Impala going rear wheel drive in 2009

[Blue Oval Staff]

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[DCK]

ARTICLE LINK

I think it is good that GM is trying to get rid of all their tweenies and properly set them in the segments.

 

I think the RWD Impala needs to move upscale somewhat to the price of the avalon, 300 and azera. Customers will have a choice if they want a large RWD vehicle under 30k they will have the 300, charger and impala to choose and for FWD they will have the 500, Avalon and Azera.

 

I think the Next 500 needs to go up into Avalon territory, a few more grand investede into each 500 would make it such a nice vehicle, now it is just second tier to the Azera and Avalon, but you can get one 4k less after incentives.

[Watchdevil]

Let the Malibu have the mass market. I think it's good if the Impala take things up a notch to more of an image car for those who prefer style and performance. It certainly much more than Ford is willing to commit to. Having a full sized car that looks like the old Passat just doesn't cut it, especially when brand new Passats put it to shame. I like Fords that look like Fords and act like them too.

[robertlane]

While the new Impala has absolutely nill in common with it my old 1966 Impala SS, or any of the heritage Impala's for that matter, I applaud GM for bringing the RWD Impala back.

 

I think we all saw this coming as the Ontario plant cannot simply make Camaros alone. I hope they slate the Firebird for production next!

 

Gotta hand it to TheGMSource, which has predicted this would happen.

 

Edited November 13, 2006 by robertlane

[Mark B. Morrow]

I think it is good that GM is trying to get rid of all their tweenies and properly set them in the segments.

 

I think the RWD Impala needs to move upscale somewhat to the price of the avalon, 300 and azera. Customers will have a choice if they want a large RWD vehicle under 30k they will have the 300, charger and impala to choose and for FWD they will have the 500, Avalon and Azera.

 

I think the Next 500 needs to go up into Avalon territory, a few more grand investede into each 500 would make it such a nice vehicle, now it is just second tier to the Azera and Avalon, but you can get one 4k less after incentives.

 

 

I agree the 500 needs to target Avalon in the next model. More power, with the 3.5 and more luxury in the top line trim package.

 

If Chevy is going to commit the Impala to RWD, Ford can and should put some $$$ into revitalizing the Panther platform with a new Galaxie. All new body, the 325 hp version of the Shelby GT motor. It has to be less expensive to re-do the current car than to start from scratch or to import an Aussie version with all the mods required for U.S sales.

 

If they do it right they can develop a new Continental along side to replace the Town Car. The Continental would not share any sheetmetal with the Ford. I hesitate to suggest a distinctive Mercury model because I am not convinced Ford would do one. I would love to see a return to the Mercury Marauders of the '60s that were not carbon copies of the Fords. I think they only shared roofs on the fastbacks and inner sheetmetal/the cowl structure. The exterior panels were different and distinctly Mercury.

[RichardJensen]

Well, if Chevy thinks they can chase the 300C customer, I guess it's their funeral.

 

I've read, but have not seen other documentation, that Chrysler has up to $4000 in incentives on 300Cs these days.

Edited November 13, 2006 by RichardJensen

[Watchdevil]

Well, if Chevy thinks they can chase the 300C customer, I guess it's their funeral.

 

I've read, but have not seen other documentation, that Chrysler has up to $4000 in incentives on 300Cs these days.

 

Well I feel Chryslers ARE going stale and now need a styling and refinement updates to stay interesting. They also built too many. As with anything different and new, sales are brisk at first and usually level off or decline. The car business is a lot like the record industry. You get a hit song once in a while, but in order to have longevity you have to be artistic and creative to be taken seriously and have another hit or consistant popularity. It's time Chrysler follows up soon rather than let it languish like a Fifth Avenue or Diplomat. Or God forbid like Ford has done with the Crown Vic.

 

With all the news and buzz on Zeta, I can see that there could be a lot of people out there holding out for a new Impala... And some people may have bought a RWD Impala over a Chrysler if it were offered.

 

The important thing is to make a good car in the first place and let it stand on its own merits. If it is good then it will have popularity over the test of time. That's how most successful nameplates made it over the years. Back in the day it was good styling or packaging. Now it is much more. I don't know why it's such a novel idea to bring forth a car that is every bit exciting to look at as well as have the reliability and quality of an Asian car. Now if they can just get the dealer experience consistant and in-line as well. That's not to say there are not Toyota or Honda dealers run as shabbily as some mega Ford dealer that still runs like it's 1970.

