Iiari Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Interesting Motor Trend comparison test online today with the Azera, Avalon, and Maxima. Lincoln, as you can read below, declined involvement: Everything appeared set. Except that our request to the Lincoln Motor Company for a MKZ test example was declined. Huh? Lincoln P.R. declared the MKZ must be compared with "premium brands," not mere hoi polloi Hyundais and Toyotas. But -- how to put this politely? -- doesn't the MKZ ride on the Ford Fusion's equally populist foundation? That didn't seem to impress them. So we asked for a Taurus. Ford's P.R. team responded that this also wouldn't be possible. OK, then. Four hours after we subsequently rang Nissan for an appropriate Maxima, its keys were slapped on our desk. That's confidence. Nissan's big sedan is now long in the tooth and short on burger-fed American room, but you've got to love the chutzpah of having "four-door sports car" decals on its side windows. I have to say, if I were Lincoln, given the very mixed reviews and general media negativity towards Lincoln that have been expressed so far, I'm not sure I would have participated in this either. But, honestly (saying this as someone who is likely buying a new MKZ Hybrid as my next car), exactly what "premium brands" do the Lincoln folks want to go up against in a comparison test? All conquering Audi? BMW? I think the Azera and Avalon (along with various Buicks and Acuras) are its natural competitors. Maybe the Volvo S60 also. What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKII Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 I hope it is Ford saying fack you MotorTrend 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Would Motor Trend dare to call the Lexus ES's underpinnings "populist"? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
md3184 Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 The mkz beat the bmw m5 in a slalom test performed by edmunds and widely reported b/c of the test car's super sport tires (not standard). I don't think the avalon, azera, and maxima are natural competitors b/c none of those are luxury brands (toyota, nissan, and hynduia). A better benchmark would be any entry level luxury sedan. For instance, the audi A4, bmw 3 series, caddilac ATS, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Why would an MKZ be involved with this comparison? But the request to review the Taurus alongside these cars seems more reasonable and probably should have been granted, but this is Motor Trend we're talking about here, don't trust a thing they say! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettech Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ormond Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Being realistic, I think the Avalon and Azera are natural competitors to the MKZ. I am sorry the MKZ didn't participate. One could also include the CTS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tanner83 Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 According to Lincoln here are the MKZ's competitors..... Drum Roll.................. 2013 Lexus ES 2013 Cadillac ATS 2012 Cadillac CTS Sport Sedan 2012 Acura TL 2012 Infiniti G37 Sedan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 According to Lincoln here are the MKZ's competitors..... Drum Roll.................. 2013 Lexus ES 2013 Cadillac ATS 2012 Cadillac CTS Sport Sedan 2012 Acura TL 2012 Infiniti G37 Sedan I'm surprised Audi A6 isn't in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serraph Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 I'm surprised Audi A6 isn't in there. I thought it would be the A4 more, the A6 would be along the lines of MKS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Being realistic, I think the Avalon and Azera are natural competitors to the MKZ. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2b2 Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 ^ MKS is A8 sized Interesting Motor Trend comparison test online today with the Azera, Avalon, and Maxima. Lincoln, as you can read below, declined involvement: I have to say, if I were Lincoln, given the very mixed reviews and general media negativity towards Lincoln that have been expressed so far, I'm not sure I would have participated in this either. But, honestly (saying this as someone who is likely buying a new MKZ Hybrid as my next car), exactly what "premium brands" do the Lincoln folks want to go up against in a comparison test? All conquering Audi? BMW? I think the Azera and Avalon (along with various Buicks and Acuras) are its natural competitors. Maybe the Volvo S60 also. What do you think? imho Lincoln shoulda said, "Would you like a Navigator instead?" imho 'official' comparos need to between *like* vehicles & imho practically the only direct Z-competitors are the ES and A6. As I said