D32 Minivan back on?

[Ralph Greene]

For a lot of people....the Flex just does not work. If you want to haul people and stuff.....bicycles, strollers, high chairs, camping gear, nothing beats a mini van with their multiple seat configerations and/or storage space, stow and go, fold into floor, etc. Lots of people like to haul stuff on trips where they want it to stay inside out of the elements and thieves. I have been on many trips in my son's Odyessy, with a lot of stuff inside, and the Flex doesn't come close to doing the same thing.

 

It sure would be nice if Ford brought back a modern mini van. Whether or not they think they can compete product wise, or make a business case of it, I don't know.

Edited June 23, 2009 by Ralph Greene

[silvrsvt]

I have been on many trips in my son's Odyessy, with a lot of stuff inside, and the Flex doesn't come close to doing the same thing.

 

I've driven plenty of Odyssey's and Sienna minivans for work and if you have more then 4 people them, they have the same exact amount of room in them as the Flex, if not less. The only thing the Flex gives up to them is that roof isn't as high as a minivan.

[hoss96racing]

So why do I have this newfound interest in Minivans? Well, we found out 2 weeks ago that after 5 years of trying and lots of treatments, we are expecting! One goal is to get a carseat-friendly vehicle to take the place of the Mustang as mt wife's daily driver (keeping the Mustang for weekend only duty). I've been looking at used Freestars/Montrey's, and I've been pretty impressed with the product (and they can be had for CHEAP!). I'm also looking at Freestyles / TaurusXs, but the sliders would be a big plus for us.

 

Congratulations!... :D I'm sure a minivan would be easier but I couldn't talk the wife into one. That and no minivan is rated to tow our camper.

 

And don't loose any sleep over this minivan thing...... you'll be loosing enough in the comming months...LOL!! :tease:

[battyr]

Just sell the Galaxy here but under a different name (that name belongs with a RWD sedan with -ie).

 

If it is big enough to match the name, then Galaxy is a good name. If it is too small then people will think the name is a joke.

 

Most younger people would recognize the name, but not know the American history.

 

[PREMiERdrum]

I've driven plenty of Odyssey's and Sienna minivans for work and if you have more then 4 people them, they have the same exact amount of room in them as the Flex, if not less. The only thing the Flex gives up to them is that roof isn't as high as a minivan.

 

A few things that separate the Flex from a traditional minivan are in-cabin mobility (center console prevents access from front to back), roof height, and the big one, sliders. Even though rear-seat access from the rear doors on the Flex are good, the hinge travel required to get a bulky infant carrier / car seat in and out takes up space that usually isn't there in garages, parking lots. I was definately one to think that the Flex would be fine as a Freestar replacement, that is until we started keeping our friend's little ones overnight. Trying to negotiate those carriers and seats in and out of my Explorer was quite difficult, where sliders would have been very nice.

[Pioneer]

Take the flex. Extend it 12" to 18", raise the roof-line about 6" and add sliders.

 

I'd buy one.

[battyr]

i was surprised to see this thread. I really hadn't realized that the Flex wasn't satisfying the minivan market. I thought that was the whole idea, give minivan customers something different that still fulfilled the needs in that segment, but I guess that didn't work out. If I had a big family and liked to go on trips with lots of luggage, I would definitely choose a Flex over a minivan, but I guess some people "need" the sliding doors (??). Anyway, I think Ford's got a decent slice of that market segment covered with the Flex, and I would hope they focus on other products for now. Fiesta, Focus, Ranger, Explorer all need the attention the new Fusion and Taurus have had. Develop a hybrid Flex, that'll keep up the buzz for that vehicle and get people to actually thing about the Flex as a minivan alternative.

 

The Flex is a minivan, but a young family needs something cheaper with sliding doors.

[NickF1011]

Lots of weight not over the drive wheels is not good for traction. Load up a FWD van, go up a hill and it can get dicey. Load up a RWD van and you just go up the same hill.

 

If you are hauling that much crap around in your vehicle, a minivan probably isn't best suited to your needs anyway, regardless of drivetrain configuration.

[NickF1011]

The Flex is a minivan, but a young family needs something cheaper with sliding doors.

 

How much cheaper do you want to go? How much cheaper does Ford want to go? There really isn't a lot of wiggle room. Ford isn't chasing after the Kia market anymore.

[dante hicks]

So why do I have this newfound interest in Minivans? Well, we found out 2 weeks ago that after 5 years of trying and lots of treatments, we are expecting! One goal is to get a carseat-friendly vehicle to take the place of the Mustang as mt wife's daily driver (keeping the Mustang for weekend only duty). I've been looking at used Freestars/Montrey's, and I've been pretty impressed with the product (and they can be had for CHEAP!). I'm also looking at Freestyles / TaurusXs, but the sliders would be a big plus for us.

