ice-capades Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 'Affordability Shift' Taking Root Among New-Vehicle Buyers Las Vegas Review-Journal (Print Edition - Link not available) The Associated Press Article Las Vegas Review-Journal_2024-10-23_'Affordability Shift' Taking Root Among New-Vehicle Buyers.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 If the car payment doesn't break you, the property taxes and insurance will! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 CE1 can't get here soon enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 Not surprising considering most buyers are not “car guys” and many view vehicles as transportation, not status symbol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 This is not at all surprising. There is a tightening in the economy in the US. A fair amount from inflation the past 3 years but I'd wager a lot of it also stems from people becoming addicted to cheap financing. A 50k car at 0 to 2% interest is a much different payment than a $50k car at 8% interest. 50k over 6 years at 0% = $694/month. 50k over 6 years at 8% = $876... Close to $200 increase monthly due to financing. That same $694 monthly at 8% interest gets you a $38,600 vehicle. A lot of people buy up to their absolute limit monthly rather than what they really need or a set price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 3 minutes ago, blazerdude20 said: A lot of people buy up to their absolute limit monthly rather than what they really need or a set price. Article suggests that’s what may be changing, and mentioned example of lady could have afforded buying much higher cost vehicle but didn’t. I suppose we could call it being frugal, or maybe wise? 😀 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted October 23 Author Share Posted October 23 2 hours ago, Joe771476 said: If the car payment doesn't break you, the property taxes and insurance will! No kidding! I left the dealership officially in September 2020 after the initial COVID-19 impact to deal with estate and other matters. I did a low mileage 24-month lease on a 2020 EcoSport because of the large incentives and put down enough to get a monthly lease payment of slightly over $200/month. At the end of the lease, the lease buy-out figure was so attractive that I bought the vehicle with additional money down and maintained about the same monthly payment. I drove EcoBoost, GT & California Special models as my company car over the years with my last one being a 2020 EcoBoost Fastback equipped with Automatic, Security Package and Ford Navigation System. It was an absolute pleasure to drive and would have loved to have kept driving it on a lease or purchase basis, but it made no sense financially. The difference was an additional $150 per month which I couldn't justify at the time based on the unknown, long-term factors of the pandemic, etc. I've had the EcoSport for 50 months now and it only has about 3,800 miles on it. If I'd done the deal on a Mustang, I'd driven a lot more! In the meantime, my insurance costs have gone up every year with the most recent being a $500 increase for a 6-month term and property taxes that are about $500 per year. Welcome to Connecticut! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 29 minutes ago, ice-capades said: I've had the EcoSport for 50 months now and it only has about 3,800 miles on it. Good lord, you need to get out more! When I traded-in my 10 month old 2024 Maverick last month, it had 16K on it. And I'm retired, with no daily commute. HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 (edited) 1 hour ago, Rick73 said: Not surprising considering most buyers are not “car guys” and many view vehicles as transportation, not status symbol. Like duh. Edited October 23 by Biker16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 (edited) 3 hours ago, Joe771476 said: If the car payment doesn't break you, the property taxes and insurance will! I just got another escrow notification the other day-my mortgage payments per month has gone up almost $400 bucks since I bought it in 2016 because of Property taxes and insurance. Edited October 23 by silvrsvt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 58 minutes ago, silvrsvt said: I just got another escrow notification the other day-my mortgage payments per month has gone up almost $400 bucks since I bought it in 2016 because of Property taxes and insurance. feel for you...sooner or later your taxes and Insurance will be more than your actual mortgage....DOH!@.....I dont have a mortgage thank goodness...Insurance just got cancewlled as everyone wants out of California...but my taxes run approx $700 a month on a house purchased over 20years ago....insane.