hllywd Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 45 minutes ago, mackinaw said: Mr. Fain slams Ford, and says there's real movement at GM and Stellantis. https://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/2023/10/20/uaw-president-shawn-fain-bargaining-update-strike-day-36/71253055007/ And yet everything he showed tonight still illustrates that Ford is ahead of the other two...and yet Fain hit Ford harder by striking Kentucky Truck. If I were Ford I wouldn't negotiate against myself either. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 31 minutes ago, hllywd said: And yet everything he showed tonight still illustrates that Ford is ahead of the other two...and yet Fain hit Ford harder by striking Kentucky Truck. If I were Ford I wouldn't negotiate against myself either. If I’m Ford, the lockouts would have started the second Fain’s livestream ended 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 (edited) 36 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: If I’m Ford, the lockouts would have started the second Fain’s livestream ended Or at least let him feel the branch crack with suggestions that actions have consequences. and if that doesn’t work, maybe explain to him how Ford could walk away from least four or five US plants and set up in Canada and Mexico. Yes, you’ll get your 36% but it comes at a hell of a price……. Maybe that too harsh but some sort of circuit breaker is needed to be the UAW back to the negotiating table. Edited October 21, 2023 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcseds Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 The other two caught up to where Ford has been in negotiations and Fain is blowing them kisses. But Ford, who had these offers, is the devil. He has a real hard on for Ford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 19 minutes ago, lcseds said: The other two caught up to where Ford has been in negotiations and Fain is blowing them kisses. But Ford, who had these offers, is the devil. He has a real hard on for Ford. Absolutely because Ford has indicated that 36% pay increase is never going to happen. The GM offer only looks better because of the $40/hr headline offer, it’s still behind the Ford package Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 56 minutes ago, jpd80 said: Or at least let him feel the branch crack with suggestions that actions have consequences. and if that doesn’t work, maybe explain to him how Ford could walk away from least four or five US plants and set up in Canada and Mexico. Yes, you’ll get your 36% but it comes at a hell of a price……. Maybe that too harsh but some sort of circuit breaker is needed to be the UAW back to the negotiating table. We are the ass crack of ford they will not build another plant in Canada lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 9 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said: We are the ass crack of ford they will not build another plant in Canada lol OK, what about using Oakville plant the way it was intended as a big ass truck plant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 Sounds like Fains trying to whipsaw Ford by talking up GM and Stellantis, but I’m guessing that their offers won’t be good enough and they still be on strike. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris532 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NitroRichFire Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 Hmmm, OK help me out here, is this guy still getting FULL pay why this strike is going on, while the MOST IMPORTANT FOLKS, the FRONTLINE WORKERS ARE NOT? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 13 hours ago, jpd80 said: OK, what about using Oakville plant the way it was intended as a big ass truck plant That ship sailed when Ontario Truck Plant closed in 2004 and they merged it with Oakville assembly plant. Oakville was the only place they built those old f-150 lightnings. I don’t see trucks going back there and I don’t know what I see in regards to their EV plans there either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted October 21, 2023 Author Share Posted October 21, 2023 58 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said: That ship sailed when Ontario Truck Plant closed in 2004 and they merged it with Oakville assembly plant. Oakville was the only place they built those old f-150 lightnings. I don’t see trucks going back there and I don’t know what I see in regards to their EV plans there either. No question that plans for the Oakville Assembly Plant are a bit of a mystery, even with the plans announced for production of the BEV Explorer and Aviator models. Ford has had a history of changing future plant production plans frequently, although it would seem unlikely for much to change at Oakville considering how close they are now timewise to starting the BEV conversion. Right now, I think it's more a question of what other models will be produced there. Regardless, Ford isn't going to announce anything until after the current UAW strike is settled and I fully expect that Ford's future relationship with the UAW will change. As this UAW strike lingers and Ford's future production costs escalate, I have to assume that Ford is exploring its options for expanding future vehicle production in Mexico. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 32 minutes ago, ice-capades said: No question that plans for the Oakville Assembly Plant are a bit of a mystery, even with the plans announced for production of the BEV Explorer and Aviator models. Ford has had a history of changing future plant production plans frequently, although it would seem unlikely for much to change at Oakville considering how close they are now timewise to starting the BEV conversion. Right now, I think it's more a question of what other models will be produced there. Regardless, Ford isn't going to announce anything until after the current UAW strike is settled and I fully expect that Ford's future relationship with the UAW will change. As this UAW strike lingers and Ford's future production costs escalate, I have to assume that Ford is exploring its options for expanding future vehicle production in Mexico. Very good points and their plans are a huge mystery right now. I agree that until this strike is over there will be no announcements about anything. I don’t doubt at all that they will consider expanding in Mexico or elsewhere. I feel like their electrification plans are hitting a major snag right now. Their sales forecasts are not being reached so I’m feeling skeptical I hope the situation improves. We have been told by union the last Nautitlus out of final is December 5th. No specific date for edge yet in 2024. Only vague retool info. I hope ford gets this right down the road this EV planning I mean. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted October 21, 2023 Author Share Posted October 21, 2023 21 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said: Very good points and their plans are a huge mystery right now. I agree that until this strike is over there will be no announcements about anything. I don’t doubt at all that they will consider expanding in Mexico or elsewhere. I feel like their electrification plans are hitting a major snag right now. Their sales forecasts are not being reached so I’m feeling skeptical I hope the situation improves. We have been told by union the last Nautitlus out of final is December 5th. No specific date for edge yet in 2024. Only vague retool info. I hope ford gets this right down the road this EV planning I mean. Thanks for your feedback! Nothing would please me more than seeing Ford produce vehicles at Oakville that will fully utilize the plant's potential. Even better would be to see Ford expand its production in Canada at either Oakville or an additional site. Unfortunately, if the Unifor contracts are similar to whatever the next UAW contract terms are, additional production capacity in Canada may be cost prohibitive. If so, Ford's best option is expanding future production in Mexico considering lower costs overall including trade agreements. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, ice-capades said: Thanks for your feedback! Nothing would please me more than seeing Ford produce vehicles at Oakville that will fully utilize the plant's potential. Even better would be to see Ford expand its production in Canada at either Oakville or an additional site. Unfortunately, if the Unifor contracts are similar to whatever the next UAW contract terms are, additional production capacity in Canada may be cost prohibitive. If so, Ford's best option is expanding future production in Mexico considering lower costs overall including trade agreements. All I’m thinking is that the belligerence of the UAW insisting on 36%-40% pay rise might force Ford to do something radical like moving key production out of harms way. If push comes to shove, Oakville being a large facility would definitely be one plant looked at for large vehicle production. That’s kind of a doomsday perspective but Ford’s moves to condense its production and improve profits has made it vulnerable to strike action……it’s like Ford forgot all about that because the UAW played nice for so many years. Edited October 21, 2023 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 2 hours ago, jpd80 said: ……it’s like Ford forgot all about that because the UAW played nice for so many years. Out of the Detroit Three, Ford by far has/had the best relationship. Interesting interview with Bill Ford in the New York Times earlier this week. He cautioned the Ford bargaining team not to take any comments made public personally, and to be patient. He went on to say that he knows many of the guys on the UAW team, and plays hockey with several of them on a local beer-league team, and considers them friends. I suspect they could hammer out a contract fairly quickly if it wasn’t for Mr. Fain. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 7 minutes ago, mackinaw said: I suspect they could hammer out a contract fairly quickly if it wasn’t for Mr. Fain. It would have been done a month ago if it wasn’t for the politician. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted October 22, 2023 Share Posted October 22, 2023 I think at this point people need to start asking the real motivation behind Mr. Fain's desire to destroy the automakers. Who's pulling the strings above this person? Who's he really working for? Is it the UAW employees or is it other interests that gain to benefit if the US automakers are harmed beyond repair. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 22, 2023 Share Posted October 22, 2023 37 minutes ago, 2005Explorer said: I think at this point people need to start asking the real motivation behind Mr. Fain's desire to destroy the automakers. Who's pulling the strings above this person? Who's he really working for? Is it the UAW employees or is it other interests that gain to benefit if the US automakers are harmed beyond repair. I think he’s looking to expand the UAW starting with new battery plants and I think he believes (incorrectly) that this will result in the employees at Tesla and the transplants organizing and joining the UAW. If anything it will be the opposite. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 22, 2023 Share Posted October 22, 2023 5 hours ago, 2005Explorer said: I think at this point people need to start asking the real motivation behind Mr. Fain's desire to destroy the automakers. Who's pulling the strings above this person? Who's he really working for? Is it the UAW employees or is it other interests that gain to benefit if the US automakers are harmed beyond repair. No, this is old fashioned union strong arm tactics, they cannot conceive of a situation where the pay increases being asked for sends a company broke. In all truth, they probably wouldn’t but would undo most of Ford’s labor savings achieved over the past 10-15 years. And this is why Ford needs to send a message that these actions have consequences……… 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hllywd Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 On 10/20/2023 at 7:35 PM, fuzzymoomoo said: If I’m Ford, the lockouts would have started the second Fain’s livestream ended Agreed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hllywd Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 On 10/21/2023 at 6:45 PM, mackinaw said: Out of the Detroit Three, Ford by far has/had the best relationship. Fain said Friday that the days of Ford and UAW being friends are over. ?♂️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hllywd Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 13 hours ago, 2005Explorer said: I think at this point people need to start asking the real motivation behind Mr. Fain's desire to destroy the automakers. Who's pulling the strings above this person? Who's he really working for? Is it the UAW employees or is it other interests that gain to benefit if the US automakers are harmed beyond repair. Reading between the lines of some of his Friday comments, it appears that Fain is more interested in growing the union than he is in obtaining an agreement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 7 hours ago, hllywd said: Fain said Friday that the days of Ford and UAW being friends are over. ?♂️ Bill Ford’s relationship with the UAW started long before Fain and will last long after. He’s just digging himself a hole that he’s not going to get out of. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 1 hour ago, akirby said: Bill Ford’s relationship with the UAW started long before Fain and will last long after. He’s just digging himself a hole that he’s not going to get out of. Who, Fain? I would agree but I fear he’s going to be re-elected in however many years when he’s up for it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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