FORD MUSTANG V8 WILL PAY DIVIDENDS NOW THAT RIVALS ARE GONE

[Broncofan7]

Ford Mustang V8 Will Pay Dividends Now That Rivals Are Gone (fordauthority.com)

 

While the headline is definitely interesting, I would also draw attention to the part about growing and the future of Mustang. I am unsure of where it would fit in the Mustang lineup, but I would love a mid-engine (engine behind the driver) version. Not counting the financials or logistics of such a thing, of course. Perhaps above the inevitable GT500/GT500 replacement and below the GTD?

[DeluxeStang]

2 hours ago, Broncofan7 said:

Ford Mustang V8 Will Pay Dividends Now That Rivals Are Gone (fordauthority.com)

 

While the headline is definitely interesting, I would also draw attention to the part about growing and the future of Mustang. I am unsure of where it would fit in the Mustang lineup, but I would love a mid-engine (engine behind the driver) version. Not counting the financials or logistics of such a thing, of course. Perhaps above the inevitable GT500/GT500 replacement and below the GTD?

Fingers crossed they discuss this in greater detail at the April 17th event. There was apparently a vid where a Ford employee was saying Ford had some surprises in store for it. I don't know if that means the 60th anniversary special will be more substantial than just stickers, or if they'll be showing something else entirely alongside it. 

 

A mid-engine mustang would be wild, but I don't know how it would slot in now that the GTD is essentially the mustang supercar many of us wanted. There were those rumors of Ford showing a mid-engine mustang to dealers, who claimed it was mid engine, and not s650 based. Some believe they were shown the GTD, and just got the details wrong. While I understand people can get details wrong, I don't really understand how someone can look at a GTD, which while awesome, is very clearly s650 based, and very clearly front engined, and come away thinking it was a mid-engine car on it's own platform.

[Rick73]

Ford Authority also reports that 2/3 of Mustang have V8.  That’s surprisingly high to me, though great to see.

[akirby]

16 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

I don't really understand how someone can look at a GTD, which while awesome, is very clearly s650 based, and very clearly front engined, and come away thinking it was a mid-engine car on it's own platform.

Because people are stupid?

[DeluxeStang]

2 minutes ago, akirby said:

Because people are stupid?

Perhaps, but people who work with Ford's all day can't tell the difference between a mustang that still looks like an s650 vs a ground up mid-engine exotic when it's right in front of them? Yet my 60 yr. old mother who knows little about cars can spot the difference between a c8 Corvette and a Ferrari from down the street. 

[rmc523]

31 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

Perhaps, but people who work with Ford's all day can't tell the difference between a mustang that still looks like an s650 vs a ground up mid-engine exotic when it's right in front of them? Yet my 60 yr. old mother who knows little about cars can spot the difference between a c8 Corvette and a Ferrari from down the street. 

 

You'd be surprised....

[Rick73]

1 hour ago, DeluxeStang said:

I don't really understand how someone can look at a GTD, which while awesome, is very clearly s650 based, and very clearly front engined, and come away thinking it was a mid-engine car on it's own platform.

Maybe it’s just semantics?  I forget which was the first modern front-engined sports car that was called “mid-engine” because the entire engine sat behind the front axle centerline.  Most people think mid-engine is when it sits behind driver and ahead of rear axle centerline, but that doesn’t appear to be accurate.  Is it possible this new GTD had engine moved back enough to fall behind front axle centerline?  Ford video shows they went to extremes to shift weight back, including a new transaxle, so who knows what else they moved?

[DeluxeStang]

32 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

 

You'd be surprised....

True, there are a lot of dumb people. Anyways, back to the topic of the mustang, and how they could expand on it, I'd love to see an AWD hybrid. That would be perfect for people who wanted something slightly more fuel efficient, while being fast as hell, with the added benefit of being better suited for slippery conditions. Maybe give it a slight lift kit to make it more practical and call it a raptor or something. 

 

What are some additions to the s650 lineup that you guys would want to see? 

