blazerdude20 Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 My link The ride wasn't cushy, but we only really noticed it going over bridges where the surface height was lower than that of the rest of the road. Staying at freeway speeds was easy, too. The truck was speed-limited to 75 mph because of the tires, but we set the cruise control at 70 on the open road, and achieved 5.7 mpg. Most of the time, the transmission was smooth and responsive, forced to hunt only when we did silly things like passing slow cars while going uphill. This isn't something we'd recommend, but the truck did it quite well. Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/trucks/1206_2012_ford_f_650_dump_truck_first_test/#ixzz1rh4T6ZFg What's especially interesting about this truck is that it is not a diesel -- it's powered by a three-valve, 6.8-liter V-10, and is the only truck in its class available with a gas-powered engine. We picked up the truck in Los Angeles, and the adventure began Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/trucks/1206_2012_ford_f_650_dump_truck_first_test/#ixzz1rh4eSolR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfeg Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 My kind of road test. But they should have taken a load of dirt back to LA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVTCobra Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Nice to see the V10 still living on. Makes me wonder how much more power it would have if they upgraded to D.I. and some of the other more modern bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Wondering out loud if the 6.7L Powerstroke was made available for this application. A related question is, can the 6.7L PS engine be made without turbos and what would that engine put out in power for a truck like this? No turbos and related gear would make the engine a lot less complicated for a service fleet managers department, but could it be reconfigured to put the emphasis on low end torque and fuel economy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Wondering out loud if the 6.7L Powerstroke was made available for this application. A related question is, can the 6.7L PS engine be made without turbos and what would that engine put out in power for a truck like this? No turbos and related gear would make the engine a lot less complicated for a service fleet managers department, but could it be reconfigured to put the emphasis on low end torque and fuel economy? You raise a very valid point. Why haven't they done that already? As I've mentioned before, If I were selling Dodges I would tell my customers-..."our engine is so good, its the ONLY diesel Ford uses in its medium duty trucks", My guess is the party line will be they are not using it in 650 (should I say "at least 650?") because of "product availability-we need all we can produce to satisfy 250-550". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Wondering out loud if the 6.7L Powerstroke was made available for this application. A related question is, can the 6.7L PS engine be made without turbos and what would that engine put out in power for a truck like this? No turbos and related gear would make the engine a lot less complicated for a service fleet managers department, but could it be reconfigured to put the emphasis on low end torque and fuel economy? I think part of the reason the 6.7L Powerstroke isn't being used in an HD application is that might not be able to meet the requirements for one. I'm not going to say that it can't, but I'll be willing bet it was made to meet emission, etc that set in place for light duty trucks...and might need some more work or updating (in new packaging/design) for HD work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I think part of the reason the 6.7L Powerstroke isn't being used in an HD application is that might not be able to meet the requirements for one. I'm not going to say that it can't, but I'll be willing bet it was made to meet emission, etc that set in place for light duty trucks...and might need some more work or updating (in new packaging/design) for HD work. Ford has made both the 6.7L and the Torqueshift tranny with standard SAE bellhousing and bolt patterns to allow them to easily slot in as an option for larger trucks. In the article mentioning that the Ford 6.7 is the engine of choice for the new armed forces vehicle (can't remember the link or name of the vehicle), it mentions that the rating for the 6.7 in that vehicle is 320 (ish) HP and 720 (ish) ft-lbs of torque, both of which are down from the pickup version, most likely to increase durability. Also, testing was done to determine how it handles standard military fuels and not just ULSD. The 6.7 handled itself well, and I think is set up well for HD use. I think Ford wants to give it a couple years to prove itself, then start pushing it in more HD applications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfeg Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Wondering out loud if the 6.7L Powerstroke was made