ds91776 Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Autoblog is reporting that Consumer Reports has rated the Elantra and the Focus over the '12 Civic. Not only that...but the Civic has been rated "too low to be recommended." Ouch. http://www.autoblog.com/2011/08/01/honda-civic-loses-recommended-rating-from-consumer-reports/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CKNSLS Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 (edited) Honda is learning the hard way you can't rest on your laurels. Their design team is horrible. The Accord, Pilot, and Civic are all poor efforts. You can only count on their reliability and that alone will not sell cars anymore. It reminds me of Volvo always harping about safety, they rode that horse for along time (along with poor boxy styling) until most other cars had 5 star safety ratings and 6 airbags or so and looked so much better. At now look at Volvo, another fall from grace. Edited August 2, 2011 by CKNSLS 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 (edited) Maybe so but do those critics are hardly an accurate reflection of how the market perceives Honda? I don't think so, people will continue buying them regardless of what the critics say or think... So, it's up to Ford to keep pressing them all the way with great products and keep getting those conquest sales from disaffected owners... Edited August 2, 2011 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Honda falls, and Hyundai steps right in, no break for Ford. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Maybe so but do those critics are hardly an accurate reflection of how the market perceives Honda? I don't think so, people will continue buying them regardless of what the critics say or think... So, it's up to Ford to keep pressing them all the way with great products and keep getting those conquest sales from disaffected owners... Of course the market perception will not change over night, but if Ford (and others) can continue to show that they can build reliable vehicles while also offering catchy styling, high quality materials, and desired features, then Honda will find itself with more and more of those disaffected owners over the years. Remember: Detroit didn't lose the market in one year either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Some faithfuls will buy it because it's Honda, and whatever preconceived notions they might have but buyers reading articles such as these will probably give them enough reason to try some others instead. Sad part is the Focus again was sited for its poor shifting transmission...I guess CR didn't get Fords PR memo of "Oh it's like that, thats normal its an advanced transmission" letter... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 I guess CR didn't get Fords PR memo of "Oh it's like that, thats normal its an advanced transmission" letter... Or they did and they didn't care. A rough-shifting transmission is a rough-shifting transmission. If that is by design, it is a bad design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Harbinger Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Or they did and they didn't care. A rough-shifting transmission is a rough-shifting transmission. If that is by design, it is a bad design. Or "priorities not aligned with the average consumer's tastes". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Or they did and they didn't care. A rough-shifting transmission is a rough-shifting transmission. If that is by design, it is a bad design. I thought the Focus automatic was a paragon of fuel efficiency? At 40 MPGs (not sure what CR got) it's not so good. The 2012 Civic in Consumer Reports testing returned, "... an impressive 30 mpg overall on regular fuel and 47 mpg on the highway." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Perhaps if, instead of a "a 140-hp, 1.8-liter four-cylinder engine " the Civic had a "160-hp, 2.0-liter, four-cylinder engine" the difference of 28mpg for the Focus versus 30 mpg for the Civic might not be as large. In the meantime, the Civic "has slid backward with its redesign. It feels insubstantial against recently-redesigned competition.. Vague steering weakens its agility and robs it of its fun-to-drive feel. Stopping distances are long, the ride is choppy, and road noise is pronounced" while the Focus "with sporty handling, a supple ride, relatively low noise, and a solid feeling interior, drives more like an upscale compact sports sedan." Aren't quotes great? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 I thought the Focus automatic was a paragon of fuel efficiency? At 40 MPGs (not sure what CR got) it's not so good. The 2012 Civic in Consumer Reports testing returned, "... an impressive 30 mpg overall on regular fuel and 47 mpg on the highway." Like stated before, the Focus has 20 HP more and weighs 2,935 where as the Civic is 2795 (using Top End models for curb weight) I'm sure that Focus owners can get 40+ MPG out their cars also, but you can't advertise anything but EPA tested numbers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moQmv5BqgAQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Mack Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Autoblog is reporting that Consumer Reports has rated the Elantra and the Focus over the '12 Civic. Not only that...but the Civic has been rated "too low to be recommended." Ouch. http://www.autoblog.com/2011/08/01/honda-civic-loses-recommended-rating-from-consumer-reports/ A lot is being made of this, and for good reason. Trust me though, over at Honda WE KNOW. This isn't being taken lightly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 A lot is being made of this, and for good reason. Trust me though, over at Honda WE KNOW. This isn't being taken lightly. Maybe senior management will be encouraged to apologize to Soichiro personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Aren't quotes great? Yeah they are, essential if you're using someone's words :huh: What did the Focus get in CR's highway MPG test? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 A lot is being made of this, and for good reason. Trust me though, over at Honda WE KNOW. This isn't being taken lightly. So what to do? Kamikaze attacks on Consumer Report? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 So what to do? Kamikaze attacks on Consumer Report? nope, checks will be made good.....honestly though, ANY vehicular tests recommendations from CR should either be taken with a grain od salt or completely ignored....toasters on the other hand, not to mention Kitchen Towels should definitely be taken seriously.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 (edited) nope, checks will be made good.....honestly though, ANY vehicular tests recommendations from CR should either be taken with a grain od salt or completely ignored....toasters on the other hand, not to mention Kitchen Towels should definitely be taken seriously.... Indeed! I'm not buying CR's MPGs on the Civic. (as reported above) 47 MPG freeway? Not from users. Were they quoting the Hybrid @ 44 MPGs? http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/bymake/Honda2012.shtml Here the Focus does better than the Civic http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/bymodel/2012_Ford_Focus.shtml Premium fuel in manual trans Civics? Some of the ECO Foci are getting well over 40 MPGs. http://forums.focaljet.com/new-focus/650083-2012-focus-eco-champion-mpg.html Edited August 3, 2011 by timmm55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Maybe senior management will be encouraged to apologize to Soichiro personally. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_3f46NrNU8 Too easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Well Ford pulled this stunt once when they introduced the '96 Taurus, but I think they learned their lesson on that one. I honestly think one of the reasons why we were treated to such a bland Five Hundred in 2005 is because Ford was so scared after the '96 Taurus styling disaster. Actually the 2000+ Taurus looked pretty good at the time and if that would have been the Taurus that was introduced in 1996 I think Ford would have held the sales leadership in the midsize market at least until it became long in the tooth. I still feel the current Caravan/Town and Country was a step backwards from the previous design so I think every automaker is guilty of doing this once in awhile. Honda believes that H on the grille will sell anything... we will see how that works for them this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosetang Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 As the Autoblog guys pointed out in their podcast this week, the kind of people who put a lot of stock in CR ratings are the same people who've been buying Civics for years. This is a hit right in the breadbasket, and I expect there's some scrambling going on over at HQ. Ford can help the Focus a lot with some software fixes (and a beefed up supply chain). But Civic's problems run deeper, and the fixing of some might create others. Adding more insulation for road noise, for example, would increase the car's weight and then they must address the negative effects of a porkier vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 As the Autoblog guys pointed out in their podcast this week, the kind of people who put a lot of stock in CR ratings are the same people who've been buying Civics for years. This is a hit right in the breadbasket, and I expect there's some scrambling going on over at HQ. Ford can help the Focus a lot with some software fixes (and a beefed up supply chain). But Civic's problems run deeper, and the fixing of some might create others. Adding more insulation for road noise, for example, would increase the car's weight and then they must address the negative effects of a porkier vehicle. What road noise? the Focus problems are the MFT and the Automatic. Fix them and it's a damn near perfect small car! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 such a bland Five Hundred in 2005 Both it and especially the '06 Fusion were intended to use the styling 'language' of the Ford Mondeo: As you can see above, using European designs in the US only works when the designs in Europe are good. When they are horrible, as the 2nd gen. Mondeo was, you get, well, what you get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Both it and especially the '06 Fusion were intended to use the styling 'language' of the Ford Mondeo: As you can see above, using European designs in the US only works when the designs in Europe are good. When they are horrible, as the 2nd gen. Mondeo was, you get, well, what you get. In my opinion the Fusion turned out a lot better then the Five Hundred as far as styling is concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weiweishen Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Honda falls, and Hyundai steps right in, no break for Ford. It is not a bad thing. If hyundai can take away market share from Toyota and Honda, then Toyota and Honda have to increase the price for their cars or further cut the cost of their vehicles, both of which are very challenge in current situation. There are always 40 to 45% of American who only buy big three, so only 55 to 60% market shares are for Japanese, Korean, German, or Chinese in the future. The more competitors participate in this 55% market share, the better the chance for the big three implement their strategy, the more the difficult for those foreign companies survive in US market. Who let dogs out! they should eat each other now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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