[tbone]

8 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

True, there are a lot of dumb people. Anyways, back to the topic of the mustang, and how they could expand on it, I'd love to see an AWD hybrid. That would be perfect for people who wanted something slightly more fuel efficient, while being fast as hell, with the added benefit of being better suited for slippery conditions. Maybe give it a slight lift kit to make it more practical and call it a raptor or something. 

 

What are some additions to the s650 lineup that you guys would want to see? 

I think a hybrid and AWD options would really broaden the appeal of the Mustang, particularly AWD.  I think there is a fair amount of apprehension in the cold belt for purchasing a rear wheel drive vehicle for a primary vehicle.  
 

I would really like to see a mid-engine mustang variant that competes with the C8.  Something that is in the same price range as the C8, so an average person may be able to afford it. 

[Andrew L]

The ship has clearly sailed on this but I still think it would have made sense to give Lincoln something based on the S650 to help pay for the platform it could have gotten EcoBoost motors too, to keep it separate from the Mustang.  We never got the 3.5 EB in the Mustang because it would have stepped on the GTs toes but in a Lincoln I feel it could have worked.  But like I said ship has probably sailed on that.

[ice-capades]

35 minutes ago, tbone said:

I think a hybrid and AWD options would really broaden the appeal of the Mustang, particularly AWD.  I think there is a fair amount of apprehension in the cold belt for purchasing a rear wheel drive vehicle for a primary vehicle.  
 

I would really like to see a mid-engine mustang variant that competes with the C8.  Something that is in the same price range as the C8, so an average person may be able to afford it. 

 

For those that live in the 'Snow Belt" a Mustang is most often a vehicle that is stored for the winter due to the problem for many of dealing with winter driving conditions. As such, those customers skew to an older demographic and/or those that can afford to buy a Mustang and store it for a good part of the year. I drove a Mustang as my company car for many years, and although I could take a different (4WD/AWD) vehicle when conditions were bad, I drove the Mustang 99% of the time. From my experience, I found that it was more about knowing how to drive it in winter conditions. I wondered for years why Ford didn't develop a 4WD or AWD Mustang, but Ford product development is rarely innovative and primarily reactionary. Now with the eventual transition to a BEV Mustang in the next decade it'll be a lot easier for Ford to offer an 4WD/AWD Mustang.

 

I doubt that there's much reason for Ford to develop a mid-engine Mustang with the necessary transition to a BEV model at some point. And I see even less need or desire to produce a Mustang in the price range of the C8 Corvette which is substantially more expensive than the average Mustang. That would only price the Mustang out of the market for the "average" Mustang customer. Ford and the other OEMs are making decisions, pricing and otherwise, that are pricing their vehicles out of the mainstream market and forcing a sizeable part of the market to buy used vehicles which will have a big impact in future years.   

[DeluxeStang]

51 minutes ago, tbone said:

I think a hybrid and AWD options would really broaden the appeal of the Mustang, particularly AWD.  I think there is a fair amount of apprehension in the cold belt for purchasing a rear wheel drive vehicle for a primary vehicle.  
 

I would really like to see a mid-engine mustang variant that competes with the C8.  Something that is in the same price range as the C8, so an average person may be able to afford it. 

Yeah, I believe it was ExplorerDude who mentioned how the mustang "raptor" was at the very least being developed in a design studio, with a shooting brake body style being considered. If they go that route, an AWD performance hatchback, I would love to see some inspiration pulled from the 90s escort RS cosworth, or something like that. 

 

13 minutes ago, Andrew L said:

The ship has clearly sailed on this but I still think it would have made sense to give Lincoln something based on the S650 to help pay for the platform it could have gotten EcoBoost motors too, to keep it separate from the Mustang.  We never got the 3.5 EB in the Mustang because it would have stepped on the GTs toes but in a Lincoln I feel it could have worked.  But like I said ship has probably sailed on that.

There is something planned for flat rock besides the existing mustang, so who knows. Fuzzy sort of teased it by saying if it happened, it would make a few people on this site happy. All he said is it wasn't a mustang sedan. So who knows. 

 

Doing a Lincoln mustang would give Lincoln a shot in the arm, and would let them sell something at a premium price, while being fairly straightforward to develop. I'd love to see a Lincoln sports coupe, an Americanized Aston Martin in a sense, but it doesn't seem to align with Lincolns current strategy. 