Congratulations.

As a father of 2 and a Taurus X owner, I can confidently say the Taurus X has been more than adequate for everything we've ever needed. Yes, sliders would be nice, but we haven't needed them (of course, we haven't had 2 cars in the garage since the second one came along). When we found out we were having our second, we looked around at the Auto Show -- the real benefit of the Caravan (as far as I'm concerned) is the cargo room after the third row. It was significantly more than the T-X. I'm not sure if the Flex added much room.

 

That said, we did just fine with one child and a Focus and Protege5. Considering you have an Explorer for family trips, I'd be looking at a Fusion. For my family, I'd consider a people mover for one child overkill.

[fordmantpw]

So why do I have this newfound interest in Minivans? Well, we found out 2 weeks ago that after 5 years of trying and lots of treatments, we are expecting! One goal is to get a carseat-friendly vehicle to take the place of the Mustang as mt wife's daily driver (keeping the Mustang for weekend only duty). I've been looking at used Freestars/Montrey's, and I've been pretty impressed with the product (and they can be had for CHEAP!). I'm also looking at Freestyles / TaurusXs, but the sliders would be a big plus for us.

 

Congrats! That is great news! Hope all goes well for you and the coming little bundle of joy. We bought our Flex due to child number 3 on the way and the need for more space, so I know where you are coming from.

 

A few things that separate the Flex from a traditional minivan are in-cabin mobility (center console prevents access from front to back), roof height, and the big one, sliders. Even though rear-seat access from the rear doors on the Flex are good, the hinge travel required to get a bulky infant carrier / car seat in and out takes up space that usually isn't there in garages, parking lots. I was definately one to think that the Flex would be fine as a Freestar replacement, that is until we started keeping our friend's little ones overnight. Trying to negotiate those carriers and seats in and out of my Explorer was quite difficult, where sliders would have been very nice.

 

Our 3 kids are 6 years, 3 years, 5 months old and we have no issues getting them in/out of our Flex. Sliding doors would be nice at times, but the rear doors on the Flex open very wide and make it easy getting kids in/out.

 

Take the flex. Extend it 12" to 18", raise the roof-line about 6" and add sliders.

 

I agree...that would be a great minivan replacement. Don't think you need to extend it that far, just move the second row seats up some. Extending it that much will make it nearly too long for many garages.

 

One thing about the Flex...it does not have a lot of cargo space behind the third row. And if it had sliding doors, I think it would need to be taller to give you the feel that you can walk around inside better.

[Pioneer]

Ford isn't chasing after the Kia market anymore.

 

Maybe they should. Kia and Hyundai are coming after Ford's.

[PREMiERdrum]

Congratulations.

As a father of 2 and a Taurus X owner, I can confidently say the Taurus X has been more than adequate for everything we've ever needed. Yes, sliders would be nice, but we haven't needed them (of course, we haven't had 2 cars in the garage since the second one came along). When we found out we were having our second, we looked around at the Auto Show -- the real benefit of the Caravan (as far as I'm concerned) is the cargo room after the third row. It was significantly more than the T-X. I'm not sure if the Flex added much room.

 

That said, we did just fine with one child and a Focus and Protege5. Considering you have an Explorer for family trips, I'd be looking at a Fusion. For my family, I'd consider a people mover for one child overkill.

 

Thanks! I definately agree that it would be overkill for 1 child, we've just been bouncing back and forth on what we want. The Fusion is probably the most likely candidate, but the deals I've seen on used Freestars / Montereys have been crazy.

 

A friend of mine has a Taurus X (they just had their first), and his only complaint was getting the baby in and out though the rear doors. We've got 8 months to figure out, so I'm not stressing out yet.

[NickF1011]

Maybe they should. Kia and Hyundai are coming after Ford's.

 

Hyundai? Yes. Kia? Not so much. Kia is still a bargain basement price chaser just like Suzuki. Ford doesn't (and shouldn't) want to play in that arena anymore because profit margins are so razor thin that it's not worth it. The only way Kia and Hyundai are going to become more successful is by going upmarket just as Ford is doing and just as they (at least Hyundai) has been doing.

 

No company becomes a success by selling base models.

[Catalepsy]

I'm predicting that if Ford adds a sliding door to the Flex and stretched it out (adding even more weight), there'll be about the same amount of posts here say, "Oh my god, another boring minivan. Why is Ford building a minivan when the entire market for such vehicles are shrinking more and more." Oh geez, why didn't they just make it smaller and replace the sliding doors with regular swing doors?

