Nickp Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 (edited) 36 minutes ago, SteelyD said: https://www.foxnews.com/auto/bad-ass-baby-jeep-2022 Jeep barely even sells 2-door wranglers anymore(10% take rate) I very very VERY highly doubt that this will be destined for the U.S. market. In fact I will eat my hat if they make it to our shores. Edited December 16, 2019 by Nickp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 I recently saw a Suzuki Jimny in real life, interesting little SUV. My first thought was it's basically a boxy renegade ripoff. It's a bit funny looking but overall a nice little thing. If Jeep actually makes something in this size I think it would be decently popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 18 minutes ago, probowler said: I recently saw a Suzuki Jimny in real life, interesting little SUV. My first thought was it's basically a boxy renegade ripoff. It's a bit funny looking but overall a nice little thing. If Jeep actually makes something in this size I think it would be decently popular. The Jimny has been in production since 1970. If anything the Renegade is a Jimny ripoff. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-dubz Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 I rarely see any sub compact vehicles on he road. I don’t see how anything smaller than those could even be remotely popular. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 3 hours ago, T-dubz said: I rarely see any sub compact vehicles on he road. I don’t see how anything smaller than those could even be remotely popular. The 4 meter Jeep has been in the works for a long time. It's going to be the same size as EcoSport and VW T-Cross. I don't think FCA is planning to sell it in the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 There’s so may other things to concentrate on that make more profit, do they really need to sell it or is it just a nice to have product? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 17 minutes ago, jpd80 said: There’s so may other things to concentrate on that make more profit, do they really need to sell it or is it just a nice to have product? Isn't Ford in the process of having like 10 different utilities? Heck we almost get that funky, over-sized focus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) 36 minutes ago, probowler said: Isn't Ford in the process of having like 10 different utilities? Heck we almost get that funky, over-sized focus. In respect to a Jeep SUB-Compact? all I’m saying is that Jeep has bigger fish to fry in North America probably more suited to international markets Edited December 17, 2019 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 14 hours ago, jpd80 said: In respect to a Jeep SUB-Compact? all I’m saying is that Jeep has bigger fish to fry in North America probably more suited to international markets It's not planned for North America. It's basically a replacement in Europe for Fiat Punto which FCA is not planning to replace. Kind of like how Hyundai Venue replaced Accent/Excel in most markets. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 3 hours ago, bzcat said: It's not planned for North America. It's basically a replacement in Europe for Fiat Punto which FCA is not planning to replace. Kind of like how Hyundai Venue replaced Accent/Excel in most markets. Oh I agree, you mentioned that before. I was simply answering probowler’s reference to Ford’s “10 planned utilities for North America” . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted December 19, 2019 Share Posted December 19, 2019 What exactly is the reason that manufacturers cannot build a small, very low-cost vechile for low-income buyers? I can see why larger vehicles feature higher manufacturing costs and demand higher prices, but why is it so hard to build a vehicle in the 15-20k range and make a profit? It seems like you should be able to sell a decent amount and make up for a lower profit margin. I guess my question is, what is driving up vehicle costs so much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted December 20, 2019 Author Share Posted December 20, 2019 3 hours ago, probowler said: What exactly is the reason that manufacturers cannot build a small, very low-cost vechile for low-income buyers? I can see why larger vehicles feature higher manufacturing costs and demand higher prices, but why is it so hard to build a vehicle in the 15-20k range and make a profit? It seems like you should be able to sell a decent amount and make up for a lower profit margin. I guess my question is, what is driving up vehicle costs so much? Raw Materials, Tech, Labor costs, etc are all things that drive up vehicle costs Look at this way-an Escape is basically an Focus with AWD. The starting price of a 2020 Escape is what around 24K or so, for what is basically a jacked up Focus Station wagon? The starting price of an Focus was around 16K before any discounts...being able to charge more for a vehicle allows you to be able to add incentives without losing money on the product. Then add in the market was flooded with competition that could build it cheaper (overseas/lower cost/non union labor/currency) that drove down the price...well you can see what I'm getting at. Ultimately there is a sunk cost of materials/labor/safety that all cars start with and smaller products have razor thin profit margins on them to start with. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickp Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 Because small cheap cars don’t sell. If Ford was selling 200k fiestas A year they wouldn’t have discontinued it. But nobody wants a New small car, they’d rather have an older suv if they’re on a budget. All our explorers we’ve sold were gone within an hour basically. My friend’s focus she’s trying to sell has been listed for 2 weeks zero interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 (edited) 17 hours ago, silvrsvt said: Raw Materials, Tech, Labor costs, etc are all things that drive up vehicle costs Look at this way-an Escape is basically an Focus with AWD. The starting price of a 2020 Escape is what around 24K or so, for what is basically a jacked up Focus Station wagon? The starting price of an Focus was around 16K before any discounts...being able to charge more for a vehicle allows you to be able to add incentives without losing money on the product. Then add in the market was flooded with competition that could build it cheaper (overseas/lower cost/non union labor/currency) that drove down the price...well you can see what I'm getting at. Ultimately there is a sunk cost of materials/labor/safety that all cars start with and smaller products have razor thin profit margins on them to start with. So really, an escape is only SLIGHTLY more expensive than a focus? Crazy that ford and others are able to charge so much more for it... Incentives or not. It still kind of sucks for people who might want a new ford but are now priced out of their budget and have to look elsewhere... But ford has to do why's best for them i suppose. I guess we just have to accept that times have changed and buyer tastes are different today. Edited December 20, 2019 by probowler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-dubz Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 A member over at broncog6 made this rendering. Looks pretty cool. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, T-dubz said: A member over at broncog6 made this rendering. Looks pretty cool. The back is still a bit to short, they’re basing on Bronco R with rear hatch area chopped off Edited December 21, 2019 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 (edited) On 12/21/2019 at 4:06 AM, probowler said: So really, an escape is only SLIGHTLY more expensive than a focus? Crazy that ford and others are able to charge so much more for it... Incentives or not. It still kind of sucks for people who might want a new ford but are now priced out of their budget and have to look elsewhere... But ford has to do why's best for them i suppose. I guess we just have to accept that times have changed and buyer tastes are different today. Exactly, I would love to see them continue with affordable cars made in low cost Mexico but the reality is the cost of investing in doing that versus investing on more expensive products with a higher rate of return. It’s the exact opposite of traditional Detroit strategy where they’d flood the market and sell for smal profits/ break even Edited December 21, 2019 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assimilator Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 (edited) I guess Ford has to pick its battles, it has to pull off quite a few expensive and risky product transitions with only so much money on hand. I would contend that Ford no longer has to be a full-line automaker, it doesn't need to be in all segments. But it would be nice if Ford was good at the important ones while making products that stand alone in the market. I like their focus on creating more icons, that's what encourages me about what they are doing next (Bronco, Bronco Scout, Small Pickup, Mach E). Even the troubled Explorer has been treated as something way more special than the typical mundane family hauler when they could have easily gone the easy route. Edited December 21, 2019 by Assimilator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, T-dubz said: A member over at broncog6 made this rendering. Looks pretty cool. Belt line is too high, leading to a very awkward proportion. Why do people keep making the roof too short? Edited December 21, 2019 by probowler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 22, 2019 Share Posted December 22, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, probowler said: Belt line is too high, leading to a very awkward proportion. Why do people keep making the roof too short? It’s out of proportion, You can tell that the roof will be higher, the back is not right. Edited December 22, 2019 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stampede.Offroad Posted December 24, 2019 Share Posted December 24, 2019 On 12/21/2019 at 5:49 PM, probowler said: Belt line is too high, leading to a very awkward proportion. Why do people keep making the roof too short? Auto makers are bringing up the belt line and reducing the amount of glass, making room for more and larger safety systems like energy absorbing beams and airbags. It's the same reason the rear windows are getting smaller from every direction. Hopefully the dismal safety ratings of the Wrangler leave 'room' for the Bronco windows to be a bit larger like a traditional SUV, and Ford can beat them with lateral physical dimensions and absorbing structures instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted December 24, 2019 Share Posted December 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Stampede.Offroad said: Auto makers are bringing up the belt line and reducing the amount of glass, making room for more and larger safety systems like energy absorbing beams and airbags. It's the same reason the rear windows are getting smaller from every direction. Hopefully the dismal safety ratings of the Wrangler leave 'room' for the Bronco windows to be a bit larger like a traditional SUV, and Ford can beat them with lateral physical dimensions and absorbing structures instead. Good info, I was seriously wondering WTF was going on.... made no sense, why would you purposefully design reduced visibility into your vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickp Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Leaked Bronco headlight... you gotta have some cajones to take this picture lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Nickp said: Leaked Bronco headlight... you gotta have some cajones to take this picture lol. I wouldn't be the least bit suprised that this is a controlled leak that we are going to have over the next 6 months or so. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
passis Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 By my accounts, the baby Bronco should be around the corner... Wasn't it supposed to appear +/- 6 months before the Bronco? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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