elsewhere-or-before, would LOVE to see every Z model up against EVERY A6-S6-RS6-whatever6 model (with identical tires switched both ways TOO) I hope it is Ford saying fack you MotorTrend Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 (edited) Critics have not been impressed by the MKZ, I don't think the car would fair favorably in any comparo sorry to say. This is a car meant for buyers, not critics who are clearly prejudiced and pissed off that Lincoln isn't towing the Germanic RWD line like Caddy. There is no room in this world for non-conformists! Edited February 12, 2013 by BORG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All-Or-Nothing Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 (edited) Good job Lincoln......very wise choice. Next thing they should do is BAN Edmunds from recieving any Lincolns or Fords for testing. Tell them to kick rocks until they make a retraction for that "handling package" fiasco. Sidenote.....That Azera is sexy as hell. Wouldn't mind getting one for Daily Duty. Edited February 12, 2013 by All-Or-Nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Color me confused in that I had no idea Maxima, Avalon, and Azera were luxury cars in their respective luxury division. Yes, Taurus would be only vehicle Ford offers that would be in same or similar class as Avalon and Maxima. So don't blame Ford for refusing MT request to include a Lincoln in non luxury segment comparo. Lincoln would be placed in nonwin position. If it wins, it should have as it's a luxury car, and if it loses, it's embarassing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stentgraft95 Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Color me confused in that I had no idea Maxima, Avalon, and Azera were luxury cars in their respective luxury division. Yes, Taurus would be only vehicle Ford offers that would be in same or similar class as Avalon and Maxima. So don't blame Ford for refusing MT request to include a Lincoln in non luxury segment comparo. Lincoln would be placed in nonwin position. If it wins, it should have as it's a luxury car, and if it loses, it's embarassing. Agreed! This was a set-up coming out of the gate. Chumming the waters for another article that asks what in the heck Lincoln is doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Good for Lincoln Motor Company..... :banvictory: ...Under Anus MacKenzies watch, that magazine has gone off the rails and now bows and prays to Japan and Germany and regurgitates their dogma with religious zeal... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Good for Lincoln Motor Company..... :banvictory: ...Under Anus MacKenzies watch, that magazine has gone off the rails and now bows and prays to Japan and Germany and regurgitates their dogma with religious zeal... I was just reading the latest edition of MT and love how they pitted a Camaro SS against the Mustang GT, even with track pack option. They never mentioned how terrible the Camaro interior looks, but did mention how hard it is to see out of it. I will give them that. They even admitted though that a better match up would be the Boss 302 Laguna Seca vs. the SS. I agree. It is time for a new Mustang and new chassis though that is coming. Another point I disagree with is MT stating that the Camaro is a bette vehicle for all around use. Nah, not with that terrrible interior and pinched outward visibility. MT said something about a whine at highway speed on the Mustang. Don't know what that is about, but MT is pretty consistent with a bias against Ford that always seems to tinge their reviews in some way. I really believe these reviewers/auto journalits/reporters go into reviews with biases against certain manufacturers no matter how good the vehicle is. The Camaro has a more modern chassis, and Chevy makes wonderful small block V8s. I will give them that. However, the Ford 302 V8 is wonderful also, and the Mustang is better looking and has much better interior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgman Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 (edited) Being realistic, I think the Avalon and Azera are natural competitors to the MKZ. I am sorry the MKZ didn't participate. One could also include the CTS. Well, for one, I wouldn't have considered either personally. The closest competitor is the ES Lexus. Edited February 12, 2013 by xgman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 (edited) I was just reading the latest edition of MT and love how they pitted a Camaro SS against the Mustang GT, even with track pack option. They never mentioned how terrible the Camaro interior looks, but did mention how hard it is to see out of it. I will give them that. They even admitted though that a better match up would be the Boss 302 Laguna Seca vs. the SS. I agree. It is time for a new Mustang and new chassis though that is coming. Another point I