 

 

Or maybe the A-Team van look will make a come back...

[silvrsvt]

I was definately one to think that the Flex would be fine as a Freestar replacement, that is until we started keeping our friend's little ones overnight. Trying to negotiate those carriers and seats in and out of my Explorer was quite difficult, where sliders would have been very nice.

 

Well the thing your forgetting is that once you put your child seats into the car, they should stay there. My sister has an Explorer and has a 3 year and a 18 month old and the seats stay in there. When my parents get my nephew or niece, they have a seat for the back of the sable.

[Harley Lover]

I've driven plenty of Odyssey's and Sienna minivans for work and if you have more then 4 people them, they have the same exact amount of room in them as the Flex, if not less. The only thing the Flex gives up to them is that roof isn't as high as a minivan.

I own a Sienna, and that's just not true. I love the Flex, and have looked at it several times, but the two dealbreakers for me are 1) no sliders, and 2) the cargo area aft of the second row is significantly smaller than the Sienna. Your observation on the roof heighth is part of it, but the Sienna is longer in the cargo area than the Flex.

 

I got the Sienna because there wasn't a Ford alternative at the time, and the Flex is definitely more in the CUV arena than the minivan arena. I don't know if Ford should go into the minivan market or not - the articles I read state that the segment is still close to a million units annually (in a regular sales environment), and for the most part, Chrysler/Toyota/Honda own the segment. It seems like Ford, particularly with its excellent rep in the truck market, could carve out a niche of profitable sales. It seems a shame to just allow the other 3 manufacturers to clean up in that segment.

[jpvbs]

My impression of the Flex (a buddy of mine has one), is that it feels much smaller than a minivan. I don't mean the space behind the 3rd row, but the people space feels restricted. Everyone feels closer together than in a Van, particularly, the rear seat. In my household (4 kids - 4,7,9, 10) the oldest (biggest) end up in the back as they are self sufficient, and the younger ones are in the middle. I haven't actually test fit the kids in one, but the rear seats in the Flex just don't look like they would be comfortable on a daily basis. They look like they are for occasional use. Technically, I could probably get away with a Flex vs. a minivan, but for practical purposes, it wouldn't be the best choice.

[ANTAUS]

When was the last time I seriously botched a current Ford fact on this website Antaus?

 

The fact is Farley said that they could sell 'up to 100k' Flexes (specifically he was asked if 100k was 'reasonable' and he said 'absolutely' at a press event in Las Vegas)

 

The estimate was never 100k-100k, nor was it 100k+

 

The estimate you'll see cited most often is 75k-100k, and the lower bound (75k) is still above the planning assumption and the break even point.

 

I'm just reporting what I had read. Although yesterday in a city meeting about cutting budgets in the fire dept, one commissioner made an error and said we had a 100ft ladder truck, then lady jumped to correct her and say 75ft, I rolled my eyes and said, "does it matter, it's still un-necessary".

 

Although if your stating 75, or 60, or 50, and I'm mentioning 100 from what I read, I believe the consensus is that it was an unattainable amount...or as I told the lady "does it really matter?"...because it was sooooo out there, that it was pointless.

 

Plus I really don't check people facts, I try to provide positive flowing conversation, I dont look for excuses to tear down people, or create hostility towards the participants. Thats many peoples frustration on here and why many do not share.

Edited June 23, 2009 by ANTAUS

[Ralph Greene]

I've driven plenty of Odyssey's and Sienna minivans for work and if you have more then 4 people them, they have the same exact amount of room in them as the Flex, if not less. The only thing the Flex gives up to them is that roof isn't as high as a minivan.

 

And that's the problem. If you are an outdoor person hauling lots of bikes and stuff (inside) on your trips, the Flex just doesn't cut it. Or if you haul lots of stuff like that with all seats folder or removed, the Flex doesn't cut it. And there is more than just a few who use their vehicles this way.

 

I think the Flex is a nice vehicle, but it doesn't suit my needs for hauling. Or for any of my friends. Sliders are fine also, but that's not my main gripe with the Flex.

[NickF1011]

And that's the problem. If you are an outdoor person hauling lots of bikes and stuff (inside) on your trips, the Flex just doesn't cut it. Or if you haul lots of stuff like that with all seats folder or removed, the Flex doesn't cut it. And there is more than just a few who use their vehicles this way.

 

I think the Flex is a nice vehicle, but it doesn't suit my needs for hauling. Or for any of my friends. Sliders are fine also, but that's not my main gripe with the Flex.

 

Doesn't cut it?

