Is Ford Dropping the Taurus?

[Kris Kolman]

Lets just ignore the article that started this thread... Another case of auto writer BS

 

I makes sense for the Taurus to move to the same platform as the Fusion if one ignores the potential problems with the PI being abandoned on the vine. As we've said the PI has been warmly embraced by law enforcement and I'm sure they are going to highly resistance to change. Police agencies when making the change have made a big investment in support equipment and training of which most would need to be changed again with another platform change. Maybe this is easily solved by a combination of maintaining the Explorer and somekind of Lincoln livery car. But considering the high number of PIs sold and the importance Ford places in the law enforcement market changes to the Taurus are more difficult than most.

 

Outside of the PI production issure I agree there is room for a Taurus type full-size car based on the Fusion platform. There have been quite a few comments from auto writers that rear seat head room is tight in both the Fusion and MKZ due to a sacrifice for styling. I would also expect the Edge when it arrives to be widened ~2 inches to better match the current vehicle and get separation from the Escape which itself was widened 1 inch from the Focus. So a more conservative, upright styling to address the rear seat head room in combination with an increase in width would increased the rear seat comfort greatly. All that is missing is the 3.5L Ecoboost SHO and some additional truck volume and I think said vehicle would be drop in replacement for the Taurus (smaller size compensated by more ideal packaging). As said this type of vehicle would likely have a good reception and export potential in China filling a whole in Ford's lineup... Maybe Oceania as well as the Falcon is retired.

[atomcat68]

I don't believe the article either. I'm going to call shennan-shennannig- shennnanna... bullshit!

[92merc]

I also don't believe the article. Mullaly fought too hard to get the name back.

 

I also believe Ford will keep the PI just because it is a good mate to the PU. I think there will be enough economies of scale to keep that association going.

 

But there are a few other possibilites. It's been suggested that the next Falcon will be global car. It's possible the D4 car will be remade/updated and called a Falcon for global use. It could be FWD/AWD still and share the platform with the PI and PU.

 

The "new" Taurus will be a stretched CD4 and share with the Fusion.

 

I see a lot of options, depending how it's approached. But the Taurus disappearing again isn't one of them.

[jpd80]

What if Explorer also goes to CD4....

[ausrutherford]

What if Explorer also goes to CD4....

 

Not a question of "if"...

[jpd80]

Not a question of "if"...

Unannounced but you can bet it will be an extension of CD4 Edge with SUV roof and back.

S-Max Morphs into Edge, Galaxy morphs into Explorer..

 

My response was to Kris above mentioning PI investment and PDs requiring more retraining,

I doubt that because the vehicles would still be FWD/AWD similar characteristics as today's

pair but with increased fuel economy.

Edited March 24, 2013 by jpd80

[BORG]

Why would Ford retain production of the old PIs should new cars replace the civilian vehicles? We're talking about very low volume in an uncertain market with emerging competition, it's not something you can orphan sustainably.

 

BTW I was driving through Michigan yesterday (finally saw a 2013 MKZ on the road btw) and saw a car hauler loaded with PIs and UIs unloading at Signature Ford in Perry (yes, boonies). Somebody was test driving one of them when I drove by, which was mildly alarming since I wasn't going the speed limit I'm starting to see them now throughout Michigan and Detroit, most of them UIs.

Edited March 25, 2013 by BORG

[twintornados]

BTW I was driving through Michigan yesterday (finally saw a 2013 MKZ on the road btw) and saw a car hauler loaded with PIs and UIs unloading at Signature Ford in Perry (yes, boonies). Somebody was test driving one of them when I drove by, which was mildly alarming since I wasn't going the speed limit I'm starting to see them now throughout Michigan and Detroit, most of them UIs.

PIs and UIs are showing up all over in Central NY.....I will consider the PI/UI take over complete when I see the NYS Police cruising in them...haven't seen one yet....

[FordBuyer]

Speaking of large car segment, here is an intereting tidbit with debut of new large car LaCrosse:

 

"The large sedan will hit dealer showrooms this summer. The new version will be sold in China later this year.

U.S. LaCrosse sales have been on the slide, dropping 2.4 percent last year from 2011 and are down 21.9 percent through February compared to the first two months of 2012.

"The large car segment that the Lacrosse is in is a tough one," said Michelle Krebs, a senior analyst for the car shopping website Edmunds.com. "We don't see a lot of growth in that segment."

In February, the large car segment captured just 3.9 percent of the U.S. new car sales market. That compares with an 18 percent market share for the midsize segment last month, according to Edmunds.com."

