Harley Lover Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Hey fuzzy, looks like GM (and probably Ford since the 2 companies seem to have matched offers) has addressed one of the issues to your liking: Quote GM’s offer includes annual wage increases for new employees with progression to the full wage rate within four years. Taken from the yahoo link posted above. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 7 hours ago, hllywd said: Perhaps I could've stated more clearly. And perhaps my sample size isn't large enough. But I based my comments on people around me outside of the auto industry. These people are getting reviews and raises every year and, from what I've heard, their raises have outpaced inflation every year. Seems like assumptions are being made all around. I haven't been surrounded by union workers for most if not all of my life. I hired in later in life and had "real jobs" before hiring in. I disagree with quite a bit of what I see and hear on a daily basis. I don't believe in the strike or the strike tactics. With that being said, and everyone can agree or disagree but that's besides the point... The company asked us to suspend COLA with the provision that as soon as they returned to profitability COLA would be reinstated. Companies returned to profitability by 2010 and here we are 13 years later and it still has not been reinstated. So agree or disagree, that's why the fight. I won't pretend to know how people outside the auto companies would respond but I'd like to think that if their companies promised something and then reneged on the promises that they'd be upset too. Perhaps I was a bit harsh but all workers are unhappy with their employers at some point. Mine took away 5 days of vacation a couple of years ago. I wasn’t at all happy about it, but looking at it objectively I enjoyed 33 days of vacation for the last 15+ years which is FAR more than most. So while I don’t like it, if you compare it to other companies it’s still a great deal. I also lost retiree medical coverage subsidies but again that’s the new standard in most companies because of rising health care costs, If I don’t like it I’m free to go work somewhere else. Or retire. Companies that have significantly higher labor costs than their direct competition and single digit profit margins are one price war or economic downturn away from bankruptcy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 hour ago, rmc523 said: FWIW in this discussion.... Ford and GM workers already make $20 more per hour than Tesla employees - Autoblog The labor cost gap between the Detroit 3 and Tesla is already staggering. Tesla spends about $45 an hour on labor (this cost combines hourly wages and benefits), while Ford, GM, and Stellantis are currently spending about $66 an hour on their labor, according to industry analysts. If the UAW gets its way on pay increases and things like reviving pensions, Wells Fargo has estimated that the Detroit 3's hourly labor costs could more than double to $136 an hour. I believe Toyota was in between at $55/hr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Oacjay98 said: Elon can do no wrong, eh?! So far, he seems to be teflon-coated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Oacjay98 said: So I suppose Tesla workers are never gonna want a raise and are just gonna stay at the same rate of pay?? Tesla will handle raises like every other non union company. They decide how much each job is worth based on the market in each location, then they look at where each employee is on the salary range.and how they performed the last year. Poor performers get nothing or very little. Good performers below their target salary get good raises. Good performers at or above their salary range get little or nothing. Top performers usually get something unless they’re maxed out. The company will decide whether to fund across the board increases based on inflation. They do this not because of some contract but because it’s what they have to do to keep employees. If you don’t keep up with the market rates people go elsewhere and you can’t hire enough replacements. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Harley Lover said: Hey fuzzy, looks like GM (and probably Ford since the 2 companies seem to have matched offers) has addressed one of the issues to your liking: Taken from the yahoo link posted above. Allegedly. I’m not believing anything written in the media until a deal is reached and I’m holding the highlights in my hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 22 minutes ago, akirby said: I wasn’t at all happy about it, but looking at it objectively I enjoyed 33 days of vacation for the last 15+ years which is FAR more than most. That’s almost twice what I get. 33 times the amount if you factor in that I’m not allowed to use my vacation time for any other reason than July shutdown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying68 Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 14 hours ago, rperez817 said: Here are the numbers from 2022. Nvidia, Lucid top 2022 CEO compensation survey | Automotive News (autonews.com) General Motors CEO, Mary Barra Base salary: $2.1 million Bonus and incentive plan compensation: $6,258,000 Stock option gains: $0 Stock award gains: $24,627,264 Other compensation: $1,121,560 Accumulated pension benefits: $2,160,068 Total compensation: $34,106,824 Ford CEO, Jim Farley Base salary: $1.7 million Bonus and incentive plan compensation: $2,754,000 Stock option gains: $1,869,342 Stock award gains: $10,620,588 Other compensation: $1,396,765 Accumulated pension benefits: $0 Total compensation: $18,340,695 Tesla CEO, Elon Musk Base salary: $0 Bonus and incentive plan compensation: $0 Stock option gains: $0 Stock award gains: $0 Other compensation: $0 Accumulated pension benefits: $0 Total compensation: $0 Musk is not a valid comparison. He is the largest individual shareholder at almost 13% of Tesla. He also had a long term compensation plan (that is under a lawsuit by other shareholders right now) that was worth $50 billion or more. He doesn't "take" a salary because he is basically the owner and has already been compensated for future work. Make no mistake though, Tesla has paid him a lot of money. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying68 Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Tesla enjoys significant cost advantages over the all the other manufacturers. One big component is labor rate. I don't know why the UAW hasn't aggressively pursued unionizing Tesla. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Flying68 said: Tesla enjoys significant cost advantages over the all the other manufacturers. One big component is labor rate. I don't know why the UAW hasn't aggressively pursued unionizing Tesla. they did for a while but it was kind of a half assed effort and they gave up when met with resistance from the company. It was shortly after that when the corruption scandals started. Edited September 20, 2023 by fuzzymoomoo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 46 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: That’s almost twice what I get. 33 times the amount if you factor in that I’m not allowed to use my vacation time for any other reason than July shutdown. Well, based on previous comments from him, he's probably been at the same employer longer than you've been alive... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 44 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: That’s almost twice what I get. 33 times the amount if you factor in that I’m not allowed to use my vacation time for any other reason than July shutdown. To be fair it took 20 years to get to that level but you still hate losing things you already have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 7 minutes ago, fordmantpw said: Well, based on previous comments from him, he's probably been at the same employer longer than you've been alive... Id say that’s a pretty good bet. 37 yrs in November. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 7 minutes ago, akirby said: Id say that’s a pretty good bet. 37 yrs in November. RESPECT...NOT OFTEN YOU HEAR THAT NOWDAYS...ACTUALLY SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE eMPLOYER AS WELL. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 13 minutes ago, Deanh said: RESPECT...NOT OFTEN YOU HEAR THAT NOWDAYS...ACTUALLY SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE eMPLOYER AS WELL. Wife also has 37 yrs with the same company. Hasn’t all been a bed of roses but all things considered we have nothing to complain about. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 29 minutes ago, akirby said: To be fair it took 20 years to get to that level but you still hate losing things you already have. I should have more than 40 hours paid leave per year I can use whenever I want to after 10 years. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 31 minutes ago, akirby said: Id say that’s a pretty good bet. 37 yrs in November. Got me by 3 years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 hour ago, akirby said: Tesla will handle raises like every other non union company. They decide how much each job is worth based on the market in each location, then they look at where each employee is on the salary range.and how they performed the last year. Poor performers get nothing or very little. Good performers below their target salary get good raises. Good performers at or above their salary range get little or nothing. Top performers usually get something unless they’re maxed out. The company will decide whether to fund across the board increases based on inflation. They do this not because of some contract but because it’s what they have to do to keep employees. If you don’t keep up with the market rates people go elsewhere and you can’t hire enough replacements. Lol and the turnover will be high Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 16 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said: Lol and the turnover will be high No it won’t because that’s how it works everywhere in the real (non union) world. High turnover usually implies poor working conditions and/or poor management. Good companies value good employees and compensate them accordingly so they don’t leave. Bad employees stay with lower pay because they aren’t able to find a better job elsewhere. Sometimes your best employees get a better offer they can’t refuse so they leave and sometimes the worst employees are let go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 42 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: Got me by 3 years started here at Dealership in 1986....lol... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 58 minutes ago, akirby said: No it won’t because that’s how it works everywhere in the real (non union) world. High turnover usually implies poor working conditions and/or poor management. Good companies value good employees and compensate them accordingly so they don’t leave. Bad employees stay with lower pay because they aren’t able to find a better job elsewhere. Sometimes your best employees get a better offer they can’t refuse so they leave and sometimes the worst employees are let go. There is higher turn over in here amongst in progression workers. This is a fact. Lower pay can also be a factor in higher turnover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 (edited) 20 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: My arm injury happened installing windows. Show me an autoworker who doesn’t have carpal tunnel from squeezing a trigger on a nut runner 400+ times a shift 5 days a week for years on end and I’ll show you some nice oceanfront property in Kansas. What we do isn’t easy, it only looks like it because we’ve all done it for so long. Man you shouldn’t even have to explain yourself to the people who think we do fuck all. Let em think what they want to think. We know different! Edited September 20, 2023 by Oacjay98 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 27 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said: There is higher turn over in here amongst in progression workers. This is a fact. Lower pay can also be a factor in higher turnover. But if the pay was too low why would they ever hire on to begin with? If you’re saying they hire on then find out the work is too hard for them then I can see that. But if that happens a lot they normally increase starting pay to get more to stay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captainp4 Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 As I understand it, Tesla employees get stock in the company as part of their compensation. I'd take that over anything a union can offer. Not that I'd want to be paid in stocks as a F employee, but TSLA is a pretty good one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 hour ago, akirby said: But if the pay was too low why would they ever hire on to begin with? If you’re saying they hire on then find out the work is too hard for them then I can see that. But if that happens a lot they normally increase starting pay to get more to stay. Work is tougher than people think I guess. I wouldn’t be here if I wasnt here so long I can tell you that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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