 

How often are these vehicles packed to capacity anyway? Once, twice, maybe three times a year? They offer these things called "luggage racks" for just such a purpose. I also find that external bike racks are much more convenient and practical, especially for mountain bikes that tend to get muddy after use. Do you really want to put that inside your vehicle anyway?

[Catalepsy]

You haul your bikes inside your minivan? I been trail biking since I was a kid, and I've never seen that before. Doesn't it get the flooring all messy and stuff?

 

And that's the problem. If you are an outdoor person hauling lots of bikes and stuff (inside) on your trips, the Flex just doesn't cut it. Or if you haul lots of stuff like that with all seats folder or removed, the Flex doesn't cut it. And there is more than just a few who use their vehicles this way.

 

I think the Flex is a nice vehicle, but it doesn't suit my needs for hauling. Or for any of my friends. Sliders are fine also, but that's not my main gripe with the Flex.

[stevea26]

We also have a Taurus X and LOVE it. It does 99.9% of what we need. However on paper my wife and I our 2 year old and my in-laws trip to Disney from Pa should work with the room and flexibility of the T-X. However we and (our/my wife's and mother in laws crap) is just not working in the T-X. So I rented a mini van for the trip. I had a baby blue 2008 Kia Sedona for my 17 hour trip. The good news is it only broke down twice and City Kia in Orlando was very helpful in replacing the TPS once I nursed it to FLA. What a POS!!! Long story short we filled every ouce of the Van and would have never fit in the T-X or Flex. There is a need for a true Mini Van in some form in our line up. As great as the Flex is there are still enough people to fill 100,000 driveways with a good Ford Mini van that have kinds and need room and flexibility and don't give a shit what they look like sitting in a Mini van because they have 3 kids. Our store sold 75 Windstars per month in the late 90's and into 2003. Now it is a different time these days but we are lucky to sell 1 or 2 flex a month. We sent up the white flag and handed Dodge Toyota and Honda the market on a silver platter. The sooner we stop thinking the Flex Explorer and Taurus X like cars will work for a Mini Van the sooner we can come to terms with the fact that we NEED a Mini Van in our line up. Dont get me wrone I like the Flex AND Taurus X but it just dosent work as a Van. That is why Honda sells a bunch of Pilots and Odysseys and Toyota sells a bunch of Highlanders and Siennas. We should have....

Escape

Edge

Explorer (car based)

S-Max/Galaxy

Expedition

If Flex stays as a "life style" vehicle for the anti van folks thats great but its really not a core product line.

Ok I just stepped off my soap box.....

[Ralph Greene]

You haul your bikes inside your minivan? I been trail biking since I was a kid, and I've never seen that before. Doesn't it get the flooring all messy and stuff?

 

I don't ride mountain bikes. I just got back from Colorado with son taking our road bikes. I saw thousands of minivans in Colorado with very expensive road bikes inside. I would sure hate to think about a 4000 mile trip with a couple of full Campy Record carbon bikes on outside. This kind of use goes on every weekend with a large number of users.

 

It's true the Flex is a very nice vehicle. I've driven one. I was very impressed with how it drives, rides, seating, etc. The one I drove, a Limited as I recall, was very luxurous with a lot of hi tech gadgets. But....it doesn't not take the place of a minivan. There are many thousands like me as evidenced by the remarks above. I can actually get more of my stuff inside a taller (on inside) Explorer than the Flex....even though the Flex is longer with longer cargo area. I also prefer not to have the 3rd row seats. I am anxiously awaiting the Explorer to see if it has same interior demensions are the recent models.

Edited June 23, 2009 by Ralph Greene

[Catalepsy]

Cool. I'm not a big fan of riding on roads because I swear there is always a diesel truck that points its exhaust in my face whenever I bike on the road. Plus NJ drivers are complete morons and biking on the road is just another way of expediting organ donation. Yeah, if you gotta lock your bikes inside, I wouldn't get a Flex either.

 

 

 

I don't ride mountain bikes. I just got back from Colorado with son taking our road bikes. I saw thousands of minivans in Colorado with very expensive road bikes inside. I would sure hate to think about a 4000 mile trip with a couple of full Campy Record carbon bikes on outside. This kind of use goes on every weekend with a large number of users.

 

It's true the Flex is a very nice vehicle. I've driven one. I was very impressed with how it drives, rides, seating, etc. The one I drove, a Limited as I recall, was very luxurous with a lot of hi tech gadgets. But....it doesn't not take the place of a minivan. There are many thousands like me as evidenced by the remarks above. I can actually get more of my stuff inside a taller (on inside) Explorer than the Flex....even though the Flex is longer with longer cargo area. I am anxiously awaiting the Explorer to see if it has same interior demensions are the recent models.