrett and Elliott did.

Money, money, money, money.....MONEY!

[Edstock]

Um, it's business. The drivers call it "The Show". If it seems rather venal at times, well, that's the way the France family and the movers and shakers in NASCAR want it.

 

Funny how them good ol' boys never really tried to make the FWD sleds work for racing. It would have solved a lot of problems, IMHO, but same-old, same-old prevailed, and we got decals for headlights and other "stock" features.

 

 

[Pioneer]

No patriotism? Didn't they leave Ford to drive an American car?

 

You know, the Camry. The car with the most American content, produced in American plant.

 

Now THAT is patriotism.

[Ron W.]

No patriotism? Didn't they leave Ford to drive an American car?

 

You know, the Camry. The car with the most American content, produced in American plant.

 

Now THAT is patriotism.

 

 

There you go again.... lol

[bifs66]

I've been following NASCAR for over fifty years now; and the Toyota thing doesn't bother me at all. After all, it gives Ford a chance to beat them on the racetrack. Additionally, it gives the bowtie guys some added competition. I do lament Bill Elliot and Mark Martin driving anything other than a Ford.. As a Ford fan, it was Bill Elliot who renewed my interest in NASCAR back in the early eighties.

[boominup]

I don't think "patriotism" has any thing to do with it....it's probably better than being in the unemployment line at their ages. They mostly only do testing on a part time basis, anyhow!

[Pioneer]

There you go again.... lol

 

Sometimes the truth hurts.

 

Stirring the pot......is just a bonus.

[kenp77]

Sometimes the truth hurts.

 

Stirring the pot......is just a bonus.

Well u did not say one thing that wasn't true

[fordtech1]

The Ex-Ford drivers don't really bother me as bad as a WWII veteran driving a Toyota truck!. I mean really? You do remember who was dropping bombs on you right?

 

Plus I am not even going to comment about the "Toyota Camry is the most American". Considering we are becoming other countries "China". I guess eventually we will be China's "China".

[Noah Harbinger]

The Ex-Ford drivers don't really bother me as bad as a WWII veteran driving a Toyota truck!. I mean really? You do remember who was dropping bombs on you right?

 

How many WWII veterans left are still capable of driving? I mean, the first post-war babies are now collecting social security checks, for chrysler's sake.

Edited March 5, 2012 by Noah Harbinger

[Ron W.]

How many WWII veterans left are still capable of driving? I mean, the first post-war babies are now collecting social security checks, for chrysler's sake.

 

 

At least one, my father at the age of 91 still drives and is of sound mind.

And yes he has purchased more than one Asian vehicle and one BMW that I know of.

[fordtech1]

How many WWII veterans left are still capable of driving? I mean, the first post-war babies are now collecting social security checks, for chrysler's sake.

 

Granted, less and less veterans of WWII are still around. However, I know of 3 guys who are still around driving.

I know everyone is free to purchase any vehicle they want, but for me any Military or Goverment official driving a non-american based company vehicle just seems wrong.

My grandfather was a Veteran and a huge Ford man, so I guess I learned from him.

[aneekr]

There is no loyalty in NASCAR....and there sure isn't any patriotism. Its all about the money.

Currently, NASCAR is an enterprise that exists to expressly enrich the France family, generation after generation. NASCAR fans, regardless of what auto manufacturers or teams they root for, should be more concerned about how NASCAR officials insult Southerners (the very people credited with NASCAR's provenience) by belittling symbols like the Battle Flag of the Confederacy and Second Navy Jack. The cancellation of Bubba Watson's parade lap in the General Lee prior to today's Sprint Cup Series race in Phoenix is a perfect example.

[mettech]

Granted, less and less veterans of WWII are still around. However, I know of 3 guys who are still around driving.

I know everyone is free to purchase any vehicle they want, but for me any Military or Government official driving a non-American based company vehicle just seems wrong.

My grandfather was a Veteran and a huge Ford man, so I guess I learned from him.

 

 

I would estimate that more than 60% of military members drive cars that are not from the Detroit 3. Officers skew that percent even more.

 

Since most of the military members deploy to Asia and/or Europe, we are exposed to more automobile brands than most American.

 

After driving on the autobahn in a BMW or a M-B.... any guess what that 20 year old troop will want to buy when they return to the States?

[4d4evr-1]

Bill Elliott, Dale Jarrett and now Mark Martin. Ford invested and supported these 3 drivers and made them rich and successful. So what are these EX-Ford drivers driving now....Toyotas! There is no loyalty in NASCAR....and there sure isn't any patriotism. Its all about the money. Unfortunately, true Ford fans who have all the memorable collections and memories are disappointed. As many of us know, Martin has his Toyota on the pole for todays race. Lets hope he fades fast...like Jarrett and Elliott did.

