bravestar Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Sure. Why not? No, but I've had the misfortune of riding in one. Never again. Took me at least a couple hours to fully unclench. No. Just no. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard in all my life. Something bad about a car makes it good. If you take away all the bad from a car, you make it worse. Honestly, folks. You have to start making sense. Well I don't want to tune the car for maximum performance. I just want to drive my car through the badly-maintained roads of Michigan without financing an osteopath's new ski boat or careening into a ditch. Maybe the car was not made with you in mind. Go and find a nice two door Camry...that market seems to work really well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 I am not trying to burn you, just trying to understand you. What is the hate with the Mustang when you drive a Panther with a solid rear axle and have no issues with that setup? Last I checked, the Panthers have/had a more sophisticated rear suspension setup than the Mustang does. In 2003 the rear shocks were moved outside of the frame rails...didn't the Mustang get that in 2005? And in 1998 the Panthers got a watts link...didn't the Mustang get that in..........................................oh wait... I found this site...they seem to know what they are talking about. It mostly has to do with the Mustangs up to 2004...but interesting none-the-less. Here are some quotes: Another improved rear suspension that Ford could have put on the Mustang is found on the 2000 Grand Marquis, Town Car, and Crown Victoria (illustrated above). It consists of parallel upper and lower control arms (reduced bind) and a watts link located on the front of the differential. Finally, there is the Mustang Cobra's independent rear suspension (IRS). Ford designed this IRS so that it attaches to the 1979-2004 Mustang's stock suspension mounting points. That somewhat compromised the performance of the IRS, but it means that the unit can be bolted into any late model Mustang chassis. The IRS subsystem is about 70 lbs. heavier than a solid rear axle, which contributes a better front/rear weight distribution, and it reduces the car's unsprung weight by about 125 lbs. Link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 ........are you a blackbelt in nimrod ? No, but I am beginning to believe that you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Last I checked, the Panthers have/had a more sophisticated rear suspension setup than the Mustang does. In 2003 the rear shocks were moved outside of the frame rails...didn't the Mustang get that in 2005? And in 1998 the Panthers got a watts link...didn't the Mustang get that in..........................................oh wait... I found this site...they seem to know what they are talking about. It mostly has to do with the Mustangs up to 2004...but interesting none-the-less. Here are some quotes: Link you forgot ( coveinently....?) The SN-95 Mustangs were designed and launched without it. Then came the 1999-2004 SVT Cobras equipped with a cobbled together, half measure of an IRS that performed poorly. It gave IRS a bad name with owners and bean counters alike. While early S-197 Mustangs were planned to have IRS, bean counters won out and we once again were stuck with an “ox cart” rear suspension Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 (edited) No, but I am beginning to believe that you are. LOL.....go cry in a corner....not going to regress into "I know you are but what am i " diatribes , sorry to let you down P. Edited February 9, 2008 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 you forgot ( coveinently....?) The SN-95 Mustangs were designed and launched without it. Then came the 1999-2004 SVT Cobras equipped with a cobbled together, half measure of an IRS that performed poorly. It gave IRS a bad name with owners and bean counters alike. While early S-197 Mustangs were planned to have IRS, bean counters won out and we once again were stuck with an “ox cart” rear suspension Did you even read the quotes I posted? They explain what you just typed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Did you even read the quotes I posted? They explain what you just typed. obviously you are missing the point.......there is a reason FORD in your eyes "compromised"........the IRS they tried SUCKED...so they reverted back to the tried and true, refined it and it is probably as good as a live axle can get, and BETTER than a lot of IRS setups.....it may be coming, but I doubt with this current platform....personally i dont think the V6 needs it.....what we have here is a failure to communicate.