Edstock Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 I did not know that the new CTS was porked-up. How does it compare in dimensions to the MK Z? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 AWD MKZ is an inch shorter than the CTS and weighs 200lbs less. FWD MKZ weighs 400lbs less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 Huh? We talking Lincoln or Caddy here? MKS is going to be full-sized car vs a compact car that Caddy is talking about... Now a RWD Flagship over the MKS would be nice wouldn't it though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old_fairmont_wagon Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 AWD MKZ is an inch shorter than the CTS and weighs 200lbs less. FWD MKZ weighs 400lbs less. Hmm, if only there MkZ could get the D37 that's going into the MkS, with a AWD sports suspension package, that could be quite a formidable competitor to the CTS and likely cost about the same. Even better would be a really bolted down MkZ L. TF D35 GTTDI at around 400+hp. With AWD and a strong enough powershift tranny, that would even haunt a few CTS Vs. Ahh, the glory of dreaming out loud... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Hmm, if only there MkZ could get the D37 that's going into the MkS, with a AWD sports suspension package, that could be quite a formidable competitor to the CTS and likely cost about the same. It is getting the 3.7L with the 09 refresh - or so I've heard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 (edited) It is getting the 3.7L with the 09 refresh - or so I've heard. If that's true it would be wonderful. Man I can't spell on the internet. Edited September 19, 2007 by suv_guy_19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 If that's ture, it would be wonderful. I'd assume its gonna happen since the Fusion is getting the 3.5 in 09 also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 It is getting the 3.7L with the 09 refresh - or so I've heard. I would even accept the 3.7 as an option. The 3.5 is a more than compitent base engine. Throw in an optional 3.7 with direct injection and a premium tune as an option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traveler Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 There is no better alternative to the Panther than that platform and that car (MKR) for Lincoln. The Twin-Force V6 will work fine if CAFE gets stricter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 There is no better alternative to the Panther than that platform and that car (MKR) for Lincoln. The Twin-Force V6 will work fine if CAFE gets stricter. This was the crazy lack of awareness by North America to spend all that time reverse engineering a Mustang not once but twice into a sedans without involving FoA who have ideal platforms for the job. We now know both groups are on the same page. MKR's vital dimensions are basically identical to Orion Falcon, how many would you like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchdevil Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Sorry, Richard.I'll get it right one of these days Just keep calling it the Zephyr and you will be okay! :happy feet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Dear Mr. Watchdevil — At approx 728 x 603 pixels, your bottom display panel sure occupies a big piece of the Ponderosa. Every time. You have every right to inform us of anything you want, which is great because your stuff is cool, but does it have to take up as much territory? Or take up that kind of territory all the time? Also, it's getting to be like Rosser Reeves' gawddam Anacin TV commercials of the 60's, with the pounding hammer. Rosser believed in exactly that approach, repeat the same commercial 10,000 times. Anyway, most of us have seen the gawddam thing a thousand times already. Give us a break, please — change it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoubleD Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 We just picked up a new 2008 CTS for my wife, and I have to say it is a hell of a vehicle. Posted a note in the competition section. We looked at the Lincoln line-up, the Mrs even drove the MK something (the Edge, not the Fusion) as she was coming out of an SUV. Unfortunately, there's only "nice" there. As in, it's nice, but nothing to write home about (or take home, in this case). FWIW, her car is a tarted up RWD with just about everything and stickered at $45K, so I'd say there is some room at the lower end fo the scale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoman594 Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Headline from Jalopnick.com "Cadillac to merge DTS, STS into 1 new model" bhahahaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoubleD Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Headline from Jalopnick.com"Cadillac to merge DTS, STS into 1 new model" bhahahaha Now that right there is funny! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 To paraphrase Lee Iacocca: If you can find a better joke, post it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchdevil Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Dear Mr. Watchdevil — At approx 728 x 603 pixels, your bottom display panel sure occupies a big piece of the Ponderosa. Every time. You have every right to inform us of anything you want, which is great because your stuff is cool, but does it have to take up as much territory? Or take up that kind of territory all the time? Also, it's getting to be like Rosser Reeves' gawddam Anacin TV commercials of the 60's, with the pounding hammer. Rosser believed in exactly that approach, repeat the same commercial 10,000 times. Anyway, most of us have seen the gawddam thing a thousand times already. Give us a break, please — change it. Just for that you get to see the GAWDDAMN Ponderosa TWO TIMES.... If you don't like it there is this nice little thing in MY CONTROLS that lets you turn off the ability to see member signatures... USE IT if it bothers you that GAWDAMN much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonas1022 Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Here's my question on the entry-level Cadillac thing: CTS can be had for under $30k. MSRP is