silvrsvt Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/us-fuel-efficiency-goals-could-fall-short-by-2025-federal-report-finds/2016/07/18/43660cec-4cf1-11e6-a7d8-13d06b37f256_story.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 (edited) https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/us-fuel-efficiency-goals-could-fall-short-by-2025-federal-report-finds/2016/07/18/43660cec-4cf1-11e6-a7d8-13d06b37f256_story.html CAFE doesn't work, you have to increase the cost of fuel, to encourage less consumption. It works, if it doesn't we would not have seen the return of the popularity of trucks. as the price of Gas fell from the highs seen a few years ago. Edited July 19, 2016 by Biker16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 19, 2016 Author Share Posted July 19, 2016 CAFE doesn't work, you have to increase the cost of fuel, to encourage less consumption. It works, if it doesn't we would not have seen the return of the popularity of trucks. as the price of Gas fell from the highs seen a few years ago. People won't be happy if you artificially raise the price on something to shape demand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 People won't be happy if you artificially raise the price on something to shape demand. Especially with the repercussions that raising gas prices has on the entire economy. Everything from groceries to garbage pickup goes up when fuel prices rise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 Especially with the repercussions that raising gas prices has on the entire economy. Everything from groceries to garbage pickup goes up when fuel prices rise. maybe the government should stop subsidizing driving larger vehicles, not charging the road user the full costs of using roads. 51% of road maintenance costs are not paid by the road user. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
630land Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 (edited) Want high taxes? Then move to the EU and get a precious "manual trans station wagon". Or, we can be like other countries and not be able to own a car at all, how's that sound? Edited July 19, 2016 by 630land Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 maybe the government should stop subsidizing driving larger vehicles, not charging the road user the full costs of using roads. 51% of road maintenance costs are not paid by the road user. How are they subsidizing driving larger cars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grbeck Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 (edited) The relationship between the amount of damage a vehicle causes to a road, and the vehicle's weight, is not linear. An F-150 isn't causing any more damage to the road than a Focus or a Civic. Our roads are designed to handle 80,000 pound tractor trailers. Driving a Focus instead of an F-150 isn't going to lower the road maintenance costs incurred by state and local governments. The vehicles causing the most damage to our roads are tractor trailers. No mode of transit "pays its own way." For example, fares regularly only pay about 35-40 percent of the cost to operate and maintain mass transit systems in this country. If anything, drivers are more likely to subsidize mass transit systems, given that a certain percentage of federal motor fuels tax revenues can be spent on non-road projects. At the state level, here in Pennsylvania, a portion of the revenue from tolls paid by drivers to use the Pennsylvania Turnpike is being diverted to support various mass transit systems around the state. Edited July 19, 2016 by grbeck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 Toll roads are fine and dandy unless you live in a state like Michigan that doesn't have an interstate running all the way across it. The closest are I-94 that runs from Canada (by way of the Blue Water Bridge at Sarnia) and the Chicago area, and I-75 and that ends in the U.P. I wish we had an I-90 that begins and ends at a state line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 Toll roads are fine and dandy unless you live in a state like Michigan that doesn't have an interstate running all the way across it. The closest are I-94 that runs from Canada (by way of the Blue Water Bridge at Sarnia) and the Chicago area, and I-75 and that ends in the U.P. I wish we had an I-90 that begins and ends at a state line. Interstate highways can be toll roads too. I-80, in Ohio, is and interstate highway and a toll road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 (edited) Interstate highways can be toll roads too. I-80, in Ohio, is and interstate highway and a toll road. I know, it doesn't make sense if that interstate doesn't go all the way across a state though Edited July 20, 2016 by fuzzymoomoo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 I know, it doesn't make sense if that interstate doesn't go all the way across a state though Interstate doesn't mean it crosses a border. The interstates just designate a federally funded road, paid by collective taxes of all states. Or I completely missed what you were saying... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 Interstate means it crosses from one state to the other (interstate commerce). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 Interstate doesn't mean it crosses a border. The interstates just designate a federally funded road, paid by collective taxes of all states. Or I completely missed what you were saying... Go with option b Take my I75 example. It enters Michigan at the Ohio border, goes all the way up to the U.P, then ends. It doesn't go all the way to another state. Same with 96 and 94. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 Go with option b Take my I75 example. It enters Michigan at the Ohio border, goes all the way up to the U.P, then ends. It doesn't go all the way to another state. Same with 96 and 94. Why can't it be a toll road though? If you want to get from OH to the UP, you pay a toll to take I75, or take lesser roads for free. No? And if I75 went any further norther wouldn't it be an Internation instead of Interstate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 Why can't it be a toll road though? If you want to get from OH to the UP, you pay a toll to take I75, or take lesser roads for free. No? And if I75 went any further norther wouldn't it be an Internation instead of Interstate? It could be a toll road, I've even heard it suggested by the state legislature, but the problem is once you get past the Flint area, you're losing out on the cross-state truck traffic which is a huge part of what makes toll roads viable. Sure, you would get spikes at certain holidays from the traffic going up north, and again in November for hunting season, but having what is essentially a one-way toll road is going to be a non-starter. A better option might be I-69 from Sarnia, Ontario to Indiana, or I-94 from Sarnia to Chicago, but the problem with 94 is its extremely congested through Detroit, and 69 just isn't heavily travelled enough to make it worthwhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 Go with option b Take my I75 example. It enters Michigan at the Ohio border, goes all the way up to the U.P, then ends. It doesn't go all the way to another state. Same with 96 and 94. Of course it goes to another state. It goes from Michigan to Ohio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 It could be a toll road, I've even heard it suggested by the state legislature, but the problem is once you get past the Flint area, you're losing out on the cross-state truck traffic which is a huge part of what makes toll roads viable. Sure, you would get spikes at certain holidays from the traffic going up north, and again in November for hunting season, but having what is essentially a one-way toll road is going to be a non-starter. A better option might be I-69 from Sarnia, Ontario to Indiana, or I-94 from Sarnia to Chicago, but the problem with 94 is its extremely congested through Detroit, and 69 just isn't heavily travelled enough to make it worthwhile. Gotcha, that makes sense. Is there much traffic to/from Canada through there though? Of course it goes to another state. It goes from Michigan to Ohio. He meant the other end. Looks like I75 just turns into a state road and then a Canadian HWY at the Canada border. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 People won't be happy if you artificially raise the price on something to shape demand. People aren't happy about the lunacy behind CAFE, either. As Bob Lutz once said, the standards are "like trying to fight obesity by requiring tailors to make only small-sized clothes." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 People aren't happy about the lunacy behind CAFE, either. As Bob Lutz once said, the standards are "like trying to fight obesity by requiring tailors to make only small-sized clothes." Most people outside of the car business know almost nothing about CAFE and the lunacy behind it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted July 20, 2016 Share Posted July 20, 2016 Gotcha, that makes sense. Is there much traffic to/from Canada through there though? He meant the other end. Looks like I75 just turns into a state road and then a Canadian HWY at the Canada border. There's much more traffic that uses the Ambassador Bridge in Detroit/Windsor, and it's not even close. That crossing is among the busiest in the country. The Blue Water Bridge is mostly cars and campers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 He meant the other end. Looks like I75 just turns into a state road and then a Canadian HWY at the Canada border. I know but interstate doesn't mean it has to traverse an entire state. If it goes from Michigan to Ohio and Ohio to Michigan then that's the definition of interstate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnLover Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 please do tell me what possible reason Ford can use now, that EPA drops that unrealistic - to say the least- fuel mpg goal, to not put a TT V8 option in the 2018 Navigator?!?!?!?! besides emissions, which is easy to handle with a small-mid size V8 and obviously TT...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomcat68 Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 please do tell me what possible reason Ford can use now, that EPA drops that unrealistic - to say the least- fuel mpg goal, to not put a TT V8 option in the 2018 Navigator?!?!?!?! besides emissions, which is easy to handle with a small-mid size V8 and obviously TT...... The EPA is not going to lower their standards. They just aren't raising them higher than they are now, and now they are hard to hit. The only way I see an option like that is if it is an ultra rare edition which I don't see them doing in the foreseeable future. The Lincoln brand will have to be well established with its bread and butter product line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 From my time in Michigan, the UP can be considered another state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.