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 2 hours ago, jpd80 said: Ford's strategy to use CE1 not to just make affordable cars, but to get back to the idea of aspirational affordable models is brilliant. Affordable cars that you actually want to own is a market most brands have abandoned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 1 hour ago, silvrsvt said: I just got another escrow notification the other day-my mortgage payments per month has gone up almost $400 bucks since I bought it in 2016 because of Property taxes and insurance. It's getting crazy out here. My folks bought their 7 bedroom three story home for a shade under 400k near the end of 2012. During the height of the housing price insanity, it was valued at close to a million dollars. It's dipped to around 750k since, but that's still a crazy increase in a little over a decade. Even in downtown Salt Lake, which is the most run down part of Utah more or less, small homes are like half a mil. I'm talking about small, run down homes built in the 1950s. There has to be a housing crash around the corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 1 hour ago, HotRunrGuy said: Good lord, you need to get out more! When I traded-in my 10 month old 2024 Maverick last month, it had 16K on it. And I'm retired, with no daily commute. HRG My 2022 maverick hybrid is a little over 2 years old and has 11k on it lol. I'm scared it's gonna have issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 43 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said: It's getting crazy out here. My folks bought their 7 bedroom three story home for a shade under 400k near the end of 2012. During the height of the housing price insanity, it was valued at close to a million dollars. It's dipped to around 750k since, but that's still a crazy increase in a little over a decade. Even in downtown Salt Lake, which is the most run down part of Utah more or less, small homes are like half a mil. I'm talking about small, run down homes built in the 1950s. There has to be a housing crash around the corner. I've been looking at houses, and stuff is still crazy priced vs. what it is...having the mental debate of how long do you wait for things to correct vs. biting the bullet and getting in the market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 51 minutes ago, Deanh said: feel for you...sooner or later your taxes and Insurance will be more than your actual mortgage....DOH!@.....I dont have a mortgage thank goodness...Insurance just got cancewlled as everyone wants out of California...but my taxes run approx $700 a month on a house purchased over 20years ago....insane.... Escrow? What is this “Escrow” you speak of? We ditched escrow 15 years ago. I’d rather manage that myself. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 5 minutes ago, rmc523 said: I've been looking at houses, and stuff is still crazy priced vs. what it is...having the mental debate of how long do you wait for things to correct vs. biting the bullet and getting in the market. We sold our old house in 2017 for $525k, bought our current one for $570K and added $130k worth of pool, patio and landscaping so all in at $700k. Based on current sales of new houses next to us it’s worth about $1.4M. Not that we plan to leave any time soon but it’s nice to have the equity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 1 hour ago, Deanh said: feel for you...sooner or later your taxes and Insurance will be more than your actual mortgage....DOH!@.....I dont have a mortgage thank goodness...Insurance just got cancewlled as everyone wants out of California...but my taxes run approx $700 a month on a house purchased over 20years ago....insane.... I wish my property taxes were $700/month,,,,,,, HRG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 1 hour ago, Deanh said: feel for you...sooner or later your taxes and Insurance will be more than your actual mortgage....DOH!@.....I dont have a mortgage thank goodness...Insurance just got cancewlled as everyone wants out of California...but my taxes run approx $700 a month on a house purchased over 20years ago....insane.... They already are....my property taxes are around 10K a year. Yeah my house is worth a lot more then what I paid for it, but the property taxes have gone up about 3-4K since I bought it because of that. Insurance is about $250 more a year too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 2 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: Ford's strategy to use CE1 not to just make affordable cars, but to get back to the idea of aspirational affordable models is brilliant. Affordable cars that you actually want to own is a market most brands have abandoned. In the interview, Farley shared that post pandemic buyers were not prepared to pay the premium prices Ford was setting, that its BEVs were around $20,000 too expensive for the new market so they took a left turn with their Gen 2 BEVs……..he’s obviously talking about skunkworks CE1 BEVs and the previous GE2 3-row Utility now quietly cancelled. All of that makes perfect sense. Also sounds like Ford will be switching to LFP battery chemistry for both safety and a longer lifed battery. LFP not having the thermal runaway issues of lithium cobalt cells which have higher power density. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 Built my house in 2008 for $265k. Taxes were $2000 a year. House is now worth about $550k. Taxes are $2400 a year. While house values have increased, property taxes have stayed "OK" in my area. But North Dakota doesn't follow many national trends... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 4 hours ago, jpd80 said: That is very interesting conversation, and information provided by Farley, particularly towards end of video. His comments regarding efficiency and aerodynamic improvements as a means to reduce battery size and therefore be able to compete with Chinese is quite telling and a complete turnaround from first Ford BEVs. He’s stated a few times now that BEV profitability is opposite from that of ICE, where larger ICE vehicles are generally most profitable, while in BEVs it is the smallest. To me this has been obvious and also where manufacturers needed to start (at least until various technologies improve significantly), but understand this concept is filled with contradictions. Auto manufacturers have been marketing larger and larger high-cost ICE SUVs for years and now need to change buyer perceptions if BEVs are to be successful. That’s a tough order. Farley specifically mentioned skunkworks being made up mostly of ex-Tesla employees and aerodynamicist from European racing. It will be incredibly interesting to see if their new vehicles truly pursue energy efficiency, or if they simply end up being a more aero SUV. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 24 Share Posted October 24 17 hours ago, jpd80 said: In the interview, Farley shared that post pandemic buyers were not prepared to pay the premium prices Ford was setting, that its BEVs were around $20,000 too expensive for the new market so they took a left turn with their Gen 2 BEVs……..he’s obviously talking about skunkworks CE1 BEVs and the previous GE2 3-row Utility now quietly cancelled. All of that makes perfect sense. Also sounds like Ford will be switching to LFP battery chemistry for both safety and a longer lifed battery. LFP not having the thermal runaway issues of lithium cobalt cells which have higher power density. Sadly, it didn't take a rocket scientist to realize they were stretching too far with pricing......but apparently higher ups didn't see it? 16 hours ago, Rick73 said: That is very interesting conversation, and information provided by Farley, particularly towards end of video. His comments regarding efficiency and aerodynamic improvements as a means to reduce battery size and therefore be able to compete with Chinese is quite telling and a complete turnaround from first Ford BEVs. He’s stated a few times now that BEV profitability is opposite from that of ICE, where larger ICE vehicles are generally most profitable, while in BEVs it is the smallest. To me this has been obvious and also where manufacturers needed to start (at least until various technologies improve significantly), but understand this concept is filled with contradictions. Auto manufacturers have been marketing larger and larger high-cost ICE SUVs for years and now need to change buyer perceptions if BEVs are to be successful. That’s a tough order. Farley specifically mentioned skunkworks being made up mostly of ex-Tesla employees and aerodynamicist from European racing. It will be incredibly interesting to see if their new vehicles truly pursue energy efficiency, or if they simply end up being a more aero SUV. The irony is though that buyers like larger SUV type models, so we're going to try to swim against the current with tiny vehicles? (If we're talking c-sized, though, it should be ok as a starting point). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted October 24 Share Posted October 24 32 minutes ago, rmc523 said: The irony is though that buyers like larger SUV type models, so we're going to try to swim against the current with tiny vehicles? (If we're talking c-sized, though, it should be ok as a starting point). I believe it helps to view buyers as a spectrum rather than homogeneous group. Not all buyers want large SUVs just like not all want compact electric vehicles. I expect the distribution on size preferences is more like a bell curve, with fewer and fewer buyers wanting vehicles that are too large or too small. “Average” no doubt works best but is not only solution. So, if BEVs can only be competitive with ICE and hybrids in smaller sizes, I suppose it’s best to limit designs to those vehicles even though the market is much smaller for now. If buyers like smaller BEVs perhaps demand will grow, or as technology improves making larger BEVs more competitive with larger ICE. I’m just saying small BEVs is swimming against the current for most buyers today, but not all. For some it’s swimming with the current. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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