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevys Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 (edited) Live axle is more reliable under big power. Half shafts breaking are somewhat common on 03/04 cobras driven hard. Wheel hop is a bitch and that is why a mach 1 will give a 03/04 cobra all they can stand up to about 60 mph. Im not saying Ford cant make it better but from a reliability standpoint under hard use its hard to beat a straight axle. Edited February 9, 2008 by chevys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtisH Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 I should know better, but I am going to comment anyway. I have an 05 Mustang GT. I have over 40,000 miles on it now and enjoy driving it more now than the day I got it. It handles well with the SRA. Harsh bumps in turns will upset the backend. If an IRS would take care of that issue without adding much weight, I'd like to see Ford put one in there. I have to admit that I've always wondered why Ford didn't use the Control Blade IRS setup with the S-197 platform. It seems to do really well under the Falcon and some of the Falcons are putting down serious power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparcEE Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 (edited) Don't know if you guys noticed, but when IRS was under development on the U222/U228 (Expedition/Navigator) that they had fake center differential and tubes to disquise the IRS on the engineering mules. Saw one up on a hoist and was amazed to see how well it looked like a solid axle....you never know. SparcEE Edited February 9, 2008 by SparcEE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02MustangGT Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 (edited) Live axle is more reliable under big power. Half shafts breaking are somewhat common on 03/04 cobras driven hard. Wheel hop is a bitch and that is why a mach 1 will give a 03/04 cobra all they can stand up to about 60 mph. Im not saying Ford cant make it better but from a reliability standpoint under hard use its hard to beat a straight axle. Huh? The Mach 1 will give a 03/04 Cobra all they can stand? Have you driven either car? The 03/04 Cobras have about a half a second on the Mach 1's to 60 mph. Edited February 9, 2008 by 02MustangGT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 QUOTE Have you driven a new generation Mustang? No, but I've had the misfortune of riding in one. Never again. Took me at least a couple hours to fully unclench. That's a crock of shit. How much air did he have in the tires???? If the tires aren't over inflated it's smooth ........and my last car was a Lincoln Mark VIII. The live rear axle isn't a "problem" nor is the rest of the suspension harsh. A review form Dan Neil no less: "The suspension design is traditional, and then some: MacPherson struts in front and a solid axle in the rear, with coil springs outboard and a Panhard rod inboard. This is a compromise layout, for sure, and yet most people, even hard-chargers used to independent rear suspensions, will find little to complain about. The car skates through corners with an overachieving grace. Steering is slop-free, quick and well weighted; the brakes are firm and muscular. And all of these qualities will be raised in exponential fashion when Ford and an army of aftermarket manufacturers finish amping up the Mustang." The only reason to put in IRS is marketing. If it doesn't weigh much more or add too much $$$ they might as well put it in. It'll stop the knee jerk reactions and cater walling to a SRA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 QUOTEHave you driven a new generation Mustang? That's a crock of shit. How much air did he have in the tires???? If the tires aren't over inflated it's smooth ........and my last car was a Lincoln Mark VIII. The live rear axle isn't a "problem" nor is the rest of the suspension harsh. A review form Dan Neil no less: "The suspension design is traditional, and then some: MacPherson struts in front and a solid axle in the rear, with coil springs outboard and a Panhard rod inboard. This is a compromise layout, for sure, and yet most people, even hard-chargers used to independent rear suspensions, will find little to complain about. The car skates through corners with an overachieving grace. Steering is slop-free, quick and well weighted; the brakes are firm and muscular. And all of these qualities will be raised in exponential fashion when Ford and an army of aftermarket manufacturers finish amping up the Mustang." The only reason to put in IRS is marketing. If it doesn't weigh much more or add too much $$$ they might as well put it in. It'll stop the knee jerk reactions and cater walling to a SRA. this whole topic is some funny shit...i do agree you need iron knickers when riding in stang.