fuzzymoomoo Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 Go back to your Saturday morning cartoons child. Oh please, I'm not the one throwing a hissy fit because Ford won't cater to my specific desires Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 Do you think an E150 and an E550 share anything more than a cab? The chassis under each is as different as night and day. I still believe that Ford will make a "Transit-style" cab (Transit green house on a modified floor pan) to fit on an updated E450-E550 chassis and will likely ditch the twin-I-beam front suspension on those chassis still using it.... Just the other day on the NYS Thruway near Syracuse, I saw what looked like 20 E-Series chassis cabs heading east ( was going west), presumably to a motorhome upfitter as there are several out near Albany that make them...They were being towed "piggy back" style five or six to a tow vehicle. They ain't dead yet.....lol. Didn't have time to do an exact count or get the cam out.... I thought the game plane was OAP continues to crank out E 350/450 cut-aways for the high end GVW range in addition to new 650/750. Depending on contniued sales of those units, a decision would be made as to what the next step would be. I always had the impression the door was being left open on just how the high end of the GVW scale would be handled. Or did I miss something? By the way, E 550 has been dead for a long time and I don't think they were built for more than a year or two. Solid I beam/leaf spring front end if my memory is right. Dealer friend of mine was really bummed out as he started building a good customer base with those trucks with repeat customers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 (edited) February production figures: E Series 5,518 (13,286) Transit 8,862 By the looks of it there's still plenty of demand for those bigger E Series Cutaways. Edited March 21, 2015 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F250 Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 (edited) Oh please, I'm not the one throwing a hissy fit because Ford won't cater to my specific desires No "hissy fit" I'm just stating my options and you know everyone has one. You disagree with me? Good. It can get boring around here sometimes with all these cheerleaders. But don't throw up some asinine cartoon on every post I make becaise thats childish. Edited March 21, 2015 by F250 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F250 Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 Nobody expected Transit to cover everything, In 150 to 350 vans, Transit flat out kills E Series dead for versatility and fuel efficiency. E series was actually two platforms but it's clear you didn't know that... It's also why Ford kept the E450 Cutaways going for now.. Damn the Transit is a brand new design it had better offer something over the old E on the light side of the range. E-Series same cab and different chassis depending on rating yet built same plant/line. Back on topic it appears I'm the only one here that likes the earlier picture of the F250/350. Oh well, nonconformist I guess... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 Damn the Transit is a brand new design it had better offer something over the old E on the light side of the range. E-Series same cab and different chassis depending on rating yet built same plant/line. It does, up to 20% better fuel economy which is big news for fleets, even better again when the 3.2 diesel arrives. There are no plans to do away with the larger versions of E Series. if anything, they should receive engine/gearbox upgrades in the near future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 It does, up to 20% better fuel economy which is big news for fleets, even better again when the 3.2 diesel arrives. There are no plans to do away with the larger versions of E Series. if anything, they should receive engine/gearbox upgrades in the near future. The E-series should be fully retired by 2020, there are no more upgrades planned, AFAIK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 (edited) The E-series should be fully retired by 2020, there are no more upgrades planned, AFAIK. You're saying that the E 450 cutaways will go unchanged for another five years, are there enough 5.4 2V and 6.8 2V engines left to do that? On the strength of it, either the engines and gearboxes get upgraded to new SD units or the E450 CA will surely disappear in the near future... Edited March 24, 2015 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 You're saying that the E 450 cutaways will go unchanged for another five years, are there enough 5.4 2V and 6.8 2V engines left to do that? On the strength of it, either the engines and gearboxes get upgraded to new SD units or the E450 CA will surely disappear in the near future... this is what I heard over in the other discussion. Ford has to have a Succession plan for the E450. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 (edited) this is what I heard over in the other discussion. Ford has to have a Succession plan for the E450. That's what I'm thinking. In February, Avon Lake built over 5,500 E Series vehicles, presumably Cutaways. There's still a healthy demand with sales roughly equalling that production number. Fingers crossed that a Brownfield development based on next gen SD components will lead to a fresh E 450 line up. Edited March 25, 2015 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 (edited) How did a 2017 SD thread turn into this mess??? Off topic much? Edited March 25, 2015 by blwnsmoke 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 How did a 2017 SD thread turn into this mess??? Off topic much? Any thread over 3 pages is guaranteed to get off topic or down right mean. Rule #1A of the interwebs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Here's an interesting thought; 2014 F250 XLT 4x2 Crew cab 6.75 box 6.2 V8 = 6,441 lbs (steel body) 2014 F150 XLT 4x2 Crew cab 6.5 box 6.2 V8 = 5,607 lbs (steel body) I'm no Einstein but if the next F250 Crew cab loses around 600 or 700 lbs weight thanks to a new Aluminum body then that will make the weight of the new F250 fairly close to the just superseded steel body F150. Ford could then quite easily add either the 5.0 V8 or Ecoboost 3.5 V6 and really mix things up.. In that instance, i suspect that a lot more buyers may be drawn to the F250..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F250 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 How did a 2017 SD thread turn into this mess??? Off topic much? ADD I tried to bring it back last post. The picture was posted, I liked it nobody else does. Some called it a Chevy. Biker suggested the Transit van cab be used on a truck frame. It got stupid. That's the recap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F250 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Here's an interesting thought; 2014 F250 XLT 4x2 Crew cab 6.75 box 6.2 V8 = 6,441 lbs (steel body) 2014 F150 XLT 4x2 Crew cab 6.5 box 6.2 V8 = 5,607 lbs (steel body) I'm no Einstein but if the next F250 Crew cab loses around 600 or 700 lbs weight thanks to a new Aluminum body then that will make the weight of the new F250 fairly close to the just superseded steel body F150. Ford could then quite easily add either the 5.0 V8 or Ecoboost 3.5 V6 and really mix things up.. In that instance, i suspect that a lot more buyers may be drawn to the F250..... And it would make sense if the new SD shares the cab with the F150 with a different front clip like the Ram. Same cab and interior would save quite a bit of expense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 And it would make sense if the new SD shares the cab with the F150 with a different front clip like the Ram. Same cab and interior would save quite a bit of expense. And as confirmed by Pioneer, the cab / framing is common with F150, the front is different as per your remarks but the stamping and sub assembly build process means that some parts will be completed before shipping to KTP. Exciting times for Ford as it slowly rolls out aluminum bodies across F150, next SD and then Expedition/Navigator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Here's an interesting thought; 2014 F250 XLT 4x2 Crew cab 6.75 box 6.2 V8 = 6,441 lbs (steel body) 2014 F150 XLT 4x2 Crew cab 6.5 box 6.2 V8 = 5,607 lbs (steel body) I'm no Einstein but if the next F250 Crew cab loses around 600 or 700 lbs weight thanks to a new Aluminum body then that will make the weight of the new F250 fairly close to the just superseded steel body F150. Ford could then quite easily add either the 5.0 V8 or Ecoboost 3.5 V6 and really mix things up.. In that instance, i suspect that a lot more buyers may be drawn to the F250..... Bingo! I don't think we will see the 5.0, but I think the EcoBoost is a real possibility. The weight savings will be a tremendous help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 (edited) Bingo! I don't think we will see the 5.0, but I think the EcoBoost is a real possibility. The weight savings will be a tremendous help. The weight reduction puts gasoline engines back into the picture, Ford may get another easy 3,000 or 4,000 sales a month. At the moment, F250 and F350 sales are around 16,000/ mth and 8,000/mth respectively with F250 being 60-40 diesel-gasoline mix and F350 being 75-25 diesel-gasoline mix. So there's a great opportunity to influence F250 buyers with gasoline options. Looking at the competition, Silverado 2500 still uses the 6.0 Vortec with 360 hp/380 lb ft - sound Familiar? How about Ram 2500 with 5.7 Hemi - 383 hp / 400 lb ft ? both of those engines are less powerful than Ford's 6.2 and closer to the new F150 5.0 V8's 380 hp/387 lb ft, so the 5.0 could be on the table with a lighter F250, the more powerful Ecoboost 3.5 would be a natural.. Edited