available for this application. A related question is, can the 6.7L PS engine be made without turbos and what would that engine put out in power for a truck like this? No turbos and related gear would make the engine a lot less complicated for a service fleet managers department, but could it be reconfigured to put the emphasis on low end torque and fuel economy? I do not think that the turbos and intercooler are an issue for fleets and owners of mediums - they have been pretty much standard for years in this segment. And the turbos help with compliance with emissions standards and reducing smoke opacity. One thing there is noticeable resistance to is vee block engines - straight sixes are the predominate choice. V8s are not very popular with maintenance staffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 You raise a very valid point. Why haven't they done that already? As I've mentioned before, If I were selling Dodges I would tell my customers-..."our engine is so good, its the ONLY diesel Ford uses in its medium duty trucks", My guess is the party line will be they are not using it in 650 (should I say "at least 650?") because of "product availability-we need all we can produce to satisfy 250-550". I think the 6.7L Powerstroke may indeed show up in the 650 when medium duty truck production moves from 'Blue Diamond' to Avon Lake. I have heard a few rumors about this, and if anyone can verify....... First off, supposedly sales of the 6.7L Powerstroke has not meet expectations. Remember that this diesel was designed in the heyday of HD diesel pickups, and since it was introduced sales of those vehicles has fallen. Ford may have seen this coming, and it may explain why the 6.7L is manufactured in Mexico (inexpensive labor) and why it has an SAE bellhousing (adaptability to other OEM's). Ford was activily trying to sell the 6.7L to other OEM's with no success. Second, the relationship between Ford and Navistar as been, well, strained to say the least. The current agreement basically lets Navistar call the shots, and maybe Navistar was reluctant to install the Ford engine in 'thier' truck. I bring this up because I heard some years ago that Ford had wanted to offer the V-10 gas engine in the 650 for the rental fleets, and Navistar wouldn't do it until just recently. Don't know how much truth there is to all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) Getting 5.7 MPG at 70 MPH isn't too bad. I usually get around 6'ish with my motorhome at 60 to 65 MPH. A Super C Toy Hauler based on an F650/V10 would make a really nice rig. Edited April 13, 2012 by NLPRacing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomcat68 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 My kind of road test. But they should have taken a load of dirt back to LA. They could have taken a load of crap... All the copies of Motor Trend magazine! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 One thing there is noticeable resistance to is vee block engines - straight sixes are the predominate choice. V8s are not very popular with maintenance staffs. Concur ! My guess is, it you have the room in an engine bay, an I6 is cheaper to build and rebuild. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I think the 6.7L Powerstroke may indeed show up in the 650 when medium duty truck production moves from 'Blue Diamond' to Avon Lake. I have heard a few rumors about this, and if anyone can verify....... Reasonable prognostication ! I haven't talked to my diesel buddy in Dearborn for over 4 months. Second, the relationship between Ford and Navistar as been, well, strained to say the least. "Strained" !!! The divorce is effectively done. The next 12 months are just winding down operation in Mexico and building the line at Avon Lake. I expect construction to start there within the next few months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 One thing there is noticeable resistance to is vee block engines - straight sixes are the predominate choice. V8s are not very popular with maintenance staffs. Concur ! My guess is, it you have the room in an engine bay, an I6 is cheaper to build and rebuild. Then I would be thinking, if a "V" configuration is out of the question for the above stated reasons....what would it take to add a cylinder to the 3.2L I-5 series Duratorq for medium duty truck applications? It would add .64 liters to the size and I would think it could be "punched out" to round it up to a 4.0L or 4.5L size....a normally aspirated design that should easily get 275-300HP and north of 450-500 ft lbs of torque. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Well, Ford-Otosan make CGI block 7.3 and 9.0 Liter 6-Cylinder Ecotorq Engine Series. Blocks and heads are done by Sintercast. Something that big might be overkill, but . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 (edited) Ford ECOTORQ .pdf paper Ford claims Euro IV compliance and the engine would work in medium duty trucks....this engine looks like it could become the darling of the industry if Ford brought it over here.... Edited April 14, 2012 by twintornados Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White99GT Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I think part of the reason the 6.7L Powerstroke isn't being used in an HD application is that might not be able to meet the requirements for one. I'm not going to say that it can't, but I'll be willing bet it was made to meet emission, etc that set in place for light duty trucks...and might need some more work or updating (in new packaging/design) for HD work. The 3V V10 is suitable HD work but the 6.7 PSD isn't? Think about that for a second, seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 Ford ECOTORQ .pdf paper Ford claims Euro IV compliance and the engine would work in medium duty trucks....this engine looks like it could become the darling of the industry if Ford brought it over here.... Good info-far beyond my level of comprehension but it does look like a good addition to the 6.7 Cummins for 650/750. Key question-how do Euro IV compliance standards compare with ours? By the way, the Ford Turkey website has some good truck info-or should I say pictures if you can't read whatever the language of Turkey is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 (edited) Euro IV is nowhere near as aggressive as US emissions standards when it comes to diesel. Under Euro IV, some diesel Fiestas emitted more NOx than F250s. Also, Euro IV is being phased out in favor of Euro V, which eliminates the favorable treatment of diesel exhaust. Edited April 15, 2012 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 Ford ECOTORQ .pdf paper Ford claims Euro IV compliance and the engine would work in medium duty trucks....this engine looks like it could become the darling of the industry if Ford brought it over here.... Convert the h.p. (kw) and torque (Nm). That engine has nothing on a 6.7L Cummins. Probably much larger and heavier too. It is probably designed for local conditions, durability and ease of maintenance over everything else. Is it a distant relative of the old New Holland diesels? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 Convert the h.p. (kw) and torque (Nm). That engine has nothing on a 6.7L Cummins. Probably much larger and heavier too. It is probably designed for local conditions, durability and ease of maintenance over everything else. Is it a distant relative of the old New Holland diesels? CGI block and heads by Sintercast (you can find the link above). Designed to meet Euro IV. Not apparently related to any New Holland design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 So, the question remains...could Ford create an I6 Duratorq based on the existing I5 design slated for T-Series in North America and thus spread out the cost of manufacture for use in Avon Lake medium chassis trucks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Convert the h.p. (kw) and torque (Nm). That engine has nothing on a 6.7L Cummins. Probably much larger and heavier too. It is probably designed for local conditions, durability and ease of maintenance over everything else. Is it a distant relative of the old New Holland diesels? Well it looks like the bigger version of the two 7.3's puts out 296 HP and 811 ft pds! not bad. And if it was designed -in 2000? -for "durability and ease of maintenance", I'll buy that. Hopefully they have had 10 years of field experience and have been looking beyond Europe-that is if "One Ford" applies to vehicles beyond Focus. In any case go to You Tube and search for Ford Cargo- again-language aside there are some videos of Cargos in heavy dump truck service- something I would say would be far beyond a 6.7's capability unless it had about a 9.00 rear axle ratio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Well it looks like the bigger version of the two 7.3's puts out 296 HP and 811 ft pds! not bad. And if it was designed -in 2000? -for "durability and ease of maintenance", I'll buy that. Hopefully they have had 10 years of field experience and have been looking beyond Europe-that is if "One Ford" applies to vehicles beyond Focus. In any case go to You Tube and search for Ford Cargo- again-language aside there are some videos of Cargos in heavy dump truck service- something I would say would be far beyond a 6.7's capability unless it had about a 9.00 rear axle ratio Actually on You tube its..Ford Cargo Tanitium Videosu 3536 4136. Appears to be some sort of a sales pitch with a bunch of hard hatted customers viewing the show. Very good shots of tandem articulation. Also for you old guys-in the background recurring shots of a Bucyrus Erie 22B that looks like its sitting on a barge. Again "One Ford"??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosetang Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Ford should do like the DoD, have a contest to see which company can build the best I6 diesel. Kick the industry into gear to produce the next generation of great engines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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