bzcat Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 (edited) Who said they have to "conquer" anything? This is about Ford gaining an extra source of revenue by using what they already have. If the F-750 chassis itself is unsuitable, then as I said earlier, why not supply things such as powertrains and suspension components to those industries? You have a very deficient understanding of the bus industry. Why would anyone buy a "Ford" suspension on a Van Hool. WTF are you talking about? And Ford doesn't have any competitive engine or transmission for transit or intercity bus. Detroit diesel and Cummins-Westport have that market pretty much cornered. And transmission market for buses is pretty much 100% Allison. Bus operators typically place reliability on top of their requirements... they are not a bunch that like to take a chance on unproven engine and transmission design. Ford can only nibble around the edges... like selling the V10 engine to ISE for their hybrid system. Edited July 11, 2014 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 It's a mature market, with really well-established manufacturers at the various price-points. IMHO, Ford has way, way better things to do with its money, than take on Prevost and Setra, for example, and the market opportunities in lower-cost units are equally insufficient. For example, that kind of money would be much better spent on re-establishing Ford in Class 8 tractors; less specialized, with more open competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Well, if you ask me Ford is doing just fine supplying chassis and cut-aways to the mini/shuttle bus manufacturers. That's as deep in it as they need to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted July 11, 2014 Author Share Posted July 11, 2014 One thing I would like to see is a Ford and Blue Bird school bus collaboration to become the third worthy competitor in the biz along with International/IC and Thomas/Freightliner. Ford is already supplying the Roush propane engine to Blue Bird. Blue Bird is experiencing the greatest increase in sales in their history! They have a history together as Blue Bird's first bus was a Ford. And Ford and Blue Bird just go together word-wise if you will. Ford Blue, Ford-Bird. Blue Bird was going to start using a Ford cowl around 1997 but Ford got out of the class 8 and school bus biz when Daimler stole it. Anyway, it would be a great way to test Ford's in-house drive trains! Maybe Ford can supply them with some grille work also since the Vision bus' grille leaves a lot to be desired. It looks like an emasculated Freightliner grille! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfeg Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 As to Ford supplying suspension and drivetrain components to the coach industry - HUH? For the mediums Ford purchases the axles, springs, and other suspension components from component suppliers. As do the coach builders. Why in the world would would they buy from Ford and incur additional markups? Same for drivetrain. What engines does Ford have in the 9 liter and up class? What transmissions do they have that are suitable for 9 liter and up engines? And moving the engine to the rear on an F750 chassis is easier said than done. Just the engineering to do this for a production chassis (and all of the certification and validation required) is quite expensive. Much more involved than some yahoos on a reality TV show cobbling something together. Sure, some low budget busses may be built on a chassis like the F750, but those are akin to party busses used by limo companies where the prime criteria is cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 As to Ford supplying suspension and drivetrain components to the coach industry - HUH? For the mediums Ford purchases the axles, springs, and other suspension components from component suppliers. As do the coach builders. Why in the world would would they buy from Ford and incur additional markups? Same for drivetrain. What engines does Ford have in the 9 liter and up class? What transmissions do they have that are suitable for 9 liter and up engines? And moving the engine to the rear on an F750 chassis is easier said than done. Just the engineering to do this for a production chassis (and all of the certification and validation required) is quite expensive. Much more involved than some yahoos on a reality TV show cobbling something together. Sure, some low budget busses may be built on a chassis like the F750, but those are akin to party busses used by limo companies where the prime criteria is cheap. IFEG You got it all wrong! You don't move the engine- you swap axles! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 IFEG You got it all wrong! You don't move the engine- you swap axles! Can't they just turn the drivers seat 180? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 IFEG You got it all wrong! You don't move the engine- you swap axles! yep. It'll be the only bus out there with eight reverse gears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfeg Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 Yep, with the Ford automatic, one forward, six reverse. We all need overdrive in reverse! 50 years ago things were much simpler, today with all of the reguations we have and the associated safety standards that must be held to, developing a specialty chassis needed for something like a bus or coach is an expensive and engineering hours intensive undertaking. And that image on an earlier post of the long bus on an F750 chassis was not a production F750 chassis - I do not recall one with a wheelbase near that long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted July 22, 2014 Author Share Posted July 22, 2014 (edited) Do you think Ford wants the ambulance biz? I couldn't import the web page, so click on "Ford Ambulance brochure." Scroll down. http://search.aol.com/aol/search?q=Ford%20ambulance%20brochure&s_it=keyword_rollover&ie=UTF-8&VR=3430 Edited July 22, 2014 by Joe771476 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted July 22, 2014 Author Share Posted July 22, 2014 Want more proof? http://bossierpress.com/?p=7826 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Want more proof? http://bossierpress.com/?p=7826 You mean, like this one?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Wow, what a monstrosity! I would not want to have to waltz that beast through L.A. traffic on a code 3 heart attack run. I have seen U.S.A.R. rigs that were not that big. Anyway, might be the thing for rural areas, ought to be able to haul a lot of equipment if it doesn't weigh too close to G.V.W. empty. I wish Ford would consider offering factory NGV's instead of relying on sometimes sketchy upfitters........