silvrsvt Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 I was talking about interior packaging. Theres a whole lot of what not to do in the current Explorer. You mean the Escape? The 2013 Escape was terrible-the shifter was mounted on the lower dash, killing leg space-the 2017 helped fix that. Still needs more help packaging wise since the older Escape had better space in it then the current model Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 (edited) I know I do! My boss and I got a Buick Rendevous stuck at an abandoned construction site next to our hotel. Luckily, a guy in Jeep in the hotel parking lot who was watching the whole thing had tow straps. Never....repeat...NEVER buy a rental car. I'd buy a rental car before I would buy a lease turn in. At least I know the oil has been changed. maintenance done and it cleaned out and washed regularly. Most of the people I know may get the oil changed once in their leases if at all, dont wash them, don't rotate the tires and basically don't do anything that is going to cost them any money. "Its a lease who cares". Edited August 2, 2018 by jasonj80 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
630land Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 (edited) Need a new Escape, yesterday. The Chevy/GMC same size Utes make the Escape look like a '74 Pinto station wagon. JK Edited August 2, 2018 by 630land Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 odd, all these complaints about the Escape and we sold out of ALL our SE's last month....cars pretty sharp looking with the Sports Appearance pack..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomcat68 Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 odd, all these complaints about the Escape and we sold out of ALL our SE's last month....cars pretty sharp looking with the Sports Appearance pack..... Looks like you'll have some to sell this month: "Escape July this year: 20,630 vs July last year: 27,716 -25.6" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 I hope so....at least fords programs on the car are competitive.....programs aside, I like the car, all these complaints about packaging, doesn't bug me in the slightest...my only complaint is the restrictions with the powertrains...2.0 only avail in Titaniums! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Why are Ford, GM, and FCA losing ground in the crossover vehicle market? Because those companies' crossovers are often being surpassed by competitors in performance, safety, and value to the customer. Examples. Car and Driver 2018 Editors' Choice Subcompact crossovers, 6 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Compact crossovers, 10 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 1 Midsize crossovers, 11 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 5 2018 IIHS Top Safety Pick and Top Safety Pick Plus Small crossovers, 9 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Midsize crossovers, 7 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Midsize luxury crossovers, 9 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 1 Winners from FCA, 0 2018 Consumer Reports Top Picks 3 total winners in crossover categories. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 2018 Edmunds Buyers Most Wanted Awards 4 total winners in crossover categories. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 KBB Best Buy Awards of 2018 3 total winners in crossover categories. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 2018 New York Daily News Auto Awards 5 total winners in crossover categories. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 2018 AutoWeb Buyers Choice Awards 3 total winners in crossover categories. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 2018 Women's Choice Awards for cars Best for Family Crossover, 5 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Best for Reliability Crossover, 5 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 1 Winners from FCA, 0 Best for Safety Crossover, 6 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 1 Best for Eco Friendly Crossover, 3 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Focus skipped the much needed mid cycle powertrain update. The list goes on. . I am replying to this part as I was in our local Ford store last week when the better half bought her new 2018 Escape SE. There was a 2018 Focus sitting on the show room floor with a 1.0L EB motor and a 6F15 six speed automatic...no "powershift"....so, there was a mid cycle powertrain update...just, nobody noticed...well, Car and Driver did...but, you know how that goes.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 . I am replying to this part as I was in our local Ford store last week when the better half bought her new 2018 Escape SE. There was a 2018 Focus sitting on the show room floor with a 1.0L EB motor and a 6F15 six speed automatic...no "powershift"....so, there was a mid cycle powertrain update...just, nobody noticed...well, Car and Driver did...but, you know how that goes.... Ford intentionally limited production of the 1.0 EB Focus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Why are Ford, GM, and FCA losing ground in the crossover vehicle market? Because those companies' crossovers are often being surpassed by competitors in performance, safety, and value to the customer. Examples. Car and Driver 2018 Editors' Choice Subcompact crossovers, 6 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Compact crossovers, 10 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 1 Midsize crossovers, 11 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 5 2018 IIHS Top Safety Pick and Top Safety Pick Plus Small crossovers, 9 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Midsize crossovers, 7 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 0 Winners from FCA, 0 Midsize luxury crossovers, 9 winners. Winners from Ford, 0 Winners from GM, 1 Winners from FCA, 0 There is no correlation between awards and comparison test winners and sales. The Camry placed dead last in every comparison test for years and years but easily held the sales crown. The problem with Ford crossovers is that Ecosport was late and not best in class, Escape is old and a bit too small and they're missing an in between model. And they're not willing to chase sales with big incentives at the expense of profits. