jpd80 Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 (edited) Magna delivers carbon fiber subframe prototype to Ford April 21, 2018 @ 12:01 am Hans Greimel http://www.autonews.com/article/20180421/OEM10/180429960/magna-delivers-carbon-fiber-subframe-prototype-to-ford Magna International Inc. has delivered a carbon fiber subframe prototype to Ford it says will reduce weight and tooling costs, and hopes to rule on mass production by year end. The new component, being tested in a Ford Fusion sedan, weighs 34 percent less than a traditional metal subframe and replaces 45 steel parts with two molded and four metallic ones. The subframe undergirds the front quarter of the vehicle, providing a place to attach the engine and wheels. Magna's prototype, developed with Ford, explores new ground in using lightweight but pricey carbon fiber in structural parts of a vehicle. "We delivered a series of parts to the customer at the end of last year, and they've already started component testing," said Andrew Swikoski, Magna's global product line director for lightweight composites. "By the end of the year, we'll know whether the technology is ready for production or not." Carbon fiber is lightweight and strong, making it a good substitute for steel as engineers race to shave weight from cars to boost fuel economy. But carbon fiber is also costly. Swikoski said Magna's subframe not only reduces weight by more than a third, but it also cuts tooling investment by 30 to 40 percent by reducing the number of subcomponents needed. Magna's carbon fiber composite blends multiple materials to stay affordable, Swikoski said. Edited April 23, 2018 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 I wonder how this works after a collision-do they replace the whole subframe if its damaged during an accident? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 I wonder how this works after a collision-do they replace the whole subframe if its damaged during an accident? . I would presume, yes.... Thinking you may not see this in say...a Focus, but in a Mustang and/or a Lincoln? Sure.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coupe3w Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 (edited) . I would presume, yes.... Thinking you may not see this in say...a Focus, but in a Mustang and/or a Lincoln? Sure.... Why don't those cars crash as well? The're testing it for a Fusion a high volume car line. Edited April 23, 2018 by coupe3w Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Why don't those cars crash as well? The're testing it for a Fusion a high volume car line. Cost prohibitive on cheaper cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 I wonder how this works after a collision-do they replace the whole subframe if its damaged during an accident? I was thinking the same thing - does carbon fiber just shatter? Or are they able to recreate crash structures with it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY93SHO Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 I wonder how this works after a collision-do they replace the whole subframe if its damaged during an accident? That's what you do with the steel/ aluminum ones now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 I was thinking the same thing - does carbon fiber just shatter? Or are they able to recreate crash structures with it? It can be repaired cosmetically but I don't think you can repair an integral structure like that and guarantee strength and crash performance. These things are built in layers with very specific grain(?) patterns and resin and a very specific curing process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 That's what you do with the steel/ aluminum ones now. Plus bonus they wont rust out like the current steel/aluminum ones do now Yes, I have had this happen before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 That's what you do with the steel/ aluminum ones now. Speaking from experience-My 2006 Mustang GT had a major front end collision (rear ended an Expedition) with the passenger side front taking the brunt of it. They chopped the crossover at the front of the subframe (where the radiator is etc) and to infront of the shock tower on the passenger front sub frame to fix it. I never had an issue with the car after it was repaired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 It can be repaired cosmetically but I don't think you can repair an integral structure like that and guarantee strength and crash performance. These things are built in layers with very specific grain(?) patterns and resin and a very specific curing process. A friend of mine works in composites (he used to have a deep freeze full of resin-impregnated CF "fabrics"--they had to be kept cold to keep them from spontaneously curing...and getting hot enough to start fires in the process), and that's the way he explained it to me--they alternate the orientation of the weave of the fabrics in each layer to maximize strength. IIRC, he also said they sometimes left some of the layers "dry" (not impregnated with resin). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomcat68 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 (edited) Im so glad they tested it in a car with a bright future? Edited April 26, 2018 by atomcat68 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan1 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 Hopefully they will make it more rust proof and last. My 05 F-150 frame has been rotting through and I'm hearing Ford may have used some defective cheap Chinese steel like Toyota had in their frames. Will have to make another repair to it and then dump it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted April 28, 2018 Author Share Posted April 28, 2018 Im so glad they tested it in a car with a bright future Makes you think that the obvious is hiding in plain sight.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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