[Andrew L]

7 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

Yeah, I believe it was ExplorerDude who mentioned how the mustang "raptor" was at the very least being developed in a design studio, with a shooting brake body style being considered. If they go that route, an AWD performance hatchback, I would love to see some inspiration pulled from the 90s escort RS cosworth, or something like that. 

 

There is something planned for flat rock besides the existing mustang, so who knows. Fuzzy sort of teased it by saying if it happened, it would make a few people on this site happy. All he said is it wasn't a mustang sedan. So who knows. 

 

Doing a Lincoln mustang would give Lincoln a shot in the arm, and would let them sell something at a premium price, while being fairly straightforward to develop. I'd love to see a Lincoln sports coupe, an Americanized Aston Martin in a sense, but it doesn't seem to align with Lincolns current strategy. 

 

It doesn't need to be a raw powerhouse pony car but something comfortable with effortless power a sort of Grand Touring Coupe would work for their current theme IMO.

[silvrsvt]

4 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

Doing a Lincoln mustang would give Lincoln a shot in the arm, and would let them sell something at a premium price, while being fairly straightforward to develop. I'd love to see a Lincoln sports coupe, an Americanized Aston Martin in a sense, but it doesn't seem to align with Lincolns current strategy. 

 

Yeah they'd be lucky to sell 500 of them a year too. A Mustang style car isn't on the radar of a luxury car buyer, esp. Lincolns demographics. This isn't the 1980s anymore. 

The Caddy XLR (built on the corvette platform) sold a whopping 13K units over 8 YEARS. 

[SoonerLS]

18 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

Yeah they'd be lucky to sell 500 of them a year too. A Mustang style car isn't on the radar of a luxury car buyer, esp. Lincolns demographics.

Based on the number of "M" BMWs is see, and how few of them are coupes, or even conventional sedans, I'd guess that the luxury/performance coupe is going to be a vanishingly small market. And that's a shame.

[silvrsvt]

52 minutes ago, SoonerLS said:

Based on the number of "M" BMWs is see, and how few of them are coupes, or even conventional sedans, I'd guess that the luxury/performance coupe is going to be a vanishingly small market. And that's a shame.

 

I just think its gotten to the point with vehicle performance that it doesn't quite matter anymore. An Escape with the 2L Ecoboost or even an Equinox (drove my mother in laws this weekend) have a perfectly acceptable performance level to drive every day. This isn't the 1980s were it took cars minutes to drive the quarter mile lol. My Bronco has plenty of power and I don't miss the tuned 3.5L ecoboost I had my SHO the vast majority of the time.   

[DeluxeStang]

4 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

 

I just think its gotten to the point with vehicle performance that it doesn't quite matter anymore. An Escape with the 2L Ecoboost or even an Equinox (drove my mother in laws this weekend) have a perfectly acceptable performance level to drive every day. This isn't the 1980s were it took cars minutes to drive the quarter mile lol. My Bronco has plenty of power and I don't miss the tuned 3.5L ecoboost I had my SHO the vast majority of the time.   

I think you're onto something. The days of performance cars being marketed on their numbers alone are coming to an end. We're seeing sub 2 second 0-60 times and 2,000 hp with 1,500 lb ft of down force in the most exotic of performance vehicles. There simply isn't much further we can climb. So what do you do?

 

You pivot to focus on the experience, on driver engagement, making a car that makes you feel special every time you drive it. This is where Ford has the potential to do something really special. As they're talking about expanding the mustang lineup, I could see a future where an EV, and a V8 mustang co-exist. The EV mustang gets to be the wild, balls to the wall 1,000 hp coupe taking mustang performance to new heights for people who want it, and the V8 gets to be the slower, but more viseral driving experience for traditionalists. It doesn't have to be just one or the other, Ford's finally getting that thankfully. 

