Ford Q3 2024 Earnings: $900 Million In Income On $46.2 Billion In Revenue

[Sherminator98]

1 hour ago, Harley Lover said:

 Don't forget the battery plant under construction in Kentucky. Given that BOC will have its own on-premises battery production, the Kentucky batteries have to go somewhere else (presumably) and Louisville would make the most sense proximity-wise. Whether or not that leads to the conclusion that Louisville will get the skunkworks vehicle(s), I don't know.

 

I just looked at a map-the Battery plant in Kentucky is about 50 miles from LAP and roughly 300 miles from BOC

 

The other thing to consider is maybe the KY battery plant cells might be used for P/HEVs...Kentucky Truck isn't far from it either and it makes sense to go HEV or EHEV with the Super Duties. 

[akirby]

39 minutes ago, Sherminator98 said:

Kentucky Truck isn't far from it either and it makes sense to go HEV or EHEV with the Super Duties. 

Electrified super duties are being built in Oakville exclusively.

[DeluxeStang]

6 minutes ago, akirby said:

Electrified super duties are being built in Oakville exclusively.

Are they electrified? I thought they were just normal super duties and Ford was just adding another plant to increase production. That's huge news. 

[DeluxeStang]

2 hours ago, Harley Lover said:

 Don't forget the battery plant under construction in Kentucky. Given that BOC will have its own on-premises battery production, the Kentucky batteries have to go somewhere else (presumably) and Louisville would make the most sense proximity-wise. Whether or not that leads to the conclusion that Louisville will get the skunkworks vehicle(s), I don't know.

Which is what we were thinking when we thought the ICE escape was gonna exit production. But now we're hearing there's a new escape in development. It seems logical to assume it'll stay at the same plant. Meaning Louisville might not have enough untapped production capacity to make all of Ford's affordable EVs, and the ICE escape. 

[akirby]

36 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

Are they electrified? I thought they were just normal super duties and Ford was just adding another plant to increase production. That's huge news. 

Both.  Adding production capacity and also adding electrification but they gave no details on what kind of electrification.

[akirby]

38 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

Are they electrified? I thought they were just normal super duties and Ford was just adding another plant to increase production. That's huge news. 

 

Quote

The move to add production of up to 100,000 units of its best-selling Super Duty to Oakville expands Super Duty production across three plants in North America, including Kentucky Truck Plant and Ohio Assembly Plant, which are operating at full capacity. It also paves the way to bring multi-energy technology to the next generation of Super Duty trucks, giving customers more freedom of choice and supporting Ford’s electrification plans.

 

[morgan20]

51 minutes ago, akirby said:

multi-energy technology

 

What does Ford mean by this? Will next generation Super Duty have all of these?

1. Gasoline
2. E85
3. Diesel/Biodiesel
4. LPG/Propane
5. Hybrid
6. Plug in Hybrid
7. Battery electric
8. Fuel Cell electric

Edited December 12, 2024 by morgan20

[ice-capades]

1 hour ago, akirby said:

QUOTE: The move to add production of up to 100,000 units of its best-selling Super Duty to Oakville expands Super Duty production across three plants in North America, including Kentucky Truck Plant and Ohio Assembly Plant, which are operating at full capacity. It also paves the way to bring multi-energy technology to the next generation of Super Duty trucks, giving customers more freedom of choice and supporting Ford’s electrification plans.

 

It's just PR language. Most likely, with the current BEV market and Ford's constant changes in vehicle plans, it'll be years before the market sees electrification of the Super Duty lines. 

[Sherminator98]

Yeah I'd say that is just boiler plate....there are no local battery plants in Canada AFAIK to Oakville and the plans to build them for the 3 row went up in smoke with them getting canceled? 

[rmc523]

45 minutes ago, morgan20 said:

 

What does Ford mean by this? Will next generation Super Duty have all of these?

1. Gasoline
2. E85
3. Diesel/Biodiesel
4. LPG/Propane
5. Hybrid
6. Plug in Hybrid
7. Battery electric
8. Fuel Cell electric

 

I'd guess hybrid more focused on pro-power ability.

There were the rumors of an EREV version too, but who knows.

 

With how Ford's plans changed, the next Super Duty could go to a flying truck and back to the Flintstone mobile by the time it comes out.

[akirby]

14 minutes ago, Sherminator98 said:

the plans to build them for the 3 row went up in smoke with them getting canceled? 

Not dead just paused while they redesign it and figure out the path forward,  They would certainly be available if needed for Oakville.

[akirby]

28 minutes ago, ice-capades said:

 

It's just PR language. Most likely, with the current BEV market and Ford's constant changes in vehicle plans, it'll be years before the market sees electrification of the Super Duty lines. 

I think we’ll see a hybrid at the very least with pro power onboard.  I wouldn’t rule out a BEV with range extender either,

[Oac98]

1 hour ago, Sherminator98 said:

Yeah I'd say that is just boiler plate....there are no local battery plants in Canada AFAIK to Oakville and the plans to build them for the 3 row went up in smoke with them getting canceled? 