 

I'll say it again.. Ford missed the boat not taking a risk in offering a RWD sedan styled like the 427 Concept. I would like to see Ford compete against the next Impala. It's okay if the manufacturers want to offer a capable FWD sedan for those who want it or don't care what set of wheels drive the car. What is important is that there are choices for those who want something stylish with performance.

 

While the new Impala has absolutely nill in common with it my old 1966 Impala SS, or any of the heritage Impala's for that matter, I applaud GM for bringing the RWD Impala back.

 

I think we all saw this coming as the Ontario plant cannot simply make Camaros alone. I hope they slate the Firebird for production next!

 

Gotta hand it to TheGMSource, which has predicted this would happen.

 

 

I wouldn't count on the Impala looking like a 4-door Camaro. Those people over at GMI are often not realistic. Reality is that it will have a styling identity of it's own to be taken seriously. And it certainly won't be a rebadged Holden.

[StevenJ]

Well, if Chevy thinks they can chase the 300C customer, I guess it's their funeral.

 

I've read, but have not seen other documentation, that Chrysler has up to $4000 in incentives on 300Cs these days.

 

Rich, you ever sit in a 300? That's the real reason why they aren't selling well. The V8 models do quiet well while the V6 models sit on the lot. The reason being of course is that it doesn't offer much. It isn't soo much drivetrain layout as it is overall fit and finish which is something that DCX is usually terrible at. As for me, I'll probably be buying the second or third model year of the zeta Impala. Ford won't upgrade the panthers it seems unless that rumored 09 update actually happens. Until then, I think a GM may be in my future.

[NLPRacing]

Those people over at GMI are often not realistic...

 

Nothing like the people here at BON... :P

[matthewq4b]

Rich, you ever sit in a 300? That's the real reason why they aren't selling well. The V8 models do quiet well while the V6 models sit on the lot. The reason being of course is that it doesn't offer much. It isn't soo much drivetrain layout as it is overall fit and finish which is something that DCX is usually terrible at. As for me, I'll probably be buying the second or third model year of the zeta Impala. Ford won't upgrade the panthers it seems unless that rumored 09 update actually happens. Until then, I think a GM may be in my future.

 

Ya I will second that the fit is not bad in my Charger but oh man the interior screams rubbermaid and the quality is sub par for todays cars no question.

 

Chryslers biggest issue with the LX cars is the interior trim out. It in some aspects is a throw back to a 1970's Ford in quality.

The LX cars are aslo seeing some other rather disturbing quality issues but being a Chyrsler this is to be expected.

 

The 300 has been around for a few years now and the styling is getting old already. They made Chryco a bundle but if the 300 is not updated for 2008 you can pretty much gaurentee sales will go full force in to a tail spin.

 

 

Matthew

[RichardJensen]

No vehicle should require top down restyling every three years to 'stay fresh', yet that is precisely what the 300C is now said to require.

 

Chrysler built too many of them, which raises a key question: How many retail buyers are there, on a year-in, year-out basis, that want a $30k+ entry-brand RWD sedan?

 

Are there 80k? 100k? How many? How many buyers can you rely on, to sustain demand year over year?

 

I firmly doubt that the number is equal to the retail LX volume in its first year or two, and that's across the entire industry.

 

I don't believe that there are more than 120k people, year in and year out, that want to pay over $30k for an entry-level badged sedan in order to send V8 power through the rear wheels. In total, I doubt the number comes even close to 200k, including customers under the $30k line.

[630land]

People think all RWD cars should be V8. But what has kept Stang going for 42 years is offering base non V8 models.

 

Reason why the LX cars are not so hot anymore is the V6 models are not selling.

 

The Zeta Impala and Camaro are not going to ONLY offer V8's, not if they want to sell.

[BORG]

The 300C design seems very serviceable. I love the body design, it's the fascias that bother me. Who says these cars need total makeovers? The design is very neutral but very contemporary and minimal.

 

Cars like the 500 and Montego are a little less serviceable because of the greenhouse which is probably one of its most controversial and awkward design elements. It also lacks a contemporary fit n' finish with the large amount bulky trim and weather striping. Of all the car comapnies out there, Ford is the least likely to completely update the body design of the 500/Montego so we will probably see most of these vehicle carried over through subsequent updates.