disagree with is MT stating that the Camaro is a bette vehicle for all around use. Nah, not with that terrrible interior and pinched outward visibility. MT said something about a whine at highway speed on the Mustang. Don't know what that is about, but MT is pretty consistent with a bias against Ford that always seems to tinge their reviews in some way. I really believe these reviewers/auto journalits/reporters go into reviews with biases against certain manufacturers no matter how good the vehicle is. The Camaro has a more modern chassis, and Chevy makes wonderful small block V8s. I will give them that. However, the Ford 302 V8 is wonderful also, and the Mustang is better looking and has much better interior. That said, I wager the GT with Brembo/Track Pack is more then able to take on the SS. The BOSS simply removes a lot of fluff that the GT has making it a superior daily-driver or Sports car then muscle car IMO. Autoguide, Autoblog, Automobile, heck even C&D give the GT credit wile falling over the BOSS as a top 10. If the 'haters' like it...I don't know. I loved my time in a GT convertible a while back. I'd be happy with a GT in my driveway. I wish you could get the interior trim package and the Recaros together. BTT: BZ Lincoln for passing this one. A ES, A4, 325 and a ATS IMHO. Edited February 13, 2013 by Hugh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Color me confused in that I had no idea Maxima, Avalon, and Azera were luxury cars in their respective luxury division. Yes, Taurus would be only vehicle Ford offers that would be in same or similar class as Avalon and Maxima. So don't blame Ford for refusing MT request to include a Lincoln in non luxury segment comparo. Lincoln would be placed in nonwin position. If it wins, it should have as it's a luxury car, and if it loses, it's embarassing. Ford should have provided a Taurus Limited or SHO. If the others brought a Infiniti, Lexus and Genesis, then show up with a MKS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2b2 Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 BTT: BZ Lincoln for passing this one. A ES, A4, 325 and a ATS IMHO. so would you say there's no need for a LincStang since you also put the Z up against those 3 smaller sportier cars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 so would you say there's no need for a LincStang since you also put the Z up against those 3 smaller sportier cars? Well, I think of those he mentioned, only the 3 series comes in a 2-door body style now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 so would you say there's no need for a LincStang since you also put the Z up against those 3 smaller sportier cars? I didn't say anything of the sort. AFAIK, The size of the cars are different. A4, 3 Series (4 series if you are a coupe) and ATS are larger then compacts © but not as large as a mid-size (C/D). The ES is on the Avalon which is in full-size (D segment). I think if you compare the 5-series and A6 for example, the MKZ would be too small. I also think they stray into the D segment as well. The 7-series and A8 are going into E segment. Again, IIRC. So, I see a 325 with the 2.0L Turbo and MKZ with EB20. ATS with it's 3.6 vs. ES 3.3 V6 vs. MKZ D37 for example. That's my thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traxiii Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 I was just reading the latest edition of MT and love how they pitted a Camaro SS against the Mustang GT, even with track pack option. They never mentioned how terrible the Camaro interior looks, but did mention how hard it is to see out of it. I will give them that. They even admitted though that a better match up would be the Boss 302 Laguna Seca vs. the SS. I agree. It is time for a new Mustang and new chassis though that is coming. Another point I disagree with is MT stating that the Camaro is a bette vehicle for all around use. Nah, not with that terrrible interior and pinched outward visibility. MT said something about a whine at highway speed on the Mustang. Don't know what that is about, but MT is pretty consistent with a bias against Ford that always seems to tinge their reviews in some way. I really believe these reviewers/auto journalits/reporters go into reviews with biases against certain manufacturers no matter how good the vehicle is. The Camaro has a more modern chassis, and Chevy makes wonderful small block V8s. I will give them that. However, the Ford 302 V8 is wonderful also, and the Mustang is better looking and has much better interior. Take the difference in price of the cars they tested and install bigger tires and brakes in the Mustang and it's a dead heat. There testers aren't very good either, as I've seen better 1/4 mile times for the GT all over the place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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