According to our union Body 2 which was gonna be the new battery plant will remain a part of Body build going forward according to the blueprints for the body shop that they seen.

[DeluxeStang]

4 hours ago, akirby said:

 

 

Impressive. I don't know why it shows a blank text box when I'm trying to quote you, but there you go lol. 

Edited December 12, 2024 by DeluxeStang

[blazerdude20]

5 hours ago, Sherminator98 said:

 

I just looked at a map-the Battery plant in Kentucky is about 50 miles from LAP and roughly 300 miles from BOC

 

The other thing to consider is maybe the KY battery plant cells might be used for P/HEVs...Kentucky Truck isn't far from it either and it makes sense to go HEV or EHEV with the Super Duties. 

This makes the most sense to me. Ford has talked about a larger push into HEV’s.  This could help bring the cost down and finally give ford the supply they need for hybrids. 
 

Wouldn’t surprise me if all future non-EV’s go hybrid only. Except for the big trucks. 

[ice-capades]

3 hours ago, akirby said:

I think we’ll see a hybrid at the very least with pro power onboard.  I wouldn’t rule out a BEV with range extender either,

 

I'll agree with you regarding the Hybrid with Pro Power Onboard but won't be surprised if it's not available for at least a year or couple of years yet. The Hybrid with Pro Power Onboard has already established itself on the F-150's and would be a logical step for the Super Duty models. As for any BEV version, I think that's still years down the road.   

Edited December 12, 2024 by ice-capades
Additional Content

[jpd80]

Isn’t it amazing how Ford and other manufacturers were given a way to work the market

with reduced production and high prices. Then greed took over and everyone went back

to over producing vehicles and just assumed that all those customers would pay high prices…

 

What does that say about the key people at the top of these corporations, are they listening

to underlings who just don’t know how markets work? Where does the deluded ideas come from?

[morgan20]

34 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

What does that say about the key people at the top of these corporations, are they listening

to underlings who just don’t know how markets work? Where does the deluded ideas come from?

 

Big shots at automakers are all narcissists, and most of them are psychopaths as well. The psychologist Robert Lindner described these kinds of people as follows:

 

...a rebel without a cause, an agitator without a slogan, a revolutionary without a program: in other words, his rebelliousness is aimed to achieve goals satisfactory to himself alone; he is incapable of exertions for the sake of others. All his efforts, hidden under no matter what disguise, represent investments designed to satisfy his immediate wishes and desires.

[Sherminator98]

3 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Isn’t it amazing how Ford and other manufacturers were given a way to work the market

with reduced production and high prices. Then greed took over and everyone went back

to over producing vehicles and just assumed that all those customers would pay high prices…

 

What does that say about the key people at the top of these corporations, are they listening

to underlings who just don’t know how markets work? Where does the deluded ideas come from?

 

Not sure if it was greed for the most part, it was inflation and interest rates going up. 

 

I'll use this as an example of Ford products for the past 10 years or so:

Parents had a '13 Escape Titanium they paid I think $32-35K. Didn't have AWD either on it, was an entry level Ti

 

My wife got a '17 Escape SE, that was better equipped then the Titanium for the most part, the biggest difference was she had AWD and only had 17 inch tires vs 19 inch tires, but she also had dual power seats where the '13 Ti model did not.  She paid $27-29K for it. 

 

The 24 Bronco Sport was 32K...no leather seats (which aren't a big deal to her-she prefers cloth because leather gets too hot in the summer for her legs) and only the 1.3L Ecoboost vs the 2L in the other Escapes I've talked about. Its slightly smaller overall, but interior space is actually better for the driver/passenger due to the redesigned dash vs the older Escape. Generally a decent deal

 

My Bronco went up nearly 10K, can't get the V6 anymore in my trim...but also the demand was crazy for it and decent amount of people had no issue paying a 10K dealership ADM on them, which makes me believe they might have been underpriced to a point (kinda like what happened with the 2013-2020 Gen Escape-they where over equipped and Ford couldn't make money on them)...as long as the demand is decent (100-120K units a year) I don't think Ford will really care. 

 

I think most buyers didn't really think about payments when interest rates where low-if it was too expensive they just stretched the terms out longer to make the monthly payments chearper, but with the rise in interest rates, that extra $50-100 or more a month gave people pause. 

[jpd80]

24 minutes ago, Sherminator98 said:

 

Not sure if it was greed for the most part, it was inflation and interest rates going up. 

 

I'll use this as an example of Ford products for the past 10 years or so:

Parents had a '13 Escape Titanium they paid I think $32-35K. Didn't have AWD either on it, was an entry level Ti

 

My wife got a '17 Escape SE, that was better equipped then the Titanium for the most part, the biggest difference was she had AWD and only had 17 inch tires vs 19 inch tires, but she also had dual power seats where the '13 Ti model did not.  She paid $27-29K for it. 

