chevys Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2014/02/updated-tundra-could-offer-a-cummins.html Ford may be getting their hand forced on oil burners like it not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Now now Toyota, Ram will be getting feelings of inadequacy... If a 3.0 diesel is good, a 5.0 diesel must be better...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 I personally think a 5.0 diesel is a bit much for a half ton. It'll probably out reach the max towing capabilities of the truck, and not yield good enough fuel economy gains to offset the higher purchase price. They're basically putting in a diesel for the sake of trying to be relevant. Something in the mid 3.0 liter range makes more sense. Heck, even the Ford 4.4 makes more sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2014/02/updated-tundra-could-offer-a-cummins.html Ford may be getting their hand forced on oil burners like it not. GM offered a hybrid in their trucks once. Ram still offers a manny tranny in their heavy duties. Ford didn't. Just because it is OFFERED doesn't mean another maker needs to follow suit. They need to follow suit if it makes sense for the bottom line. I personally think a 5.0 diesel is a bit much for a half ton. It'll probably out reach the max towing capabilities of the truck, and not yield good enough fuel economy gains to offset the higher purchase price. They're basically putting in a diesel for the sake of trying to be relevant. Something in the mid 3.0 liter range makes more sense. Heck, even the Ford 4.4 makes more sense. Agreed. I think a 5.0L diesel would be perfect in a 3/4 ton truck, but is just too much in a half ton. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 TOYOTA IS NOT THREATENING ANY OF THE DETROIT 3 WHEN IT COMES TO TRUCKS. Thank you and good night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CKNSLS Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 (edited) TOYOTA IS NOT THREATENING ANY OF THE DETROIT 3 WHEN IT COMES TO TRUCKS. Thank you and good night. They said the same things about their cars in the late 1950s......... Edited February 14, 2014 by CKNSLS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 They said the same things about their cars in the 1960s......... The big 3 aren't neglecting the truck market like they did the car market at that time though..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 They said the same things about their cars in the late 1950s......... The big 3 aren't neglecting the truck market like they did the car market at that time though..... And they likely never will. And deciding not to drop a diesel engine in the 1/2-ton line, contrary to what a vocal minority here believes, does not constitute neglect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Might I also add... Toyota announced a diesel Tundra back in 2007 and confirmed it for production in 2008. Seven years later from the initial announcement, and they expect us to get excited? Where is mlhm5 with his proclamations of "vaporware" when you want him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 You still get good fuel economy with a diesel even when the capacity is almost as big as tthe gasoline engine option, I've heard reports that the 6.7 in Super Duty can get up to 5 mpg better than the gasoline 6.2 or was that 6.8... In any regard, a 5.0 Cummins ins a Tundra may have wider implications for world wide exports, I can see that being a premium priced vehicle in the rest of the world - maybe that's the plan.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 Depends, jpd. Is there a worldwide market for 1/2-ton pickups? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 Depends, jpd. Is there a worldwide market for 1/2-ton pickups? Depends, I've seen quite a few Tundras over in the Middle East being used as technical type vehicles. I don't think they sell in huge numbers... There is a demand for trucks though, a buddy of mine had his F-350 stolen in Canada and the pisser was he had lowjack on it, but it only works in the lower 48 states LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 Depends, I've seen quite a few Tundras over in the Middle East being used as technical type vehicles. I don't think they sell in huge numbers... There is a demand for trucks though, a buddy of mine had his F-350 stolen in Canada and the pisser was he had lowjack on it, but it only works in the lower 48 states LOL If Wikipedia is to believed (and I will recant if someone finds a source to the contrary), Toyota sells the Tundra only in NAFTA areas as of this year. So I take that as they sold them elsewhere before but no longer do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 The article did say "could"..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-150 Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Could also be a HD Tundra is finally on the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Could also be a HD Tundra is finally on the way. Do they really have the volume to justify that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan1 Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Well, the next Tundra wouldn't be until 2017MY and the 5.0 in the Ram only got 23 mpg in 2wd on more expensive fuel so not much of a game changer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chester Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I think there maybe a big market for a 4.5 to 5.0 liter Diesel. It maybe in a 3/4 ton truck though. The big 400hp 800lb feet of torque diesel in the GM's, Rams and Fords are nice, but are overkill for a vast amount of applications. Make a lighter, more efficient 3/4 ton with a smaller diesel that can get in the low twenties combined fuel efficiency and I think the manufacturer that hits this will have a winner on thier hands. It maybe a beefed up 1/2 ton that gets their first though. (Maybe this is Toyota's plan?) Either or and I think these companies would have a hit on their hands. I could see the diesel varient 4.5 to 5.0 liter with 330 or so HP and 550-600 lb feet of torque with payload of say 3500 lb's and a tow rating of 15k-17k really being a desirable product if it could manage low twenties combined milage. Can they make that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev-Mo Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 TOYOTA IS NOT THREATENING ANY OF THE DETROIT 3 WHEN IT COMES TO TRUCKS. Thank you and good night. Wishful thinking! Any adversary that has as much money and resources as Toyota, along with a Teflon coated reputation with huge numbers of customers is VERY THREATENING - and you better believe it! I know Ford does! Did you consider Dodge a threat 10 years ago?? Don't look back they are much closer than you think! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Wishful thinking! Any adversary that has as much money and resources as Toyota, along with a Teflon coated reputation with huge numbers of customers is VERY THREATENING - and you better believe it! I know Ford does! Did you consider Dodge a threat 10 years ago?? Don't look back they are much closer than you think! Ford's sales gain last year exceeded Dodge's. Further, if money were able to purchase success, then why hasn't Toyota caught even a whiff of it in fullsize trucks during the nearly 20 years they've had one on the market? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Wishful thinking! Any adversary that has as much money and resources as Toyota, along with a Teflon coated reputation with huge numbers of customers is VERY THREATENING - and you better believe it! I know Ford does! Did you consider Dodge a threat 10 years ago?? Don't look back they are much closer than you think! We see what they've bought with their resources... aspirations of taking over the market, but nothing to show for it but a heavily underutilized plant in San Antonio and a perennial fight with Nissan for last place. And like Richard said, the current Tundra is their FOURTH go at the market and they haven't so much as made a dent against the American marques who are steadily improving their products (as much as the GM trucks get disparaged here, the new ones are appreciably better than the old ones). And FWIW, I at least acknowledged Dodge 10 years ago in that they've been here since the 20s and are well established. I still don't acknowledge the Tundra and Titan even though they exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old_fairmont_wagon Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 I believe that since Toyota doesn't currently have a 3/4 ton or 1 ton pickup in the market to threaten the sales of with an uprated Tundra, that this may indeed be their objective. A 5.0L Diesel that gives appropriate modern power and economy numbers in a Tundra HD (ala the late 90s F-150HD) with some beefed up components to justify a higher tow and payload rating might just make some decent sales for them. Given the massive gains in capability that the light duty and 2500/3500 trucks have made over the last two decades, there's plenty of room for Toyota to play with the market. Don't get me wrong, I don't expect that this will put a major dent in anyone's HD sales numbers, but, as it will be incremental volume for the Tundra and lead to better plant utilization for Toyota, its all sorts of win for them if they can justify the price premium to cover the improved parts and make their targeted sales volumes.Toyota isn't completely stupid. A 5.0L V8 diesel is NOT a fuel economy engine in a half ton pickup. That's a power engine, pure and simple. Toyota doesn't currently make a high volume gasoline engine that's larger than their 5.6L V8 that's already in the Tundra. Its nearing the end of the road for its power/longevity/economy levels as compared to Ford's 6.2L/3.5L EB, GM's latest small blocks and Dodge's Hemi V8s. When you're pushing power levels that high, buyers will naturally consider diesel as an option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev-Mo Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) We see what they've bought with their resources... aspirations of taking over the market, but nothing to show for it but a heavily underutilized plant in San Antonio and a perennial fight with Nissan for last place. And like Richard said, the current Tundra is their FOURTH go at the market and they haven't so much as made a dent against the American marques who are steadily improving their products (as much as the GM trucks get disparaged here, the new ones are appreciably better than the old ones). And FWIW, I at least acknowledged Dodge 10 years ago in that they've been here since the 20s and are well established. I still don't acknowledge the Tundra and Titan even though they exist. Does a Braves fan acknowledge that the Mets even exist? What if the NY'ers hire a few good guys in management and finally figure out what to do with all that $$ to actually put a team together? It could happen! (I live in Colorado but grew up near NY as a Mets fan) Now I am stuck with the Rockies, almost as painful as the Mets. But at least is real baseball - National League! My fellow baseball fan - I hate the Tundra as much, or maybe even more than you do, but to say that Toyota could never challenge Ford in light trucks is as absurd as saying that Ford could never challenge Toyota in the mid-size car class. Well what do you know - Ford came up with the Fusion, improved it over the years and Toyota has no choice but to notice. Just because they don't present a formidable challenge now, does not mean that they won't in the years to come. The fact that with all their failures they are still here should be very scary - shows wicked determination and vast $$$ resources. Edited February 20, 2014 by Kev-Mo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Does a Braves fan acknowledge that the Mets even exist? What if the NY'ers hire a few good guys in management and finally figure out what to do with all that $$ to actually put a team together? It could happen! (I live in Colorado but grew up near NY as a Mets fan) Now I am stuck with the Rockies, almost as painful as the Mets. But at least is real baseball - National League! Cheers, fellow NL fan! Shame about that front office in Flushing... the Mets have been good before and the rivalry was much more meaningful when they were. But now, I dunno. My fellow baseball fan - I hate the Tundra as much, or maybe even more than you do, but to say that Toyota could never challenge Ford in light trucks is as absurd as saying that Ford could never challenge Toyota in the mid-size car class. Well what do you know - Ford came up with the Fusion, improved it over the years and Toyota has no choice but to notice. Just because they don't present a formidable challenge now, does not mean that they won't in the years to come. The fact that with all their failures they are still here should be very scary - shows wicked determination and vast $$$ resources. Ford pretty much owned the midsize class (and you can argue about compacts) until they languished and Toyota and Honda took over in the mid-to-late 90s. The difference between the 90s Ford Taurus and the current F150 is that Ford actually actively updates the trucks. It wasn't so with the cars -- and that goes for most of the American marques. Truth be told, I don't think I'll live long enough to see the Tundra become a threat to the F150 -- and I'm only 30. There's simply too much ground to make up, not only in the quality of the truck, but also the loyalty of the American (and Canadian for our northern neighbors) consumers. Add to that the fact that their all-new 2014 is much the same as the model from 2007-2013 plus styling updates, and you'll begin to get an idea about just how seriously Toyota is trying to take over the market now versus 7 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Ford has been making pickups since the 1950s and has been the market leader for decades. The full sized truck market is pretty much unique to NA. Sales volume and profit levels allow Ford to invest a lot more than Toyota can even if they do have deep pockets. You can't create that kind of intellectual property easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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