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silvrsvt

2020 Explorer 2.3L EPA MPG Numbers

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All the more impressive-the much smaller 2019 Escape only gets 23/30/26 with the 1.5L or 22/29/26 with the 2L.... I'm sure the 2020 Escape with the 8/9 speed (I know the transaxle has less gears then the RWD transmission?) transaxle and being slightly lighter then the current model will improve over the 2019 Escapes numbers. 

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9 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

No Sport or Hybrid numbers yet...but only lose a MPG when you get AWD-thats impressive

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/PowerSearch.do?action=noform&path=1&year1=2020&year2=2020&make=Ford&baseModel=Explorer&srchtyp=ymm

They were posted in the Explorer thread  a little over a week ago 

Edited by blwnsmoke

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If the non hybrid gets 24 there is no way the hybrid gets 24 like the PIU.  I'm guessing more like 30-32?

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4 hours ago, akirby said:

If the non hybrid gets 24 there is no way the hybrid gets 24 like the PIU.  I'm guessing more like 30-32?

I could see 1 to 2 mpg more, but no way 6-8 more. The vehicles aren't that much different.

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4 hours ago, akirby said:

If the non hybrid gets 24 there is no way the hybrid gets 24 like the PIU.  I'm guessing more like 30-32?

Agree.  Otherwise what would be the point of the hybrid?

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16 minutes ago, Trader 10 said:

I could see 1 to 2 mpg more, but no way 6-8 more. The vehicles aren't that much different.

There is ZERO reason to even do a hybrid if it only gets 1-2 mpg better than the non hybrid.

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2 minutes ago, akirby said:

There is ZERO reason to even do a hybrid if it only gets 1-2 mpg better than the non hybrid.

No argument there, but how would a Explorer hybrid be 6 to 8 mpg more than the PIU hybrid?

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2 minutes ago, akirby said:

There is ZERO reason to even do a hybrid if it only gets 1-2 mpg better than the non hybrid.

And they could be very different vehicles as far as the battery and the tuning/programming being specific to PIU duty.

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2 minutes ago, akirby said:

And they could be very different vehicles as far as the battery and the tuning/programming being specific to PIU duty.

The PIU will be heavier with all of the HD parts they use for durability. Plus, I am going to bet that it's tuned for more performance. Where I think the consumer version will be tuned for still good but less performance and more FE. It's all a guessing game now. We'll see in a few more weeks.

My bet though, is the hybrid will at least equal performance of 2.3 and get better mileage. This is why I think the hybrid will sell like hotcakes if the pricing is close.

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4 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said:

The PIU will be heavier with all of the HD parts they use for durability. Plus, I am going to bet that it's tuned for more performance. Where I think the consumer version will be tuned for still good but less performance and more FE. It's all a guessing game now. We'll see in a few more weeks.

My bet though, is the hybrid will at least equal performance of 2.3 and get better mileage. This is why I think the hybrid will sell like hotcakes if the pricing is close.

It's gonna be expensive. According to build & price you can't get the hybrid in the XLT. 

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1 minute ago, Trader 10 said:

It's gonna be expensive. According to build & price you can't get the hybrid in the XLT. 

I think they call it the Limited Hybrid.  (Limited trim).

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8 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

I think they call it the Limited Hybrid.  (Limited trim).

You're right. Looks like it starts at $53,375. Yikes!

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4 minutes ago, Trader 10 said:

You're right. Looks like it starts at $53,375. Yikes!

A base limited 2.3 is about 4k cheaper.

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1 hour ago, Trader 10 said:

No argument there, but how would a Explorer hybrid be 6 to 8 mpg more than the PIU hybrid?

Like I mentioned a few times, PIU is bounded to be heavier due to beefed up suspension components and additional body bracing and whatever armor might be included in it. 

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note Hybrids advantage is mainly around town and stop and go...NOT at a constant highway speed....

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1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

Like I mentioned a few times, PIU is bounded to be heavier due to beefed up suspension components and additional body bracing and whatever armor might be included in it. 

Yes, the PIU will be heavier and that could explain a small mileage difference, but weight is not a huge mileage factor. example- the 2019 Edge 2.0 AWD is rated 21/28 while the much lighter Escape 2.0 AWD is actually rated less at 21/27. (The 2018 2.0 AWD Edge with the 6 speed was 20/27). 

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"Ford promises 500 miles to a tank" with the hybrid.

 

500 / 17.3 gallons = 29 mpg minimum highway.  My guess is it will hit 30mpg as I would think Ford would not want to miss that mark.

 

Edited by blwnsmoke

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3 hours ago, Trader 10 said:

You're right. Looks like it starts at $53,375. Yikes!