 

I sure hope Ford not only keeps the Taurus, but invests in a new one, but given Ford's M.O., I don't see how Ford keeps investing into a dying segment when Ford has abandoned every other dying segment except for muscle car sport coupes. When Ford talks about "supersegments," it means to me that Ford is going to give 100% of its attention and development dollars to high volume, growing segments only. Good plan of course, but there are niches out there that make auto companies unique like Ford with Mustang and can be profitable if done right. Subaru, for example, can't compete with the big boys, but finds its niches and is fastest growing auto company out there, even during the Great Recession.

[transitman]

Since the first Shaq commercial, I've thought that it was a bad move to show him in the driver's seat. For people who can't connect that he's a 7' tall man, all they see is a guy in a car with his knees nearly up to his chest and the thought that there's no driver leg room in that car... let's check out a Taurus.

[NickF1011]

Since the first Shaq commercial, I've thought that it was a bad move to show him in the driver's seat. For people who can't connect that he's a 7' tall man, all they see is a guy in a car with his knees nearly up to his chest and the thought that there's no driver leg room in that car... let's check out a Taurus.

In general I think the spokespeople Buick has been using are the wrong ones for the brand. I guess they are trying to make them appeal to a younger audience by using sports stars, but I don't think they went about it the right way. As you mentioned with Shaq, he just looks completely awkward behind the wheel. The Peyton Manning one makes him appear completely aloof with his silly "play calling" to the stereo.

[fordmantpw]

Since the first Shaq commercial, I've thought that it was a bad move to show him in the driver's seat. For people who can't connect that he's a 7' tall man, all they see is a guy in a car with his knees nearly up to his chest and the thought that there's no driver leg room in that car... let's check out a Taurus.

 

I thought the same thing when I saw it. I mentioned to my wife that Shaq would probably have the perfect driving position in a Flex. If the driver seat were removed and he was sitting in the middle row!

[NickF1011]

I thought the same thing when I saw it. I mentioned to my wife that Shaq would probably have the perfect driving position in a Flex. If the driver seat were removed and he was sitting in the middle row!

[Fgts]

Was reading the thread on the link and one supposed inside guy mentioned that the chance of a rwd Taurus is more then 50% due to Fusion already having full-size room, Lincoln was reportely begging for a rwd sedan and the Aussie problem with replacing the Falcon.

 

It must have some merritt since the Taurus and MKS is moving to Flat Rock.

[RichardJensen]

Yes, and Ford will not be assembling any FWD cars at Flat Rock.

[silvrsvt]

Yes, and Ford will not be assembling any FWD cars at Flat Rock.

 

Just like Mazda did huh?

[BORG]

The Large car segment is now smaller than the minivan, and shrinking faster. However, it may be more cost effective to produce a larger sedan than a minivan so that's why we still see so many great new ones.

 

The funny thing is that I really like the Taurus, but I would probably never buy one over an Edge or Explorer. If I wanted a sedan instead of a crossover I would care about fuel efficiency, cost, and perhaps driving dynamics. Since the Taurus doesn't offer much of a cost or functional advantage beyond performance, I'm not sure why I would ever consider it and I think most people have reached that conclusion. They'd rather buy an Edge or Fusion if they are looking at a Taurus.

Edited March 25, 2013 by BORG

[NickF1011]

The Large car segment is now smaller than the minivan, and shrinking faster. However, it may be more cost effective to produce a larger sedan than a minivan so that's why we still see so many great new ones.

Very likely the case. There are a lot of unique platform requirements for a minivan.

The funny thing is that I really like the Taurus, but I would probably never buy one over an Edge or Explorer. If I wanted a sedan instead of a crossover I would care about fuel efficiency, cost, and perhaps driving dynamics. Since the Taurus doesn't offer much of a cost or functional advantage beyond performance, I'm not sure why I would ever consider it and I think most people have reached that conclusion. They'd rather buy an Edge or Fusion if they are looking at a Taurus.

Pretty much the reason I chose the Edge. Taurus was originally on my radar a few years ago...

[FordBuyer]

The Large car segment is now smaller than the minivan, and shrinking faster. However, it may be more cost effective to produce a larger sedan than a minivan so that's why we still see so many great new ones.

 

The funny thing is that I really like the Taurus, but I would probably never buy one over an Edge or Explorer. If I wanted a sedan instead of a crossover I would care about fuel efficiency, cost, and perhaps driving dynamics. Since the Taurus doesn't offer much of a cost or functional advantage beyond performance, I'm not sure why I would ever consider it and I think most people have reached that conclusion. They'd rather buy an Edge or Fusion if they are looking at a Taurus.