March 25, 2015 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 The weight reduction puts gasoline engines back into the picture, Ford may get another easy 3,000 or 4,000 sales a month. At the moment, F250 and F350 sales are around 16,000/ mth and 8,000/mth respectively with F250 being 60-40 diesel-gasoline mix and F350 being 75-25 diesel-gasoline mix. So there's a great opportunity to influence F250 buyers with gasoline options. Looking at the competition, Silverado 2500 still uses the 6.0 Vortec with 360 hp/380 lb ft - sound Familiar? How about Ram 2500 with 5.7 Hemi - 383 hp / 400 lb ft ? both of those engines are less powerful than Ford's 6.2 and closer to the new F150 5.0 V8's 380 hp/387 lb ft, so the 5.0 could be on the table with a lighter F250, the more powerful Ecoboost 3.5 would be a natural.. keep in mind, that is up to 700lbs, on average it should be ~500lbs or less. Less of the SD mass is in the body and more of it is in the frame and the engine and the frame is one area where Ford cannot take chances on durability. Also alot of the 700lbs the F150 loss was due to the Lighter EB2.7 not simply the Aluminum body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 keep in mind, that is up to 700lbs, on average it should be ~500lbs or less. Less of the SD mass is in the body and more of it is in the frame and the engine and the frame is one area where Ford cannot take chances on durability. Also alot of the 700lbs the F150 loss was due to the Lighter EB2.7 not simply the Aluminum body. The difference was 730 lbs (7xx) on the crew cab F150 that I saw weighed by Ford. Some of the weight savings was the 2.7L, but IIRC, that was on the order of 50 lbs, so we are still around 680. jpd quoted crew cab numbers which would be closer to average than the 500 lbs that you mention. Also, Ford shaved ~80 lbs off the weight of the frame in the F150. If they can do that with the F150, I would think they could shave more on the SD. Keep in mind that the 6.2L is a few hundred lbs. (300 I think) heavier than the EB 3.5 due to the iron block, so add that weight savings in and you can easily see a 800-900 lb weight savings. Do that, and your frame doesn't have to be as heavy to support the same GVWR as the previous model, thus saving even more weight. Think percentages, not absolute numbers, and I think you will be more in line with reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 They've already announced the updated 3.5 for the Raptor. Wasn't it basically same HP but more torque than the 6.2? I'm betting both the updated 3.5 and the 5.0 end up in the SD. Especially if they are ready for the updated 10sp transmission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 They've already announced the updated 3.5 for the Raptor. Wasn't it basically same HP but more torque than the 6.2? I'm betting both the updated 3.5 and the 5.0 end up in the SD. Especially if they are ready for the updated 10sp transmission. The numbers have been quoted as 'at least as much HP and torque as the 6.2L'. Raj Nair (I think) let it slip that the Raptor would have 450 HP. That with a 10 speed tranny would be awesome in a Super Duty IMO. I could be buying cheap gasoline instead of that black gold known as diesel in a few years if that combo is offered! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 The numbers have been quoted as 'at least as much HP and torque as the 6.2L'. Raj Nair (I think) let it slip that the Raptor would have 450 HP. That with a 10 speed tranny would be awesome in a Super Duty IMO. I could be buying cheap gasoline instead of that black gold known as diesel in a few years if that combo is offered! If you think about it, the Raptor and well if the Super Duty gets it, is paying for the new 3.5L Ecoboost in the GT :p Biker, Do keep in mind that there isn't that much weigh savings between a V8 and a Turbo V6...the extra mass of the turbos, plumming and intercooler will do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 If you think about it, the Raptor and well if the Super Duty gets it, is paying for the new 3.5L Ecoboost in the GT :p Good point! The engines should be very similar with just different tunes and likely different turbos. If you think about it, the Raptor and well if the Super Duty gets it, is paying for the new 3.5L Ecoboost in the GT :p Biker, Do keep in mind that there isn't that much weigh savings between a V8 and a Turbo V6...the extra mass of the turbos, plumming and intercooler will do that. The 3.5L EB actually weighs more than the 5.0L, but the 3.5L is considerably lighter than the 6.2L since the 6.2L has an iron block. I think the 2.7L is just a bit lighter than the 5.0L. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 As always, we shall see. I remain underwhelmed by the actually weight reduction in the new F-150. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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