Edited November 14, 2006 by BORG

[Anthony]

LX Sales:

 

2004: 144,717

2005: 241,339

2006 (thru Oct): 248,234

 

There's a market for Chevy.

 

Also, LX's get refreshed and new interiors for '08.

[bec5150]

The FIRST thing a mainstream design has to be is practical. You get inside an Accord, Camry, current Impala, Fusion, and the like and you will notice you can see out of it. It's not intimidating.

 

The Charger, 300, and Magnum look great, but when you get inside you can't see out of the back. The high beltline makes it feel a bit too snug for my taste. A bit of form before function on these IMHO.

[Watchdevil]

The 300C design seems very serviceable. I love the body design, it's the fascias that bother me. Who says these cars need total makeovers? The design is very neutral but very contemporary and minimal.

 

Cars like the 500 and Montego are a little less serviceable because of the greenhouse which is probably one of its most controversial and awkward design elements. It also lacks a contemporary fit n' finish with the large amount bulky trim and weather striping. Of all the car comapnies out there, Ford is the least likely to completely update the body design of the 500/Montego so we will probably see most of these vehicle carried over through subsequent updates.

 

 

Oh no the Chryslers don't need total makeovers. Restyle the fascias, lamps, trim and get the interiors to look like something other than the plastic storage container aisle at Wal-Mart. Resurface sheetmetal here and there if necessary but I don't believe any hard points need changing.

 

People think all RWD cars should be V8. But what has kept Stang going for 42 years is offering base non V8 models.

 

Reason why the LX cars are not so hot anymore is the V6 models are not selling.

 

The Zeta Impala and Camaro are not going to ONLY offer V8's, not if they want to sell.

 

I don't think all RWD cars need to have V8's. The formula is simple and classic like American cars of yesteryear and the way the Australian cars are still formulated today. Various levels of trim, options and powertrain choices give everyone something they desire.

[630land]

Myth: Aussies buy RWD cars exclusively.

 

Reality: FWD Asian cars are bigger sellers now. Just ask someone from Oz. Falcon/Commodore are neither #1 seller.

 

Also regarding this: "If Chevy is going to commit the Impala to RWD, Ford can and should put some $$$ into revitalizing the Panther platform with a new Galaxie.."

 

Panther is going to die, face it. If any RWD Ford sedan comes about, it will have Falcon or even D3 roots.

[matthewq4b]

LX Sales:

 

2004: 144,717

2005: 241,339

2006 (thru Oct): 248,234

 

There's a market for Chevy.

 

Also, LX's get refreshed and new interiors for '08.

 

 

Hmm sales numbers that are equal to the CV GM not to many years ago.

 

08 is about right for a refresh. DCX will proboly see a sales slide on 07 but with new 08's it will should halt them.

 

The corker is these sales could have been Ford's if they had either

 

A. built the 427 or

B. updated the CV GM TC some time in the last decade

 

Matthew

Edited November 14, 2006 by matthewq4b

[silvrsvt]

Cars like the 500 and Montego are a little less serviceable because of the greenhouse which is probably one of its most controversial and awkward design elements. It also lacks a contemporary fit n' finish with the large amount bulky trim and weather striping. Of all the car comapnies out there, Ford is the least likely to completely update the body design of the 500/Montego so we will probably see most of these vehicle carried over through subsequent updates.

 

Well the 08 Model has new front and rearends on it (lets see 3-4 years after it was launch? thats a bad thing?) and a full redesign in 2012..so a car that has the same greenhouse for 7 years isn't a bad thing, just look at the Camry...even though they changed it this year, it still looks the same

[Bluecon]

Hmm sales numbers that are equal to the CV GM not to many years ago.

 

08 is about right for a refresh. DCX will proboly see a sales slide on 07 but with new 08's it will should halt them.

 

The corker is these sales could have been Ford's if they had either

 

A. built the 427 or

B. updated the CV GM TC some time in the last decade

 

Matthew

They are working on installing the Challenger into Bramalea.

That will give them a bump for 07.

[StevenJ]

Myth: Aussies buy RWD cars exclusively.

 

Reality: FWD Asian cars are bigger sellers now. Just ask someone from Oz. Falcon/Commodore are neither #1 seller.