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Wow, what a monstrosity! I would not want to have to waltz that beast through L.A. traffic on a code 3 heart attack run. I have seen U.S.A.R. rigs that were not that big. Anyway, might be the thing for rural areas, ought to be able to haul a lot of equipment if it doesn't weigh too close to G.V.W. empty. I wish Ford would consider offering factory NGV's instead of relying on sometimes sketchy upfitters........ 7m- What choice do you have? Either it takes up a ton of frame space or its a "sleeper" in disguise as used on this 650. I saw some new Mass DOT F-liner SD 114's and same deal-the "bunk house" tank! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 (edited) Wow, what a monstrosity! I would not want to have to waltz that beast through L.A. traffic on a code 3 heart attack run. I have seen U.S.A.R. rigs that were not that big. Anyway, might be the thing for rural areas, ought to be able to haul a lot of equipment if it doesn't weigh too close to G.V.W. empty. I wish Ford would consider offering factory NGV's instead of relying on sometimes sketchy upfitters........ Come to think of it, most of the first responder vehicles in Sioux Falls are Class 6 or higher (~160,000 people, ~60,000 vehicles per day at busiest intersection). Ambulances are your typical van-based conveyances, but the fire department calls the ambulance here. The ambulance isn't dispatched by 911. Edited July 25, 2014 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted August 2, 2014 Author Share Posted August 2, 2014 One of the construction magazines did a 3-page article on the virtues of CNG engines highlghting Ford's CNG gas Triton V10 entry with price comparisons and performance comparisons. Ford gets some good press. Freightliner gets one paragraph While I was trying to find it online I came across some other links. Highlights in those articles say there will be no vocational restrictions on specing and there won't be target markets like for just emergency vehicle applications. Also Ford's Kaufman says they will have live PTO which they currently do not have. Here are some links: http://fleetowner.com/management/news/ford-super-duty-triton-v10-gas-0707 http://www.forconstructionpros.com/product/11475348/ford-motor-company-ford-f-650-f-750-diesel-boasts-best-in-class-standard-horsepower-and-torque http://www.forconstructionpros.com/article/11529983/explore-powertrain-options Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted August 3, 2014 Author Share Posted August 3, 2014 Has anyone seen this video yet? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcWQZVd2xY8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Has anyone seen this video yet? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcWQZVd2xY8 Joe- Thx-missed that one. Be interesting to see a shot of engine compartment. AND-if they have done the engineering for the hinge/tilt security, wonder if this might carryover to the 250-550? Also waiting to see max GVW, GCWR numbers. My bet is the 37,000 lb GVW goes away -attempt to get plow business with a 14,000 lb front axle. They have a lot of confidence in the 6.7's capability in its new "hardened" version but I would bet they will get their feet wet gradually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 On another note, a bill is being introduced in Congress to in essence waive the weight penalty associated with fueling system weights of CNG or LNG powered vehicles. In summary, if a CNG/LNG powered vehicle exceeds its weight class by the weight penalty of that fuel system, that penalty weight would be added to the permissible weight of the vehicle. Thus if the tank added 2000 pounds to a tractor's weight, a tractor say in a five axle combination would be allowed to gross 82,000 lbs vs. the normal 80,000 lb max. Bigger question in my mind, would the 33,000 lb class 7 max be similarly exempted by that weight penalty to preserve the 12 % FET exemption??? You would think so as the entire purpose of the legislation is to increase nat gas as a fuel source. but then again, I'm probably being too logical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) I can't remember if I ever brought this to the forum here, but there's a mag called National Ford Truck Club and it really has some great info! Click on whatever link you want, but of special interest is the Winter 2014. When you scroll down 2/3 of the way, you can see a Roush ad with all the Ford vehicles they convert INCLUDING the Bluebird Vision school bus. http://search.aol.com/aol/search?enabled_terms=&s_it=wscreen50-bb&q=nationalfordtruckclub.com Edited September 12, 2014 by Joe771476 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 http://www.roushcleantech.com/content/blue-bird-vision Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted September 18, 2014 Author Share Posted September 18, 2014 A new company called Rainier is entering medium cabover market. Interesting read: http://www.truckinginfo.com/channel/products/product/detail/2014/04/start-up-builder-to-concentrate-on-custom-midrang.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 “We also found that there was no Class 5 gasoline cabover out there,” Jones said. “So we’re going to do that,” in the RD 1950 and the other models. “The mom and pop businesses, landscapers, sweeper contractors, others – they want to lower their costs. Gasoline is the way to do that.” Seems like someone is cribbing from Ford's playbook.... and.... All four models will use the same 86-inch-wide cab, which will be obtained “offshore,” said Jones. So...not so much a builder, but an assembler of existing parts. Makes me hope that Ford will yet build a "Low Cab Forward" cab based on Transit full size sheet metal and fitted to the chassis coming from Avon Lake.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 A new company called Rainier is entering medium cabover market. Interesting read: http://www.truckinginfo.com/channel/products/product/detail/2014/04/start-up-builder-to-concentrate-on-custom-midrang.aspx The cab looks like a slightly updated Isuzu Forward/GM T-series from the early 2000s. I'm guessing it is sourced from China since Isuzu whored out their old trucks several Chinese companies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 Chinese cabs...will last about 3-5 years and rot off the frame... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.