Sherminator98 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 I found Patrick Boyle a few months ago-he normally does finance videos and has a really dry sense of humor... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 He makes many good points. One I relate to best is Stellantis price increases over last few years driving sales right off a cliff. The ProMaster van I wanted suddenly went from roughly $30k to well over $50k. I don’t care if required to subsidize BEVs, I won’t pay it on principle alone. They can keep the damn things until they lower price closer to inflation adjusted. A dollar in 2020 only requires $1.22 today. If they go out of business in mean time, so be it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pictor Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 Proof that they raised prices to pay for electrification on or is just conjecture? I think they raised process because they could when cars were scarce post covid. Then inflation reared its ugly head and that raised them again. Now the trick is getting the the genie price back in the bottle and still make money. I think the 10% margin wish may just be that for awhile, a wish. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 4 hours ago, Rick73 said: He makes many good points. One I relate to best is Stellantis price increases over last few years driving sales right off a cliff. The ProMaster van I wanted suddenly went from roughly $30k to well over $50k. I don’t care if required to subsidize BEVs, I won’t pay it on principle alone. They can keep the damn things until they lower price closer to inflation adjusted. A dollar in 2020 only requires $1.22 today. If they go out of business in mean time, so be it. PROMASTER?????????????? my god man WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY?...Ive had so many of those POS's traded in its not funny...at 80k cylinder number three is a common failure..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted January 10 Share Posted January 10 1 hour ago, Deanh said: PROMASTER?????????????? my god man WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY?...Ive had so many of those POS's traded in its not funny...at 80k cylinder number three is a common failure..... Yeah, you’re correct on ProMaster quality issues, which sadly only confirms how poor I personally find the full-size Transit that I would settle for a PM. Just don’t like Transit cab area, and can’t wait to see next generation full-size van. I prefer the old E-Series far better, though I know Transit is more modern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 10 Share Posted January 10 Nothing new lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted January 10 Author Share Posted January 10 15 hours ago, Deanh said: PROMASTER?????????????? my god man WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY?...Ive had so many of those POS's traded in its not funny...at 80k cylinder number three is a common failure..... I know amazon was using them to do deliveries in my area...then I saw the Rivian van,but I haven't seen one of those in ages either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtisH Posted January 10 Share Posted January 10 18 hours ago, Rick73 said: Yeah, you’re correct on ProMaster quality issues, which sadly only confirms how poor I personally find the full-size Transit that I would settle for a PM. Just don’t like Transit cab area, and can’t wait to see next generation full-size van. I prefer the old E-Series far better, though I know Transit is more modern. My brother just recently bought his first Transit for his company’s fleet. The only complaint he mentioned was that he didn’t like the position of the steering wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted January 11 Share Posted January 11 22 hours ago, CurtisH said: My brother just recently bought his first Transit for his company’s fleet. The only complaint he mentioned was that he didn’t like the position of the steering wheel. Interesting that I’ve read many say that about ProMaster before, but not Transit. They often describe PM as more upright like a big truck. After drivers adapted, they seem to like it OK or better. Transit position seems more like an SUV to me. In a large van an upright position like Ford E-Series seems more appropriate to my liking. This difference isn’t that important though. What I don’t like about Transit is that seats are much closer together, you sit lower, and floor isn’t flat. This makes getting up from front seats to access rear of van more difficult IMO. I suppose if owner doesn’t use van this way, it’s not an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtisH Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 5 hours ago, Rick73 said: Interesting that I’ve read many say that about ProMaster before, but not Transit. They often describe PM as more upright like a big truck. After drivers adapted, they seem to like it OK or better. Transit position seems more like an SUV to me. In a large van an upright position like Ford E-Series seems more appropriate to my liking. This difference isn’t that important though. What I don’t like about Transit is that seats are much closer together, you sit lower, and floor isn’t flat. This makes getting up from front seats to access rear of van more difficult IMO. I suppose if owner doesn’t use van this way, it’s not an issue. My brother, like me, is short. He mentioned the steering wheel being too high and upright. That may not be an issue for taller people. I haven’t sat in it, so I can’t offer an opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, CurtisH said: My brother, like me, is short. He mentioned the steering wheel being too high and upright. That may not be an issue for taller people. I haven’t sat in it, so I can’t offer an opinion. I never found the steering wheel position to be a problem in our Transits, but I’m 6’2”, and I normally have a problem with the steering wheel not going up high enough. I also greatly prefer the cabin of the Transit over the E-Series; it has much better legroom and the doghouse doesn’t intrude nearly as much. FWIW, we have one Sprinter in our fleet for development work on a particular piece of equipment, and everyone hates it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) See the issue with Transit is that Ford Europe normally resists changes to its designs. I’m hopeful that changes to Euro management now means Ford North America gets more say in regionalisation to include important local changes. Edited January 12 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomcat68 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 On 1/10/2025 at 10:15 AM, Sherminator98 said: I know amazon was using them to do deliveries in my area...then I saw the Rivian van,but I haven't seen one of those in ages either. In Massachusetts, I see Amazon using nothing else other than the Rivian now. Almost overnight, the other vans disappeared. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, atomcat68 said: In Massachusetts, I see Amazon using nothing else other than the Rivian now. Almost overnight, the other vans disappeared. Same where I live inside Houston city limits. I see Rivian quite often but cant recall the last time I saw a ProMaster or Transit van which were very common a year or more ago. Don’t know if other parts of city have same conditions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 There’s a former Chebbie dealership not far from my office that Amazon uses as a parking lot, and their local distribution center is maybe two football fields away as the crow flies in the other direction. I haven’t seen any Rivian vans, but I do see a heck of a lot of blue Transits and Sprinters, though not as many ProMasters. I’m not seeing nearly as many out of state rentals with Amazon magnets on the side as I used to, but there are still a few. They do have a bunch of blue box trucks parked in the old Chebbie dealership lot, but I couldn’t tell you their makes off the top of my head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Forgot we had many Sprinters also. Transit and PM were extended variants. IIRC Sprinters were mostly long-wheelbase non-extended (~23 feet long). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 (edited) The answer to closing the price gap between ICE and BEVs would seem to be making ICE more expensive, the complete opposite to what were told about lowered EV costs… Sadly, the deck is loaded against buyers Edited January 13 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 23 minutes ago, jpd80 said: The answer to closing the price gap between ICE and BEVs would seem to be making ICE more expensive, the complete opposite to what were told about lowered EV costs… Sadly, the deck is loaded against buyers Absurdly sad considering buyers control the deck, or should be in control. Maybe too many buyers don’t care, don’t know, or else can’t connect the dots. It’s like everyone wants a clean environment but have no clue what the real cost is. And when they find out, suddenly they don’t want to pay it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe771476 Posted Sunday at 04:49 PM Share Posted Sunday at 04:49 PM The short answer is yes, EV's are killing auto mfrs., especially Ford! Double digit losses in the billions for just Ford! I don't see VW, Stellantis, Mercedes, Toyota going full tilt into EV's! I think Farley blew it! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted 16 hours ago Share Posted 16 hours ago 20 hours ago, Joe771476 said: The short answer is yes, EV's are killing auto mfrs., especially Ford! Double digit losses in the billions for just Ford! I don't see VW, Stellantis, Mercedes, Toyota going full tilt into EV's! I think Farley blew it! EVs aren’t killing BYD and Tesla. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan20 Posted 16 hours ago Share Posted 16 hours ago 11 minutes ago, Oac98 said: EVs aren’t killing BYD and Tesla. Yea, exactly. Ford's head honcho mentioned those two companies as his biggest competitors 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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