[GearheadGrrrl]

Good points, the 4 cylinder Ecoboost Mustang will turn 13 second quarter miles, so only the most "power hungry" really need the V8. The Ecoboost is a much better balanced Mustang with decent MPG, Costco class cargo capacity with the back seat folded down, and it's even rated for trailering. Add hybrid power with AWD and it'd keep Flat Rock plant busy for years!

[Rick73]

9 minutes ago, GearheadGrrrl said:

Good points, the 4 cylinder Ecoboost Mustang will turn 13 second quarter miles, so only the most "power hungry" really need the V8. The Ecoboost is a much better balanced Mustang with decent MPG, Costco class cargo capacity with the back seat folded down, and it's even rated for trailering. Add hybrid power with AWD and it'd keep Flat Rock plant busy for years!

Completely agree, but if the 4-cylinder EcoBoost is so fast and more practical, then it begs the question why are most buyers choosing the V8?  Are they choosing V8 or avoiding 4-cylinder?

 

Both Mustangs I’ve owned had V8s, so I may be a little biased. 😆 

[spudz64]

3 hours ago, Rick73 said:

Completely agree, but if the 4-cylinder EcoBoost is so fast and more practical, then it begs the question why are most buyers choosing the V8?  Are they choosing V8 or avoiding 4-cylinder?

 

Both Mustangs I’ve owned had V8s, so I may be a little biased. 😆 

The Mustang V8 is so iconic….the sound, and lure of the rumble of it all! As great as the Ecoboost is, I’d always feel that I would miss the V8 experience if I chose that over the V8. When driving my 2019 Bullitt, I just love the sounds and experience of it all. I often think how many other vehicles amongst me in traffic can probably out gun me, esp electric, and esp with the fast shifting automatics these days. But I’m not in it for the “win” at lights or on the road, I’m just loving the experience I’m having in the moment, with the amazing (still stock) exhaust sounds the Bullitt offers, the rowing of gears, the footwork, the presence it requires. 

Edited April 2 by spudz64
Shortened

[twintornados]

3 hours ago, Rick73 said:

...Both Mustangs I’ve owned had V8s, so I may be a little biased. 😆 

 

I had a 4 cyl Foxbody that I sold before I put in on the road, and then bought V6 Foxbody that I swapped in a proper 302 V8....gotta have a V8, but if I was buying it for a daily...I would consider the EB

[atomcat68]

5 hours ago, SoonerLS said:

Based on the number of "M" BMWs is see, and how few of them are coupes, or even conventional sedans, I'd guess that the luxury/performance coupe is going to be a vanishingly small market. And that's a shame.

It seems this is correct. I think the closest Lincoln could get to that would be to make a CUV coupe type thing like the BMW X6 out of the Aviator platform.

[brucelinc]

AWD is not all about driving in the snowbelt.   In the case of the Mustang, it is also about putting power down for acceleration.   Many of those who park their Mustangs for the winter do so to protect it from salt, slush and grime....not because of traction.    After owning and drag racing several different Mustangs, I think AWD would be very attractive for both traction and safety.    It is pretty easy for a 480 HP or more RWD vehicle to become very squirrelly especially in the hands of an inexperienced driver.        It is no accident that the upcoming Dodge Chargers will be AWD.    Same could be said for high performance Porsches, BMWs, Audis, etc.   Of course, mid-engine would also solve the traction problem, as in the Corvette, but it seems to me that AWD would make more sense.

 

 

[rmc523]

22 hours ago, Rick73 said:

Completely agree, but if the 4-cylinder EcoBoost is so fast and more practical, then it begs the question why are most buyers choosing the V8?  Are they choosing V8 or avoiding 4-cylinder?

 

Both Mustangs I’ve owned had V8s, so I may be a little biased. 😆 

 

When I had my Mustang, I didn't even consider the 4-cylinder.  I wouldn't have considered a 6-cylinder either.  It was V8 or I wasn't getting one.

[brucelinc]

35 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

 

When I had my Mustang, I didn't even consider the 4-cylinder.  I wouldn't have considered a 6-cylinder either.  It was V8 or I wasn't getting one.

 Yeah, I wouldn't take  a 4 cylinder Mustang if they were giving them away.  I am surprised the take rate is a high as it is.   They are the subject of ridicule in my area.