mackinaw Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 More on our favorite topic. From today's Automotive News: DETROIT -- Ford's compact Ranger pickup is gone, but for many dealers it's not forgotten. "I think there's definitely a need," said Martin Gubbels, owner of Big Sky Ford-Lincoln in Torrington, Wyo., who said he has many customers who would love a pickup smaller than the F-150. Ford discontinued its small pickup in 2011 amid dwindling sales and has stuck to a one-pickup strategy since. "Here in truck country," said Gubbels, "I took as many as I could get my hands on" in 2011, when Ford was winding down Ranger sales. Gubbels recently took a 2011 Ranger with 6,500 miles in trade and says it's worth as much now as it was when new. "There's a message right there," he says. Ford "gave up a nice little chunk of market share they were once dominant in." Full article here: http://www.autonews.com/article/20130304/RETAIL07/303049980/some-ford-dealers-miss-small-pickup#axzz2MaIuUF16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 I guess this goes with the ole saying...the dealers might make money on the sale, but it wasn't making Ford any money. I'm sure some dealerships missed the CV because it sold to greatest generation well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 (edited) I guess this goes with the ole saying...the dealers might make money on the sale, but it wasn't making Ford any money. I'm sure some dealerships missed the CV because it sold to greatest generation well. Exactly. It's not that there isn't a market or that Ford couldn't sell them. It's just not cost effective for Ford to stay in or go back to that market right now. I also wonder how many folks bought new Rangers as opposed to used ones (like the panthers). Edited March 4, 2013 by akirby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 I believe it's inevitable that Ford will have a compact pickup someday, but I also believe they will be late to the party and never dominate that segment again, one that will grow as new CAFE standards kick in and fuel prices and taxes on fuel continue to go up. USA Frank in comments section of article says it best: "Ford just doesn't get it. They keep saying the F150 gets as good gas mileage as smaller trucks. This may be true, but some truck buyers don't want or feel comfortable driving something as bloated as what passes for a "full size" (read: "oversize") pickup today. They want something they can get into or reach into the bed without having to have steps built into it. They want something they can drive in traffic without feeling like they need pilot vehicles on either side guiding them. And they want something they can park in the garage without having to build an extension on it.Is that the majority of truck buyers? Nope. But there certainly seems to be enough of us to keep the Toyota Tacoma and Nissan Frontier in business." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabfordeb Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 (edited) the autonews comparison is misleading - the F-150 regular cab with a 6.5 ft bed has a 126" wheelbase, not 145", which is very close to the Ranger and why some, like me, bought the regular cab F-150 instead of a Ranger at the same price. and it fits in my garage. Edited March 4, 2013 by fabfordeb 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 I believe it's inevitable that Ford will have a compact pickup someday, but I also believe they will be late to the party and never dominate that segment again, one that will grow as new CAFE standards kick in and fuel prices and taxes on fuel continue to go up. They won't be late to the party - they'll be early to the party with a true compact pickup that offers the better fuel economy that you mentioned. The current crop of "compact" pickups do not offer that type of fuel economy and never will - they're too big and too heavy with too much capacity. Sales didn't go up with high fuel prices hit a few years ago - why would you think it would happen now? What people think and what actually happens in the market can be totally different. Look at what Ford did with Transit Connect - that's the blueprint for a successful compact pickup - not T6 Ranger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScapeTom Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 Bring back the original 3000-ish pound Ranger with the same engine selection and towing capacity as today's Escape and it will sell. The most recent Ranger offers less capability than the F-150 for almost the same gas consumption, and almost the same price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traxiii Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 What kind of mileage does the World Ranger get with those diesels? How hard would be to design a pickup out of the Transit Connect platform? I would think it could be a quick fix, even if it was more Ranchero like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 What kind of mileage does the World Ranger get with those diesels? How hard would be to design a pickup out of the Transit Connect platform? I would think it could be a quick fix, even if it was more Ranchero like. Diesel would be a 2-3K up sell...driving the price up closer to the F-150. The issue with the TC is that its not the USA being built (yet) and would be subjected to the chicken tax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 They won't be late to the party - they'll be early to the party with a true compact pickup that offers the better fuel economy that you mentioned. The current crop of "compact" pickups do not offer that type of fuel economy and never will - they're too big and too heavy with too much capacity. Sales didn't go up with high fuel prices hit a few years ago - why would you think it would happen now? What people think and what actually happens in the market can be totally different. Look at what Ford did with Transit Connect - that's the blueprint for a successful compact pickup - not T6 Ranger. Hmm, GM coming out with new compact pickup next year, Chrysler following, probable refresh/redesign of Tacoma and Frontier, and if small/smaller pickup sales look more promising, Ford will follow 2-3 years after that. I call that late to the party. Again, it's not even as much about fuel mileage as smaller footprint. If the Atlas concept is to be believed, the next F-150 will be even larger albeit lighter. However, I don't believe Ford will be able to pull 750 pounds weight out of it. Maybe 400 pounds, but I will have to see 750 pounds to believe it. Ford also values commercial/fleet sales big time and the Ranger did well at that with smaller companies that didn't want or need full sized pickups. With that being said, I have no problem with Ford developing small pickup off of TC platform. Fine, but don't wait for GM and Chrysler sales to see if it will fly. Ford created the small cargo van segment, makes sense to stay in small pickup segment also especially when it takes 2-3 years to get one into dealership after green lighting it. Ford has small, entry level vehicle in every segment just about except for small pickup, and Ford is pickup king. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 my 2cents, this segment has a golden oppurtunity, IMO theres a LARGE youth market to be attacked, Surfers, ATV'ers, and the 250 trailbikers ... gravy would be weekend Home Depot Warriers like myself....get it right cosmetically, under pin with the 1.6 and 2.0 ecos, and have a 4x4 version...if it IS good enough, it could be a segment buster...just leave out massaging seats, leather, sunroofs and MFT, a good stereo and Sync is probably enough....want more?...how about my constant wishh..plug and play items such as Nav etc etc etc..... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 The question always comes back to whether Ford is better off spending resources on current vehicle plans or diverting some of that to provision for T6 Ranger in North America. Could it be that not chasing Mid Sized Truck market saves Ford more money than it would ever make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 my 2cents, this segment has a golden oppurtunity, IMO theres a LARGE youth market to be attacked, Surfers, ATV'ers, and the 250 trailbikers ... gravy would be weekend Home Depot Warriers like myself....get it right cosmetically, under pin with the 1.6 and 2.0 ecos, and have a 4x4 version...if it IS good enough, it could be a segment buster...just leave out massaging seats, leather, sunroofs and MFT, a good stereo and Sync is probably enough....want more?...how about my constant wishh..plug and play items such as Nav etc etc etc..... So you remember the Ranger Splash and the bright colors it came in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted March 4, 2013 Author Share Posted March 4, 2013 my 2cents, this segment has a golden oppurtunity, IMO theres a LARGE youth market to be attacked, Surfers, ATV'ers, and the 250 trailbikers ... gravy would be weekend Home Depot Warriers like myself....get it right cosmetically, under pin with the 1.6 and 2.0 ecos, and have a 4x4 version...if it IS good enough, it could be a segment buster...just leave out massaging seats, leather, sunroofs and MFT, a good stereo and Sync is probably enough....want more?...how about my constant wishh..plug and play items such as Nav etc etc etc..... Ford should put you in charge of Product Planning. This is exactly the kind of vehicle that would be a big hit where I live. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 I would wait for the next F-150 before assuming Ford isn't fulfilling needs on the low-end. Also, like a minivan, Ford just doesn't have the the pieces lined-up right now to build the vehicle and do it affordably and sustainably. Ford can't afford to be in every market, just because it exists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 The question always comes back to whether Ford is better off spending resources on current vehicle plans or diverting some of that to provision for T6 Ranger in North America. Could it be that not chasing Mid Sized Truck market saves Ford more money than it would ever make. if such a vehicle could sprout off a current undercarriage...ie Escape 90% of the jobs already done, now just add an attractive "trucky" top hat, beef up the underpinnings, nix most of the Fluff bar the essentials, ( even carpet ) and maybe bring back a Bronco II variant......just throwin it out there.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 I would wait for the next F-150 before assuming Ford isn't fulfilling needs on the low-end. Also, like a minivan, Ford just doesn't have the the pieces lined-up right now to build the vehicle and do it affordably and sustainably. Ford can't afford to be in every market, just because it exists. meanwhile tolerate $50000 window stickers...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 meanwhile tolerate $50000 window stickers...... not all F-150s go for $50K And those stripper mini trucklet your talking about wouldn't make that much if any in the way of profit IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 not all F-150s go for $50K And those stripper mini trucklet your talking about wouldn't make that much if any in the way of profit IMO I think profit would be in line with the Focus. Not great, but some... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 I think profit would be in line with the Focus. Not great, but some... At 16K it wouldn't make $$$ but if it was in the 22-25K range, there is no reason why it couldn't make $$$ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 At 16K it wouldn't make $$$ but if it was in the 22-25K range, there is no reason why it couldn't make $$$ Just like the Focus. Starts at $16k, but add some options and watch Ford rake in the $$$$! And I'm with Dean starting off with the Escape. It doesn't have to be uber-trucky, just trucky-ish. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 (edited) My Dad was a former Ranger owner, he now owns a 2011 F-150 XLT with the 3.7L V6. It stickered for $27K, the same as his previous Ranger...and it gets much better gas mileage while being substantially more capable. Edited March 4, 2013 by BORG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 not all F-150s go for $50K And those stripper mini trucklet your talking about wouldn't make that much if any in the way of profit IMO maybe not, but would help CAFE and steal sales from SOMEONE...sub 25k should be the target, sub 28 for a 4x4 with a DECENT level of equipment...read, no power seats, no butt warmers, no MyFord touch, simple A/c, no leather ( hell vinyl benchs could make a re-appearance ) lower the content, just windows, locks, cruise, tilt and a reasonable REPLACEABLE stereo, give us BACK some simplicity and something the Malboro Man could be seen in...IMO theres WAY too much BS on some vehicles that have lost sight of their initial purpose.....so, simple, tough and truckie looking....anyone/ thing else out there tick those three boxes?... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 My Dad was a former Ranger owner, he now owns a 2011 F-150 XLT with the 3.7L V6. It stickered for $27K, the same as his previous Ranger...and it gets much better gas mileage while being substantially more capable. I can see the argument about size, but IIRC the difference between a Super Cab Ranger and most 6ft bed length F-150s is a difference of less then 20 inches...its a decent difference but at the same time not that more "huge" or whatever you want to call it. Yes the F-150 is wider and taller, but its not Mosteriously bigger (outside of a 8 foot bed) then a Super Cab Ranger....if you can't adjust for 10 inches give or take between the front and rear of the truck...you might have issues. I find the standard cab Ranger impossible to get into, and if anything, any changes to make the standard cab more accommodating would make the newer Ranger bigger and closer in size to the F-150 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 My Dad was a former Ranger owner, he now owns a 2011 F-150 XLT with the 3.7L V6. It stickered for $27K, the same as his previous Ranger...and it gets much better gas mileage while being substantially more capable. and its STILL oversized...now imagine at that same price a similarly equipped 4x4 2.0 eco-boost light duty mini truck ( or midi ) and theres the exact crossover point to give viable choices....I know what my choice would be... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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