 

For years Ford has developed drivers only to lose them to other brands. Kasey Kane, Ryan Newman, Jeff Gordan and others left Ford. Maybe that is changing. Last week Penske announced he was coming back to Ford and it appears we will get up and comer Brad Keslowski. Maybe Ford has decided NASCAR is worth the money.

[akirby]

For years Ford has developed drivers only to lose them to other brands. Kasey Kane, Ryan Newman, Jeff Gordan and others left Ford. Maybe that is changing. Last week Penske announced he was coming back to Ford and it appears we will get up and comer Brad Keslowski. Maybe Ford has decided NASCAR is worth the money.

 

Manufacturers don't own teams nor do they hire race drivers. Race teams choose their drivers and their cars.

[twintornados]

Bill Elliott, Dale Jarrett and now Mark Martin. Three "has been" drivers who used to drive Fords. Ford invested and supported these 3 drivers and made them rich and successful. So what are these EX-Ford drivers driving now....Toyotas! There is no loyalty in NASCAR....and there sure isn't any patriotism. Its all about the money. Unfortunately, true Ford fans who have all the memorable collections and memories are disappointed. As many of us know, Martin has his Toyota on the pole for todays race. Lets hope he fades fast...like Jarrett and Elliott did.

Fixed it for ya...

[goinbroke2]

Wasn't a fan of Tony Stuart because he drove chebby. When he went to toyota I was impressed even less. Just found out he's back in a chebby and it's because he's a chebby guy. The only reason he drove a toyota is because that's what the "boss" changed to. When the contract was up a year later he went back to a chebby.

 

You know, after seeing that I can really respect the man.

The fact that he's not a "pretty boy" like that asswipe jeff gordon or the others makes it that much better.

 

I can appreciate a rival who is a standup guy.

 

Don't care who's driving, I want a ford to win.

[FordBuyer]

Manufacturers don't own teams nor do they hire race drivers. Race teams choose their drivers and their cars.

 

Race car drivers are hired guns and nothing more in most cases. It's difficult enough getting a ride and sponsorship money let alone getting in with one of the top teams with best chance of winning. Right now Ford's seem to be the best race cars in NASCAR, so I would imagine getting in with one of top Ford teams is quite a coup. If it becomes Toyota or Chevy, then I imagine the top drivers who can pull sponsorship money will be invited to join those teams. Sometimes being a good driver is not good enough either and the drivers know that. A good driver all of a sudden didn't have a car for the Daytona 500 because

Danica Patrick took his spot because she brought "Go Daddy" money and lots of PR with her. Loyalty works both ways. The drivers know it's a business most of all and they are expendable if they get in way of good business decision. So I wouldn't have any loyalty either...you go with team with best chance of winning. Right now it seems to be Ford with more cars than ever on NASCAR grid and more to come with Penske turning to Ford. He knows that new Ford engine is going to win some races. The top drivers just want to win and will go with whomever will get them into winner's circle.

[akirby]

Race car drivers are hired guns and nothing more in most cases. It's difficult enough getting a ride and sponsorship money let alone getting in with one of the top teams with best chance of winning. Right now Ford's seem to be the best race cars in NASCAR, so I would imagine getting in with one of top Ford teams is quite a coup. If it becomes Toyota or Chevy, then I imagine the top drivers who can pull sponsorship money will be invited to join those teams. Sometimes being a good driver is not good enough either and the drivers know that. A good driver all of a sudden didn't have a car for the Daytona 500 because

Danica Patrick took his spot because she brought "Go Daddy" money and lots of PR with her. Loyalty works both ways. The drivers know it's a business most of all and they are expendable if they get in way of good business decision. So I wouldn't have any loyalty either...you go with team with best chance of winning. Right now it seems to be Ford with more cars than ever on NASCAR grid and more to come with Penske turning to Ford. He knows that new Ford engine is going to win some races. The top drivers just want to win and will go with whomever will get them into winner's circle.

 

I submit that it's more about the teams and the engineering and car setup than it is about the driver and the manufacturer. When Chevy was dominating NASCAR recently it wasn't every Chevy - it was Hendricks and Childress. It's not Ford dominating - it's Roush. If a good driver gets a bad car they're in the back of the pack. If a bad driver gets a good car he/she runs up front - at least up until they cause a wreck.

 

Your driver only needs to be good enough not to wreck and be able to communicate to the crew chief so the car can be adjusted properly. You can't just outdrive the other guys in today's world.