 

The 24 Bronco Sport was 32K...no leather seats (which aren't a big deal to her-she prefers cloth because leather gets too hot in the summer for her legs) and only the 1.3L Ecoboost vs the 2L in the other Escapes I've talked about. Its slightly smaller overall, but interior space is actually better for the driver/passenger due to the redesigned dash vs the older Escape. Generally a decent deal

 

My Bronco went up nearly 10K, can't get the V6 anymore in my trim...but also the demand was crazy for it and decent amount of people had no issue paying a 10K dealership ADM on them, which makes me believe they might have been underpriced to a point (kinda like what happened with the 2013-2020 Gen Escape-they where over equipped and Ford couldn't make money on them)...as long as the demand is decent (100-120K units a year) I don't think Ford will really care. 

 

I think most buyers didn't really think about payments when interest rates where low-if it was too expensive they just stretched the terms out longer to make the monthly payments chearper, but with the rise in interest rates, that extra $50-100 or more a month gave people pause. 

It’s definitely greed as most of the excess stock in dealer years are high trim levels asking big dollars.

I’m not singling out Ford either, it’s also Stellantis, GM and even Toyota and other brands too.

 

Also, many brands have eliminated base models and gone up one or two trim levels by the time

we include the price of mandatory equipment…this has been coming for at least three months

and yes, you’re right, high interest and payments are causing a lot of pain for buyers…

 

Combined new car inventory just hit over 3 million. 87 days supply average.

Pretty certain that all the fat cats will get their bonuses even when things are bad…

Edited December 15, 2024 by jpd80

[twintornados]

On 11/28/2024 at 4:43 PM, DeluxeStang said:

It has to be warranty costs. We need more c2 products. Not only are they obviously more affordable, but they seem to be above the rest of Ford's platforms in terms of quality/reliability. So developing more products on that platform would be a win-win for everyone. 

 

Or, they need to stop ignoring other platforms in the house....CD6 would be much better if only they expanded it's use. Make a SWB Explorer and call it Edge. Build a sedan top hat and call it Crown Victoria for Ford and Continental for Lincoln.

Edited December 15, 2024 by twintornados

[akirby]

I seriously doubt many retail buyers bought base models.  They’re typically fleet only and used for advertising.  Good riddance.

 

Why is maximizing profits greed?  Isn’t that the purpose of a business as opposed to a nonprofit?  If prices are indeed too high then they’ll self correct and we’ll see some price reductions next year,

[Texasota]

2 hours ago, akirby said:

 

Why is maximizing profits greed?  Isn’t that the purpose of a business as opposed to a nonprofit?  If prices are indeed too high then they’ll self correct and we’ll see some price reductions next year,

Exactly. It’s a market based system (capitalism) which is the best at providing prosperity for the majority than any other economic system.

[morgan20]

2 hours ago, akirby said:

Why is maximizing profits greed?  Isn’t that the purpose of a business as opposed to a nonprofit?  If prices are indeed too high then they’ll self correct and we’ll see some price reductions next year,

 

That psychologist Lindner explained the mindset of the big shots at automakers: he is incapable of exertions for the sake of others. That's greed

 

There are four forces to discipline these narcissistic psychopaths and rein in their greed:

• Competition: Companies that fear you will take your business elsewhere are cautious about worsening quality or raising prices
• Regulation: Companies that fear a regulator will penalize them more than they expect to make from cheating and screwing over their customers, will cheat and screw over their customers less
• Self-help: Customers, dealers, and independent shops can fix and modify existing cars, keeping them running and saying no to overpriced, shitty new cars
• Workers: Autoworkers can flex bargaining power against the big shots' deluded ideas by threatening strikes or to quit outright

 

 

[akirby]

3 hours ago, morgan20 said:

 

That psychologist Lindner explained the mindset of the big shots at automakers: he is incapable of exertions for the sake of others. That's greed

 

There are four forces to discipline these narcissistic psychopaths and rein in their greed:

• Competition: Companies that fear you will take your business elsewhere are cautious about worsening quality or raising prices
• Regulation: Companies that fear a regulator will penalize them more than they expect to make from cheating and screwing over their customers, will cheat and screw over their customers less
• Self-help: Customers, dealers, and independent shops can fix and modify existing cars, keeping them running and saying no to overpriced, shitty new cars
• Workers: Autoworkers can flex bargaining power against the big shots' deluded ideas by threatening strikes or to quit outright

How you treat workers and business partners and how you treat customers are 2 different things.  Workers and business partners are long term significant relationships.  The CEO at my old company is an asshole and just forced workers back to the office 5 days a week - for absolutely no good reason.  We proved during the pandemic that working from home was just as - if not more - productive.  2-3 days was a good compromise.  I think he wants more people to quit so he doesn’t have to lay them off and pay severance.

 

On the customer side it’s a very limited engagement and the only obligation is to deliver a vehicle that operates as advertised and to honor the factory warranty. Pricing is a free market decision.  Nobody forces a customer to buy a product.  If the price is too high they walk away.