only $32k. How much of a gap is there underneath the CTS? I mean do they seriously think that a car smaller than the CTS selling for a base MSRP of $28k isn't going to walk out the door for less than $27k most of the time? And what kind of cachet does Caddy get for selling a $26-7k car? Is the idea that some 'super luxury' sedan at the $70k end is going to make this all okay? And if so, given their difficulties selling the STS, why do they think, not having mastered the STS segment, that they can go to some segment where they've never been before and compete? Into some stratospheric level where -name- means everything? Anything under $30K is going to be purely "BTS" by the time it gets to market. CTS will have to climb the size ladder and move higher on stature for the "BTS" entry. It won't be a Cimmaron/CTS. It will have to be a Bimmeron/BTS. Sort of a BMW 1? And you guys was (were) thinking I meant B.S. (?) Naw! More like P.O.S. :boring: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 (edited) Anything under $30K is going to be purely "BTS" by the time it gets to market. CTS will have to climb the size ladder and move higher on stature for the "BTS" entry. It won't be a Cimmaron/CTS. It will have to be a Bimmeron/BTS. Sort of a BMW 1? And you guys was (were) thinking I meant B.S. (?) Naw! More like P.O.S. :boring: Alpha Platform fill will be BLS Replacement which is between Focus and Fusion size. Price in Europe will be about what CTS sells for state side. New BLS will be about 183" long compared to CTS at 190". Edited September 20, 2007 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Alpha Platform fill will be BLS Replacement which is between Focus and Fusion size.Price in Europe will be about what CTS sells for state side. New BLS will be about 183" long compared to CTS at 190". As long as Holden does all the engineering, there's nothing to be scared of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Alpha Platform fill will be BLS Replacement which is between Focus and Fusion size.Price in Europe will be about what CTS sells for state side. New BLS will be about 183" long compared to CTS at 190". Cadillac is going to try selling a $28k compact in the U.S.? Good luck with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Cadillac is going to try selling a $28k compact in the U.S.? Good luck with that. LOL, I'm not sure it'll work either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I could play devils advocate and say "Why not, Acura does it with the TSX and did in the past with the Integra?!". Then again, not many few Acura as a luxury brand, rather a premium brand. Volvo is supposedly pulling the plug on the S40, by just offering the C30 as the starting vehicle, but again, it's seen as a "premium brand", rather than a luxury brand. I dont think many have had much luck by pulling their luxury line downwards, if anything it dilutes the brand because you have limited resources to offer a quality vehicle that speaks for the rest of the line. Hence, X-Type is another vehicle that has hurt Jag in various ways. Many manufacturer's are moving their regular sedans, upwards of $30K, Avalon, Maxima, Camry, Accord, Taurus when fully optioned. Thats squeezes their luxury brands in the possibility of adding a sub $30K vehicle. I mean, if they do, it' because they really really are buying JUST the name....I believe it's more about the "Name and cache", that what the product offers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchdevil Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I could play devils advocate and say "Why not, Acura does it with the TSX and did in the past with the Integra?!". Then again, not many few Acura as a luxury brand, rather a premium brand. Volvo is supposedly pulling the plug on the S40, by just offering the C30 as the starting vehicle, but again, it's seen as a "premium brand", rather than a luxury brand. I dont think many have had much luck by pulling their luxury line downwards, if anything it dilutes the brand because you have limited resources to offer a quality vehicle that speaks for the rest of the line. Hence, X-Type is another vehicle that has hurt Jag in various ways. Many manufacturer's are moving their regular sedans, upwards of $30K, Avalon, Maxima, Camry, Accord, Taurus when fully optioned. Thats squeezes their luxury brands in the possibility of adding a sub $30K vehicle. I mean, if they do, it' because they really really are buying JUST the name....I believe it's more about the "Name and cache", that what the product offers. There really isn't a need to go any further entry level in price with Lincoln or Cadillac. Seems like to me it is all about just having something cheaper to sell just to get people's foot in the door and into a brand fold. However, it gets to a point there is overlap between high end models of volume brands. If they keep it up and we could end up with the lovely Lincoln MKY based on a Focus (C1 of course) and a revival of the Cadillac Cimmaron based an Astra. It's just more whoring out of luxury marques. Any additions to the lower end of either marque just makes them full-line brands like the volume brands they already have. Now if Lincoln or Cadillac was to add a couple of sporty coupes or roadsters then maybe a smaller platform than current models offered would posibly be justified. Personally if I was in the sedan market, luxury or not I would not want one smaller than a MKZephyr or CTS... If I was trying to save money, I'd get a Fusion because it looks damn good in black and really nice with the new sport appearance package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 (edited) This was the crazy lack of awareness by North America to spend all that time reverse engineering a Mustang not once but twice into a sedans without involving FoA who have ideal platforms for the job. We now know both groups are on the same page. MKR's vital dimensions are basically identical to Orion Falcon, how many would you like? That car should be built.....STILL gorgeous.....it would stand its segment on end....... Edited September 20, 2007 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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