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 I should know better, but I am going to comment anyway. I have an 05 Mustang GT. I have over 40,000 miles on it now and enjoy driving it more now than the day I got it. It handles well with the SRA. Harsh bumps in turns will upset the backend. If an IRS would take care of that issue without adding much weight, I'd like to see Ford put one in there. I have to admit that I've always wondered why Ford didn't use the Control Blade IRS setup with the S-197 platform. It seems to do really well under the Falcon and some of the Falcons are putting down serious power. I have an 05 Mustang GT also. The only awkwardness I've ever noticed is on a turn with a bump....maybe two or tree times in 2.5 years. No big deal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 (edited) this whole topic is some funny shit...i do agree you need iron knickers when riding in stang.. Did you read the post???? Obviously not. His suspension was either modified and/or the tires were over inflated. If he's "clinching" his butt cheeks he has other problems. Edited February 9, 2008 by timmm55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Did you read the post???? Obviously not. when so called experts get quoted you know the bullshit is about to start...the only expert i need is my ass and the way it feels after riding in a stang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 when so called experts get quoted you know the bullshit is about to start...the only expert i need is my ass and the way it feels after riding in a stang To quote Jay Leno "Aw shut UP!" If your ass is your expert it explains your comments. I have one, an 05 Mustang GT, I drive it all the time. It rides better than my Miata (with IRS) but not quite as smooth as my old Mark VIII....but close, mostly just because it's firmer and has a shorter wheel base. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 To quote Jay Leno "Aw shut UP!" If your ass is your expert it explains your comments. I have one, an 05 Mustang GT, I drive it all the time. It rides better than my Miata (with IRS) but not quite as smooth as my old Mark VIII....but close, mostly just because it's firmer and has a shorter wheel base. lmao....i trust my ass...may be mustang needs thera-peutic foam in the seats to make the ride more enjoyable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted February 9, 2008 Author Share Posted February 9, 2008 ah JESUS - I ask whether I am seeing IRS on a prototype, and this thing exploded into a fight way to go BOF .. Igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevys Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Huh? The Mach 1 will give a 03/04 Cobra all they can stand? Have you driven either car? The 03/04 Cobras have about a half a second on the Mach 1's to 60 mph. Uh, yes. Stop magazine racing. I own a Mach 1 and have driven the cobra. Wheel hop combined with taller gearing in the cobra makes it maybe a touch better to 60. You can only hook up so much power to the pavement from a stop without losing traction. The mach is nearly a hundred hp short but weighs less as well. No wheel hop with the straight axle. Put some stickys on the the Mach and the cobra might be in trouble in a very short run. The cobra handles better is more powerful from a roll ect........ The driver mod is the most important thing no matter what you are driving. My point in all of this is that the straight axle hooks better from a dead stop generally speaking. That is why the serious drag racer that owns a cobra swaps out the rears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 lmao....i trust my ass...may be mustang needs thera-peutic foam in the seats to make the ride more enjoyable I really question if you have driven or been a passenger in an 05+ Mustang. Try an Eclipse, Miata, or any other sporty car and then compare comfort. Have you thought about a 1978 Cadillac Sedan Deville de Ellegance? :happy feet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarShark Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Nothing to do with Solid Axle. Has to do with tuning. Case in point. Crown Vic with a solid axle has soft ride, 300 with IRS has very bumpy ride. Expy with IRS has bumpy ride, Tahoe with SRA has soft ride.Had nothing to do with the ride, but the constant scuttling and jarring from the back end of the car. Very unsettling. Hit a fairly small pothole, and I felt like I was in a blender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 ah JESUS - I ask whether I am seeing IRS on a prototype, and this thing exploded into a fight It's like one of those westerns where everybody smashes all the furniture in the saloon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 It's like one of those westerns where everybody smashes all the furniture in the saloon. good discussion none the less..if ford marketing reads this it is going to cause a huge headache..damned if they do damned if they dont...i will always be a stang fan...i voiced my opinion back in 89 when the bastards wanted the probe to be the new stang... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevys Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 ah JESUS - I ask whether I am seeing IRS on a prototype, and this thing exploded into a fight way to go BOF .. Igor Igor, I think it is but cant confirm it. I am guilty myself of getting tangled up in some of this but every thread on this forum is the same. Any word when we can expect any news on the f150? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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