Broncofan7 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 GM Hustling to Bring PHEV Chevy Silverado, GMC Sierra to Market (autoweek.com) Towards the end of the article until the 2030's. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 The last thing that was put out was the Bronco EV not coming out till 2029CY, which would make it a CY2030. I have a feeling alot of things are going to shift left and right as time goes on. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) 9 hours ago, silvrsvt said: The last thing that was put out was the Bronco EV not coming out till 2029CY, which would make it a CY2030. I have a feeling alot of things are going to shift left and right as time goes on. I’m betting that the biggest change will be that just Ford stops talking about BEVs. It’s a good way to patch up things with dealers…….for now. Edited February 21 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, jpd80 said: I’m betting that the biggest change will be that just Ford stops talking about BEVs. It’s a good way to patch up things with dealers…….for now. Yeah that would make the most sense-there are a lot of different headwinds over the next 24-48 months that are going to affect things-Presidential election later this year, geopolitical strife that doesn't look like it will get any better anytime soon, manufacturing issues with China/overseas and start of demographic decline in several countries 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Not sure how I feel about this. It's clear EVs aren't going to be the overnight success people thought. But it's also obvious they're going to be crucial in the future. So for Ford to basically be giving up on EVs, canceling programs, delaying programs, I feel as though that's a mistake. There needs to be a balance here guys. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 2 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: Not sure how I feel about this. It's clear EVs aren't going to be the overnight success people thought. But it's also obvious they're going to be crucial in the future. So for Ford to basically be giving up on EVs, canceling programs, delaying programs, I feel as though that's a mistake. There needs to be a balance here guys. IMO I think some of this is being read into too much. So lets look at this objectively: Here is an article from 2021 https://www.slashgear.com/ford-explorer-ev-confirmed-and-an-electric-bronco-could-be-next-26674602 So there has been some obfuscation of information- Ford was/is working on a couple different EV projects and things have changed-since that article I'm guessing Ford was planning on using the MEB platform at Oakville with the 3 row EV. With that said, the name Explorer was being attached to the 3 row EV, but only was used on the MEB EU only product. The 3 Row EV was apparently supposed to be released last year? But COVID completely screwed that up, plus I guess some of the other rumblings about its styling also might have played a role with that. So going forward: Explorer EV for the EU launches this summer-Apparently a sporty model called the Puma launches afterwards 3 row EV for Ford and Lincoln launches in 2025 at Oakville as 2026MY products? BOC opens in 2025 for the new Ford Truck EV (Lightning production ends? UAW contract says Mich EV assembly can transfer to BOC)-maybe slides to 2026? C SUV EV-Escape Replacement-apparently this was supposed to be in production around the end of the UAW contract in 2027-I'm guessing this slides to the right a few years. Might even move to Mexico depending on how Ford's relation with UAW is. Mach E update/replacement-No information AFAIK as late-maybe was supposed to be 2026? Mustang EV Coupe-rumored 2029-see that sliding right into 2030s Bronco EV-2029 Rumor-Slide into 2030s I see the Bronco/Ranger and Mustang getting a 2.3L Ecoboost hybrid option in the next 3-4 years to hold them over to they are replaced by EVs. Another IMO-I hope the government is still planning on building more charging stations if things do get delayed, because that will make more people want to buy them because of range anxiety will be reduced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) 22 minutes ago, silvrsvt said: UAW contract says Mich EV assembly can transfer to BOC)-maybe slides to 2026? How TF is that supposed to work when most of them are coming to MAP for this mythical 3rd shift? Edited February 21 by fuzzymoomoo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 6 hours ago, silvrsvt said: Yeah that would make the most sense-there are a lot of different headwinds over the next 24-48 months that are going to affect things-Presidential election later this year, geopolitical strife that doesn't look like it will get any better anytime soon, manufacturing issues with China/overseas and start of demographic decline in several countries I would add to that, Ford will probably message differently in the 18 states aligned with California an perhaps a few other pockets where BEVs have more sales traction. Like, using a bit more push advertising in those places and less emphasis in other areas where gas sales and hybrids do better. Nothing earth shattering in that…. There’s a ton of issues in flux at the moment but in the light of an aggressive UAW campaign, building compact BEVs at Louisville has become an untenable business case, I think that Ford is getting ready to move the project to Mexico and share it more with the Hermosillo twins, much like Ford Europe is doing with its smaller BEV and hybrids being built in the Romanian plant. It can be done. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) 41 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: How TF is that supposed to work when most of them are coming to MAP for this mythical 3rd shift? I think BOC is turning to shit, there’s more than enough BEV capacity at Dearborn, Ford just doesn’t want to admit it yet. Think, massive red ink because BEV sales haven’t significantly ramped up and Ford has this big ass plant in development, so something has to give, it can’t keep pushing back the timeline and pretending that hundreds and thousands of buyers are interested in buying a Lightning now or in two or three years time….. Edited February 21 by jpd80 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texasota Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 I almost wish a certain member that was recently banned was still here. It would be fascinating to hear his take on the EV slowdown. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 34 minutes ago, Texasota said: I almost wish a certain member that was recently banned was still here. It would be fascinating unbelievably irritating to hear his take massive spin on the EV slowdown. FTFY 1 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 They need BOC and the dedicated platform to be cost competitive. And to learn how to build EVs efficiently. And there will be plenty of margin for EV trucks and offshoots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) 2 hours ago, silvrsvt said: IMO I think some of this is being read into too much. So lets look at this objectively: Here is an article from 2021 https://www.slashgear.com/ford-explorer-ev-confirmed-and-an-electric-bronco-could-be-next-26674602 So there has been some obfuscation of information- Ford was/is working on a couple different EV projects and things have changed-since that article I'm guessing Ford was planning on using the MEB platform at Oakville with the 3 row EV. With that said, the name Explorer was being attached to the 3 row EV, but only was used on the MEB EU only product. The 3 Row EV was apparently supposed to be released last year? But COVID completely screwed that up, plus I guess some of the other rumblings about its styling also might have played a role with that. So going forward: Explorer EV for the EU launches this summer-Apparently a sporty model called the Puma launches afterwards 3 row EV for Ford and Lincoln launches in 2025 at Oakville as 2026MY products? BOC opens in 2025 for the new Ford Truck EV (Lightning production ends? UAW contract says Mich EV assembly can transfer to BOC)-maybe slides to 2026? C SUV EV-Escape Replacement-apparently this was supposed to be in production around the end of the UAW contract in 2027-I'm guessing this slides to the right a few years. Might even move to Mexico depending on how Ford's relation with UAW is. Mach E update/replacement-No information AFAIK as late-maybe was supposed to be 2026? Mustang EV Coupe-rumored 2029-see that sliding right into 2030s Bronco EV-2029 Rumor-Slide into 2030s I see the Bronco/Ranger and Mustang getting a 2.3L Ecoboost hybrid option in the next 3-4 years to hold them over to they are replaced by EVs. Another IMO-I hope the government is still planning on building more charging stations if things do get delayed, because that will make more people want to buy them because of range anxiety will be reduced. See, if all of these EVs were still in development, I wouldn't be concerned. But it sounds like everything that isn't t3 or the three rows is either on hold, or they've been canceled all together. Billions of dollars wasted, gone, all for nothing. I don't want Ford to flood the market with a ton of EVs they aren't ready for. But I also don't like this direction Ford is going in of throwing up their hands and giving up. Ford does this all the time, they have good ideas, but their timing is some of the worst in the auto industry. It feels like Ford is always too early, or too late to market with an idea. They screw up the timing, and then say "There's no demand" and leave the segment. We aren't gonna see millions of EV buyers overnight, but the EV market is still growing. Ford was just getting it right, investing in dedicated EV platforms, partnering with Tesla to have a reliable charging infrastructure, reducing costs. They were starting to correct their early mistakes. Now, they're basically saying we give up, there's no demand for EVs because our heavily compromised gen 1 EVs with lots of shortcomings aren't selling, it means there's no demand. No, maybe it just means figure your shit out, and come out with performance EVs that don't cut power after five seconds, and EV trucks that can actually do truck things without falling on their face. Make EVs people want, that they can afford, and that don't have lists of glaring flaws. Edited February 21 by DeluxeStang 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 2 hours ago, jpd80 said: I think BOC is turning to shit, there’s more than enough BEV capacity at Dearborn, Ford just doesn’t want to admit it yet. Think, massive red ink because BEV sales haven’t significantly ramped up and Ford has this big ass plant in development, so something has to give, it can’t keep pushing back the timeline and pretending that hundreds and thousands of buyers are interested in buying a Lightning now or in two or three years time….. It would be a travesty of this plant wasn’t flexible enough to build a variety of products. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 4 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: How TF is that supposed to work when most of them are coming to MAP for this mythical 3rd shift? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 56 minutes ago, tbone said: It would be a travesty of this plant wasn’t flexible enough to build a variety of products. Why? Building EVs is different than building ICE assembly line wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, DeluxeStang said: See, if all of these EVs were still in development, I wouldn't be concerned. But it sounds like everything that isn't t3 or the three rows is either on hold, or they've been canceled all together. Billions of dollars wasted, gone, all for nothing. What are you taking about? Keep in mind that new products take at least four-five years to develop and bring into production-just look at the Bronco as an example. I think people don’t get that what is coming out today was more or less decided to be done before Covid came along. business plans change all the time and now I just hear the sky is falling and Ford is failing when they haven’t even come out with products that have been talked about for the past two-three years yet. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Please.....this is Ford we're talking about. This plan will be cancelled, coming out next week, pushed back to 2050, and out in 3 months by next week..... 2 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 42 minutes ago, silvrsvt said: What are you taking about? Keep in mind that new products take at least four-five years to develop and bring into production-just look at the Bronco as an example. I think people don’t get that what is coming out today was more or less decided to be done before Covid came along. business plans change all the time and now I just hear the sky is falling and Ford is failing when they haven’t even come out with products that have been talked about for the past two-three years yet. What? I'm not complaining that these EVs aren't out yet. I'm saying it sounds like many of these EV programs have been canceled, or are in a state of development hell. I'm not against a brand altering it's product plans, I'm just saying Ford keeps changing their plans, halting and resuming programs constantly, canceling things and rebooting them because they don't know what they're doing. My criticism is that's a very inefficient way of running a company and they need to get it sorted out. They need a solid 5 year plan, and the conviction to stick to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 1 hour ago, silvrsvt said: The people from the 2nd and 3rd shifts that are being cut from REVC are coming to MAP this summer at some point…. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dequindre Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 I hope that Ford invests in some significant refreshes for existing products if most new generation products are slated for the early 2030s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 2 hours ago, silvrsvt said: Why? Building EVs is different than building ICE assembly line wise. Not necessarily, Ford Europe is managing to do it with Puma hybrid and BEV along with Tornio Courier in the same Romanian plant. Makes you wonder if we’re fed a certain narrative as an excuse to do clean sheet designs when perhaps the truth is that the lines are very blurred, depending on which way the accountants push the business case…… 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dequindre Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 Stellantis is looking pretty good right now for developing a vehicle architecture that can accommodate EV, PHEV, and ICE powertrains, especially during the transitionary period in the automotive industry. GM and Ford are pretty boxed-in with their current platforms, and these constant change of products plans demonstrate that. They're not able to react to the market quickly enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 (edited) I just read this article. Terrible idea on these big price cuts and huge incentives. Higher ATPs should be the focus. https://electrek.co/2024/02/20/ford-slashes-prices-2023-mustang-mach-e-incentives-for-f-150-lightning/ Edited February 22 by 2005Explorer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 2 hours ago, silvrsvt said: Why? Building EVs is different than building ICE assembly line wise. A variety of EVs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.