[FordBuyer]

I submit that it's more about the teams and the engineering and car setup than it is about the driver and the manufacturer. When Chevy was dominating NASCAR recently it wasn't every Chevy - it was Hendricks and Childress. It's not Ford dominating - it's Roush. If a good driver gets a bad car they're in the back of the pack. If a bad driver gets a good car he/she runs up front - at least up until they cause a wreck.

 

Your driver only needs to be good enough not to wreck and be able to communicate to the crew chief so the car can be adjusted properly. You can't just outdrive the other guys in today's world.

 

I agree somewhat, but there is still an element to who the driver is. Certainly Jimmy Johnson won for three straight years, and while car, team, and crew chief were important, Johnson still won it three years in row which was and still is almost unbelievable no matter who the team is backing him up. The odds of that happening have to be super long. When it doesn't matter who the driver is anymore, I know I will have no interest in pro racing anymore whatsoever. For example, in ALMS last year, Porsche was overmatched as in being outpowered in GT class, and still won because of the exceptional driving talents of Patrick Long and Jorge Bergmeister. Bergmeister in particular drove one of the best races I've ever seen at the Petite Lemans at Road Atlanta last fall. The dude is fearless and still figured out a way to pass a faster car in front of him after over 11 hours of racing on last lap of race and won. He was not going to be denied, even down a lot of torque and higher up acceleration. He set up the faster car in front and looked for the one spot on course where he could pass and stay in front somehow. On that day, he was the best race driver in the world. Rally drivers also have unbelievable skill. Right up there with extreme skiers who ski off the side of freakin cliffs and live to tell about it.

[akirby]

Certainly Jimmy Johnson (in a Hendricks Motorsports car) won for three FIVE straight years, and while car, team, and crew chief were important, Johnson (in a Hendricks Motorsports car) still won it three FIVE years in row which was and still is almost unbelievable no matter who the team is backing him up.

 

Fixed it for ya.

 

The dude is fearless and still figured out a way to pass a faster car in front of him after over 11 hours of racing on last lap of race and won. He was not going to be denied, even down a lot of torque and higher up acceleration. He set up the faster car in front and looked for the one spot on course where he could pass and stay in front somehow. On that day, he was the best race driver in the world. Rally drivers also have unbelievable skill. Right up there with extreme skiers who ski off the side of freakin cliffs and live to tell about it.

 

Agreed. But none of those skills apply to NASCAR oval racing. In road racing you can take a car that's off a little and drive it fast with skill. In NASCAR if your car is pushing a little or it's too loose you're toast and it doesn't matter who you are. If all it took was skill and guts then Kyle Busch would win every race.

[FordBuyer]

Fixed it for ya.

 

 

 

Agreed. But none of those skills apply to NASCAR oval racing. In road racing you can take a car that's off a little and drive it fast with skill. In NASCAR if your car is pushing a little or it's too loose you're toast and it doesn't matter who you are. If all it took was skill and guts then Kyle Busch would win every race.

 

I don't remember saying it was all about the skill and guts of the driver only, but I did say it was part of the winning equation. If it was all about TEAM and CAR only, then Roush/Fenway wouldn't have laid out millions of extra dollars to keep Carl Edwards from bolting to Joe Gibbs racing or wherever else. I know that if I was a billonaire race car owner and had great car and crew chief/pit guys under contract, I would also want the best race car driver I could find as it is part of the equation. One can argue how important, but whatever it is still part of the equation. You say very little, and I say a fair amount. I would want someone who is fast, very smooth, easy on equipment, good judgement and temperament, and proven, seasoned record. No hotheads like Busch need apply. If I could have anyone, it would probably be either Johnson or Edwards in NASCAR. Kenseth wouldn't be a bad second choice.

[akirby]

I don't remember saying it was all about the skill and guts of the driver only, but I did say it was part of the winning equation. If it was all about TEAM and CAR only, then Roush/Fenway wouldn't have laid out millions of extra dollars to keep Carl Edwards from bolting to Joe Gibbs racing or wherever else. I know that if I was a billonaire race car owner and had great car and crew chief/pit guys under contract, I would also want the best race car driver I could find as it is part of the equation. One can argue how important, but whatever it is still part of the equation. You say very little, and I say a fair amount. I would want someone who is fast, very smooth, easy on equipment, good judgement and temperament, and proven, seasoned record. No hotheads like Busch need apply. If I could have anyone, it would probably be either Johnson or Edwards in NASCAR. Kenseth wouldn't be a bad second choice.

 

The driver is important in that they take care of the equipment, stay out of wrecks and communicate well with the crew chief about the setup of the car. And they do need a certain level of driving skill.

 

Today's cars are so much easier to drive than they used to be and the lap times are so much closer than they used to be. Remember when 2 or 3 cars would be a lap ahead of the field? Now you routinely finish a 500 mile race with 30 cars on the lead lap.