That's a problem. $50k+ is well beyond the the range of the average family cruiser. Ford's not going to sell a whole bunch of hybrids at that price. Heck, even the base xlt with no options starts at $36k and close to $40k if you want AWD. That's a huge jump from 2019 base model pricing and quite high relative to the competition. I hope Ford is prepared to sacrifice some market share in the interest of delivering a premium (i.e. rwd) product.  This thing is priced on the high side of it's segment.

Also, fuel economy numbers are generally tied or 1 mpg better than the V6 Traverse, which is its primary competition. That's a good sign I guess, although a 2-3 mpg advantage would make the ecoboost sales pitch a little easier to make. Also the Traverse is a little bigger I think.

Edited by Sevensecondsuv

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28 minutes ago, Sevensecondsuv said:

That's a problem. $50k+ is well beyond the the range of the average family cruiser. Ford's not going to sell a whole bunch of hybrids at that price. Heck, even the base xlt with no options starts at $36k and close to $40k if you want AWD. That's a huge jump from 2019 base model pricing and quite high relative to the competition. I hope Ford is prepared to sacrifice some market share in the interest of delivering a premium (i.e. rwd) product.  This thing is priced on the high side of it's segment.

Also, fuel economy numbers are generally tied or 1 mpg better than the V6 Traverse, which is its primary competition. That's a good sign I guess, although a 2-3 mpg advantage would make the ecoboost sales pitch a little easier to make. Also the Traverse is a little bigger I think.

Let me offer up a pair of window stickers. The 2014 is the one I just traded in, the 2020 is one I was looking at. Nearly identical 200A 4WD XLT's with the tow package, after 6 model years there's only a $4400 difference in MSRP's, yet the 2020 gets better mpg, has Sync-3, Co-Pilot 360, rear camera, etc.  I'm not sure the "huge jump" in price is there.

HRG

2020 Explorer.pdf

2014 Explorer.pdf

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The difference is the base trim is gone. XLT is now the base trim. 2019 and prior had an "explorer" trim under XLT. 

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13 hours ago, Sevensecondsuv said:

That's a problem. $50k+ is well beyond the the range of the average family cruiser. Ford's not going to sell a whole bunch of hybrids at that price. Heck, even the base xlt with no options starts at $36k and close to $40k if you want AWD. That's a huge jump from 2019 base model pricing and quite high relative to the competition. I hope Ford is prepared to sacrifice some market share in the interest of delivering a premium (i.e. rwd) product.  This thing is priced on the high side of it's segment.

Ford already has the numbers for the higher end Explorers-Most of them are leased, which results in a cheaper car payment. Which helped drive the decision making process of why they went to more premium packaging and it helped the Lincoln version. Also keep in mind the average cost of a new car is $37,577 as of December last year. The base model Explorer starts just under that.

The Explorer has ALWAYS had expensive models-Heck almost 20 years ago they came out with the Limited over the Eddie Bauer model because the market was asking for it and it sold. 

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13 hours ago, Sevensecondsuv said:

That's a problem. $50k+ is well beyond the the range of the average family cruiser. Ford's not going to sell a whole bunch of hybrids at that price. Heck, even the base xlt with no options starts at $36k and close to $40k if you want AWD. That's a huge jump from 2019 base model pricing and quite high relative to the competition. I hope Ford is prepared to sacrifice some market share in the interest of delivering a premium (i.e. rwd) product.  This thing is priced on the high side of it's segment.

Also, fuel economy numbers are generally tied or 1 mpg better than the V6 Traverse, which is its primary competition. That's a good sign I guess, although a 2-3 mpg advantage would make the ecoboost sales pitch a little easier to make. Also the Traverse is a little bigger I think.

Remember what Ford usually does in the first twelve months. restrict availability of the good options to high er level trims. They also know there will be a heavy take on LEV Hybrids in the first twelve months as well, so maybe a supply issue and a way to counterbalance production...

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2 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

Ford already has the numbers for the higher end Explorers-Most of them are leased, which results in a cheaper car payment. Which helped drive the decision making process of why they went to more premium packaging and it helped the Lincoln version. Also keep in mind the average cost of a new car is $37,577 as of December last year. The base model Explorer starts just under that.

The Explorer has ALWAYS had expensive models-Heck almost 20 years ago they came out with the Limited over the Eddie Bauer model because the market was asking for it and it sold. 

No argument with any of that. My point was that Ford also needs to have a solid entry in the meat and potatoes range of the segment. That's where I see a problem. The current explorer starts at $30ish and can be nicely optioned by $40k. The new one starts at $36500 with no options, goes over $40k as soon as you select awd, hits $45k by adding a few things, and doesn't have an optional powertrain available until $53k.

Sure they'll move some of the higher end models on lease deals but I don't see the XLT as being priced right to be the volume trim it needs to be.

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10 minutes ago, Sevensecondsuv said:

I don't see the XLT as being priced right to be the volume trim it needs to be.

The XLT has most of the optional equipment that the previous one did already, standard-its part of the simplification of ordering, which should result in better quality, due to less build variations 

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