 

Also regarding this: "If Chevy is going to commit the Impala to RWD, Ford can and should put some $$$ into revitalizing the Panther platform with a new Galaxie.."

 

Panther is going to die, face it. If any RWD Ford sedan comes about, it will have Falcon or even D3 roots.

 

Cough, cough bullshit cough cough.... :blah:

 

Small cars in Aussie are FWD but if anyone wants to compete in the 'real' car market aka the large car market they better be RWD. All thoose FWD Mittsubishis and Toyotas never fare as well as the proper rear wheel drive Holdens or Fords. Especially not now since the new Holdens have come out. It still would have costed Ford far less to update the panthers than continue with D3. Appearently, very few people want a decotented S80 but lots of people are willing to bulk up for RWD sedans in that market. Large FWD cars do not sell where as large RWD cars do but compact RWD cars don't sell as compact FWD cars do. That's generally how the market is. Look how well the DTS has done for Cadillac. It almost destroyed the brand. Now all their new cars are RWD.

[NickF1011]

Cough, cough bullshit cough cough.... :blah:

 

Small cars in Aussie are FWD but if anyone wants to compete in the 'real' car market aka the large car market they better be RWD. All thoose FWD Mittsubishis and Toyotas never fare as well as the proper rear wheel drive Holdens or Fords. Especially not now since the new Holdens have come out. It still would have costed Ford far less to update the panthers than continue with D3. Appearently, very few people want a decotented S80 but lots of people are willing to bulk up for RWD sedans in that market. Large FWD cars do not sell where as large RWD cars do but compact RWD cars don't sell as compact FWD cars do. That's generally how the market is. Look how well the DTS has done for Cadillac. It almost destroyed the brand. Now all their new cars are RWD.

 

I could be mistaken, but doesn't the Camry outsell the Commodore and Falcon?

 

And the DTS is still front wheel drive.

Edited November 14, 2006 by NickF1011

[StevenJ]

I could be mistaken, but doesn't the Camry outsell the Commodore and Falcon?

 

And the DTS is still front wheel drive.

 

That was the point and no, according to some recent sales report in Aussie, the Commodore is the NUMBER 1 selling car still. The only thing comes close is the Corrolla because it is cheap transportation for penny pinchers, not because it is a good car. BTW GM is replacing the DTS with a RWD zeta car as well. Point again, large FWD cars do not work. The DTS, old STS, and FWD Eldorados almost brought an end to Cadillac. It took the Escalade and the much loved Sigma cars, CTS, STS, and SRX to bring back the brand. Mainly the CTS and Escalade. Aside from the Escalade which is a truck, it took sporty RWD sedan to bring the name back.

 

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.a

 

Top 10 best-selling vehicles in Australia, October 2006 (passenger cars & SUVs)

1. Holden Commodore 5455

2. Toyota Corolla 3722

3. Toyota Camry (4cyl) 3046

4. Ford Falcon 2945

5. Toyota Yaris 2858

6. Mazda3 2585

7. Hyundai Getz 1594

8. Ford Focus 1584

9. Holden Astra 1575

10. Ford Territory 1349spx?ArticleID=21406&vf=7

Edited November 14, 2006 by StevenJ

[CarShark]

The only thing comes close is the Corrolla because it is cheap transportation for penny pinchers, not because it is a good car.

Couldn't it be both?

[jpd80]

I could be mistaken, but doesn't the Camry outsell the Commodore and Falcon?

 

And the DTS is still front wheel drive.

 

Australian Car sales October 2006:

 

Holden Commodore (5,455)

Toyota Corolla (3,722)

Toyota Camry (3,205)

Ford Falcon (2,945)

Toyota Yaris (2,858)

Mazda 3 (2,585)

Hyundai Getz (1,594)

Ford Focus (1,584)

Holden Astra (1,575)

Toyota HiLux 4x4 (1,457).

 

Only reason Camry outsells Falcon is Ford head office wankers held up Orion's project until government tipped in extra AUS$100M on condition that LHD export market developed for Falcon. BFII Falcon's appearance is same as BA released 4 years ago, needs Orion's all new sheetmetal.

 

VE Commodore is a good car and a lot of its sales are to private buyers.

Edited November 14, 2006 by jpd80