akirby Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 6 minutes ago, twintornados said: But, the point is, they are not doing it now and haven't been for a long time, yet still people try to trivialize a Lincoln by referring it as a badge job....it isn't. I agree I’m just trying to figure out why they seem to have such a bias against Lincoln and not other brands that do the same thing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 25 minutes ago, twintornados said: But, the point is, they are not doing it now and haven't been for a long time, yet still people try to trivialize a Lincoln by referring it as a badge job....it isn't. OK, what if we agree on this? If they come down the same assembly line, nose to tail with their brand sibling, it's a "badge job". https://www.betweentheaxles.net/2020-ford-explorer-vs-lincoln-aviator-differences-compared-side-by-side-20464 HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: OK, what if we agree on this? If they come down the same assembly line, nose to tail with their brand sibling, it's a "badge job". https://www.betweentheaxles.net/2020-ford-explorer-vs-lincoln-aviator-differences-compared-side-by-side-20464 HRG Several cars that share the same architecture and come down the same lines (its called "flexible" assembly lines) and are not considered "badge jobs" only if there is a Ford Oval on the factory door. Even your supplied link shows that they are not merely a "badge job". Quote The 6th-gen Ford Explorer and 2nd-gen Lincoln Aviator both use a new RWD/AWD platform, but the FoMoCo has gone to great lengths to differentiate the two cars. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 28 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: OK, what if we agree on this? If they come down the same assembly line, nose to tail with their brand sibling, it's a "badge job". https://www.betweentheaxles.net/2020-ford-explorer-vs-lincoln-aviator-differences-compared-side-by-side-20464 HRG Mazda B pickup and Navajo were “badge jobs” where they took the Ford vehicle and literally changed the badges. Ford Fusion and Mercury Milan, etc. When you develop different vehicles on the same platform with different sheet metal, interiors, suspension, wheels, etc. that is NOT a badge job. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, akirby said: Mazda B pickup and Navajo were “badge jobs” where they took the Ford vehicle and literally changed the badges. Ford Fusion and Mercury Milan, etc. When you develop different vehicles on the same platform with different sheet metal, interiors, suspension, wheels, etc. that is NOT a badge job. so you would not consider the Silverado & Sierra to be a badge job? HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 38 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: OK, what if we agree on this? If they come down the same assembly line, nose to tail with their brand sibling, it's a "badge job". In some cases that is true. But not always. There are "rebranded" vehicles that are built at different assembly plants. Example. Chevrolet Blazer V6 is a rebranded Cadillac XT5. But the two models are built at different assembly plants. Blazer at Ramos Arizpe Assembly, XT5 at Spring Hill Assembly. Then there are vehicle models that share an assembly line but are not "badge jobs". Example. 6th gen Chevrolet Camaro and Cadillac ATS Coupe are built on the same line at GM's Lansing Grand River Assembly plant. But these two cars are substantially different. GM said that about 75% of Camaro's architectural components are unique to it, not shared with ATS or any other GM product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 11 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: so you would not consider the Silverado & Sierra to be a badge job? HRG Same interior, same drivetrains, probably some shared sheetmetal. Definite badge job. Aviator/Explorer have unique sheetmetal, interior and drivetrains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 51 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: OK, what if we agree on this? If they come down the same assembly line, nose to tail with their brand sibling, it's a "badge job". At one time Wixom final assembly had 3 vehicles coming down the line nose to tail: BOF Town Car Unibody RWD LS Unibody FWD Continental 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 7 minutes ago, akirby said: When you develop different vehicles on the same platform with different sheet metal Same interior, same drivetrains, probably some shared sheetmetal. Definite badge job. https://www.betweentheaxles.net/2019-chevrolet-silverado-vs-gmc-sierra-sibling-differences-compared-20275 HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 17 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: https://www.betweentheaxles.net/2019-chevrolet-silverado-vs-gmc-sierra-sibling-differences-compared-20275 HRG What about the interior and drivetrains? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 5 minutes ago, akirby said: What about the interior and drivetrains? Look, I'm just funnin' with ya. You brought up the sheetmetal standard, I just pointed out there is a difference. I've bought nothing but Fords for the last 40 years (thanks to a now-retired from Ford brother), but I don't drink blue koolaid. That's why I've been as critical as I have regarding the new Ranger. I parked next to a current generation Ridgeline the other day, and pointed it out to my wife, who could not believe that I was looking at a non-Ford product. If I'm not welcome here, then you and the other Mods can vote me off the island. HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: If I'm not welcome here, then you and the other Mods can vote me off the island. Where the hell did that come from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 7 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: but I don't drink blue koolaid. Neither do we on this topic. Ford has had its share of rebadges as has already been pointed out and they're completely obvious. They killed most of those with Mercury. Explorer and Aviator are nowhere near rebadges. Neither are Corsair and Escape. And neither are the Caddys that share platforms with Chevys. To suggest otherwise is trolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 30 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: Look, I'm just funnin' with ya. You brought up the sheetmetal standard, I just pointed out there is a difference. I've bought nothing but Fords for the last 40 years (thanks to a now-retired from Ford brother), but I don't drink blue koolaid. That's why I've been as critical as I have regarding the new Ranger. I parked next to a current generation Ridgeline the other day, and pointed it out to my wife, who could not believe that I was looking at a non-Ford product. If I'm not welcome here, then you and the other Mods can vote me off the island. HRG 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 3 hours ago, twintornados said: Exactly my point - everyone goes off the rails when you call a Cadillac a rebrand of a Chevrolet, but think nothing when it happens and a Lincoln is trivialized as nothing but a rebrand of a Ford. This is true. Quote Same people lose their minds when you state that an Audi is nothing but a rebrand of a Volkswagen. Well, because this is objectively largely false. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 2 hours ago, HotRunrGuy said: OK, what if we agree on this? If they come down the same assembly line, nose to tail with their brand sibling, it's a "badge job". https://www.betweentheaxles.net/2020-ford-explorer-vs-lincoln-aviator-differences-compared-side-by-side-20464 HRG I can't agree to that at all seeing as a Lincoln shares a line with Mustang (the latter of which used to share a line with the Mazda 6), not to mention there are slight differences in the current Escape and MKC right down to the seat crossmembers on the floor pan. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 15 hours ago, papilgee4evaeva said: Well, because this is objectively largely false. ? Since Audi is 99.64% owned by Volkwagen and vehicles like the Q3 are based on Tiguan, A3 is based on VW's MQB chassis (which underpins a LOT of VW corporate vehicles from SEAT, Skoda, and others) and their upcoming EV units are based on Volkwagens MEB chassis....my statement stands. Audi is nothing but a VW rebrand....see? makes a lot of people upset, but those same people think nothing of deriding a Lincoln as nothing but a rebrand of a Ford. We all know Audi is not merely a rebrand of VW, so why is it so hard to believe that Lincoln is not merely a rebrand of Ford? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Great video review of Cadillac CT5 from a German perspective. From Autogefühl. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 4 hours ago, twintornados said: Since Audi is 99.64% owned by Volkwagen and vehicles like the Q3 are based on Tiguan, A3 is based on VW's MQB chassis (which underpins a LOT of VW corporate vehicles from SEAT, Skoda, and others) and their upcoming EV units are based on Volkwagens MEB chassis....my statement stands. Audi is nothing but a VW rebrand....see? makes a lot of people upset, but those same people think nothing of deriding a Lincoln as nothing but a rebrand of a Ford. We all know Audi is not merely a rebrand of VW, so why is it so hard to believe that Lincoln is not merely a rebrand of Ford? I know about A3, Q3, and TT, as well as Q4 e-Tron. But A4, A5, A6, A7, A8, Q5, Q7, Q8, and R8 are not related to any VW models. Four out of thirteen models that share platforms does not a rebrand make. For the record, I'm completely in agreement that Lincoln is not simply a rebranded Ford and should not be considered such. Someone somewhere said that only the Zephyr deserved that criticism in recent years - and rightly so, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extreme4x4 Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 On 3/20/2019 at 8:36 AM, akirby said: This was my first car except it had a full white vinyl top. I added wire basket wheels and whitewall tires. It was quite the pimp mobile. It was a also a piece of crap. That is hilarious. The first car that my Dad cosigned on, was a 4-door Cutlass Supreme in the same baby blue, with a full white vinyl roof (my very first car was the 1974 Mercury Monterey that my Dad gave me because he owed me money from borrowing my babysitting money (he was an active alcoholic at the time). It caught on fire). However, mine had the matching baby blue mags. It was against my will................. but was the only car he would cosign for me on. It was a giant POS. Between modules, and it's great disdain for water (anything that could leak water, would eventually leak water, with the last being the freeze plugs as it sat in the parking lot at work). God I hated that car, and it hated me right back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 IMO both Ford and GM are kidding themselves if they think Millenials and Z-gens are going to be attracted to a Cadillac or a Lincoln. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 28 minutes ago, mlhm5 said: IMO both Ford and GM are kidding themselves if they think Millenials and Z-gens are going to be attracted to a Cadillac or a Lincoln. In the U.S. that's true. In China by contrast, Cadillac has been successful attracting buyers in those age groups. Average age of Cadillac customers in China is 30-34 years. https://www.mediavillage.com/article/cadillac-in-china-its-a-bestselling-luxury-brand-with-youth-appeal/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted May 26, 2019 Share Posted May 26, 2019 18 hours ago, mlhm5 said: IMO both Ford and GM are kidding themselves if they think Millenials and Z-gens are going to be attracted to a Cadillac or a Lincoln. ...again, thanks for starting your rambling with "IMO"..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailhiker Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 There should likely be a new thread, but the V series was just introduced, along with the CT4 . I thought the CT5 was bland, but the CT4 out blands it by a mile! https://www.autoblog.com/2019/05/30/2020-cadillac-ct4-v-ct5-v-revealed/ Oh, and both CT5 V and CT4 V have less power than the MKZ with the 3.0! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 Moving on to the CT5-V, it looks like a regular CT5 but with dark trim and lights, quad tailpipes and a unique rear diffuser. Instead of the CTS-V's 640-horsepower supercharged V8, the CT5-V uses a twin-turbo 3.0-liter V6 making 355 horsepower and 400 pound-feet of torque. Changes made to the 3.0 for the CT5-V include a new intake system and new exhaust, and it revs higher too. Like the CT4-V, it comes with a 10-speed automatic and either rear-wheel drive or all-wheel drive. It does get the electronically controlled limited-slip differential. https://www.autoblog.com/2019/05/30/2020-cadillac-ct4-v-ct5-v-revealed/#slide-7587620 Also, supposedly there are higher powered/better performing models coming above this, which makes the use of the V name instead of V-sport trim on these odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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