 

At the NAIAS, a couple guys around the Taurus said "Why should I buy this over a Fusion?" My only comments to them was for the V6 and a bit larger trunk plus different styling. Really no other reasons and of course you will pay more for a Taurus. Anothe possible reason I suppose would be extra weight for Taurus and maybe safer in crash. Anyway, the Fusion last month outsold the Taurus about 6 to 1 ratio. Unless next Taurus goes to RWD platform, it looks to me like it would be hard case for Taurus group to get green light for new Taurus and big marketing push on FWD sedan selling about 15% of what Fusion sells on monthly basis. And both the Focus and Fusion getting a little bigger on every redesign. My 2002 Taurus is lighter than 2013 Fusion Titanium. The more you look at it, the harder it becomes to make a case for new FWD Taurus. Lincoln needs a RWD flagship, and Ford doesn't need another FWD sedan that is not much bigger than top selling Fusion. In fact, I would vote for new RWD Thunderbird, axe the Taurus, and share platform with Lincoln flagship sedan.

[Deanh]

The Large car segment is now smaller than the minivan, and shrinking faster. However, it may be more cost effective to produce a larger sedan than a minivan so that's why we still see so many great new ones.

 

The funny thing is that I really like the Taurus, but I would probably never buy one over an Edge or Explorer. If I wanted a sedan instead of a crossover I would care about fuel efficiency, cost, and perhaps driving dynamics. Since the Taurus doesn't offer much of a cost or functional advantage beyond performance, I'm not sure why I would ever consider it and I think most people have reached that conclusion. They'd rather buy an Edge or Fusion if they are looking at a Taurus.

tell that to all the owners of large Audis Mercedes and BMWs I see all over the place....if the product was desirable enough they could be more of a player....

[92LX302]

That should be Lincoln's market.

[NickF1011]

At the NAIAS, a couple guys around the Taurus said "Why should I buy this over a Fusion?" My only comments to them was for the V6 and a bit larger trunk plus different styling. Really no other reasons and of course you will pay more for a Taurus. Anothe possible reason I suppose would be extra weight for Taurus and maybe safer in crash. Anyway, the Fusion last month outsold the Taurus about 6 to 1 ratio. Unless next Taurus goes to RWD platform, it looks to me like it would be hard case for Taurus group to get green light for new Taurus and big marketing push on FWD sedan selling about 15% of what Fusion sells on monthly basis. And both the Focus and Fusion getting a little bigger on every redesign. My 2002 Taurus is lighter than 2013 Fusion Titanium. The more you look at it, the harder it becomes to make a case for new FWD Taurus. Lincoln needs a RWD flagship, and Ford doesn't need another FWD sedan that is not much bigger than top selling Fusion. In fact, I would vote for new RWD Thunderbird, axe the Taurus, and share platform with Lincoln flagship sedan.

Geez. Taurus+PI are likely pulling in plenty of profit at their lower 4000-6000/month clip just fine. It's not like every vehicle needs to sell 20,000 units a month to be profitable. If it did, brands like Subaru and Mazda would have gone out of business decades ago.

[BORG]

tell that to all the owners of large Audis Mercedes and BMWs I see all over the place....if the product was desirable enough they could be more of a player....

Sales of the large car segment are in decline, even in the growing luxury car market. Lincoln has said they are not interested in a flagship sedan like the S-Class. Even Caddy isn't giving that segment high priority, and they have substantially more resources to pull it off. The problem with the MKZ however is that it's a smallish and cramped sedan compared to the competition, without a large sedan Lincoln would be handicapped so I don't know how Lincoln is going to pull this off without a Taurus around. There is no reason to believe Lincoln can fund or afford a dedicated large car platform unless they are looking to Caddy for inspiration with the truly phenomenal Alpha architecture. But Ford and Lincoln do not have expertise in this area and are probably trying to avoid it like the plague.

Edited March 25, 2013 by BORG

[NickF1011]

There is no reason Lincoln couldn't get away with one sedan for both MKZ and MKS, but it's not the current MKZ.

There's no reason they should really want to. You can spread the price range further with two uniquely styled and sized vehicles. The one lacking the ability to spread the potential customer base right now is clearly the MKS, not the MKZ.

[lfeg]

tell that to all the owners of large Audis Mercedes and BMWs I see all over the place....if the product was desirable enough they could be more of a player....

 

Problem is that any Ford product would not have the perception of exclusivity. Or plain old snob appeal. The only way that I see a Ford large sedan here in the future is if one would be developed primarily for the Chinese market (in Ford or Lincoln guise) and sales there could support it. The market for large sedans is growing there. That is one of the big reasons that we have the Buick Lacrosse - sales here added to sales in China are decent.