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 if someone bases success on Awards from Institutes that spend their entire time trying to prove their own relevance, then god help the business...hers another useless barometer....Consumer Reports. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Jeez...the better half is enjoying her recently (last week) purchased 2018 Escape SE....traded her 2015 Forester for it...she doesn't miss the Forester at all...although, she has noticed a significant drop in requests to take a dip in the "lady pool"...lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 The problem with Ford crossovers is that Ecosport was late and not best in class No sir, the problem with Ford crossovers is that none of them are best in class. Edge and MKX are the only ones that even come close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Urban myths: Awards sell cars Profits are based on sales volumes Vehicles that aren't top safety picks are death traps 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 No sir, the problem with Ford crossovers is that none of them are best in class. Edge and MKX are the only ones that even come close. Camry was worst in class for years and was still the best seller. Explain that one. You don't have to be best in class you just have to be competitive. Being best in class usually allows you to charge a premium with less incentives which is great (Expy/Navi, F150 upper trims e.g.) but it's not a death sentence if you're not best in class. Ford sold a bunch of those "inferior" vehicles including ecosport, escape, Fusion, explorer, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 exhibit B.....JD Powers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 exhibit B.....JD Powers Well, if you are to believe all of those Chevy commercials... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Ford sold a bunch of those "inferior" vehicles including ecosport, escape, Fusion, explorer, etc. Thankfully Hackett and other Ford executives recognize the crossovers that you mentioned are inferior and uncompetitive, and have plans for new and better versions in the next few years. Years of mediocrity with their passenger cars in the U.S. (other than Mustangs, ST/RS, and hybrids) brought Ford to the point where the smart thing was to drop them, even though they sold a bunch. I don't think Hackett will allow that to happen with Ford crossovers. I hope Ford regains its ground in the crossover market in the next 5 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Years of mediocrity with their passenger cars in the U.S. (other than Mustangs, ST/RS, and hybrids) That's bullshit. 2nd gen Fusion is still one of the better looking midsizers and still has more powertrain options than the competition. It's not profitable right now but it's certainly not mediocre. You seem to have a narrow view of what is good based on your biases and whatever article you googled today or whatever someone else said on the internet. Even after we explain things to you using real data (such as Camry sales) you still don't understand, which means you don't want to understand. It's borderline trolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 ford hasn't "dropped" sedans from their portfolio...they are taking a sabbatical based on market preferences....every other manufacturer is doing exactly the same....following where the market demands take it....I think fords pretty much on top of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 ford hasn't "dropped" sedans from their portfolio...they are taking a sabbatical based on market preferences....every other manufacturer is doing exactly the same.... GM, Toyota, Nissan, Honda, VW, Hyundai/Kia, BMW, JLR, Mercedes-Benz, Subaru, Volvo haven't announced any "sabbaticals" yet for most or all of their U.S. sedan lineup. Only Ford, FCA, and Mitsubishi have done that recently. Whether you call it "dropping" or "sabbatical", Ford, FCA, and Mitsubishi did the right thing. Redesigning their sedans wouldn't be worth the investment.They can now focus on making their crossovers more competitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 every manufacturer you mentioned has slowly but surely been releasing more and more CUVs...its where the market is going...sedan sales are declining across the board, the market has spoken...Honda is even having issues selling their lauded Accord, Volvo has abandoned their wagons...I think what would be interesting would be to compare all the manufacturers slowing sedan sales vs the sales of said CUV/ SUV models...hell, even Lambo, Bentley and Rolls Royce ( and rumoured Ferrari ) have seen where the markets going....sedans may/ may not come back into vogue, and I believe the CD6 architecture can be easily adapted if deemed necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) GM, Toyota, Nissan, Honda, VW, Hyundai/Kia, BMW, JLR, Mercedes-Benz, Subaru, Volvo haven't announced any "sabbaticals" yet for most or all of their U.S. sedan lineup. Only Ford, FCA, and Mitsubishi have done that recently. Whether you call it "dropping" or "sabbatical", Ford, FCA, and Mitsubishi did the right thing. Redesigning their sedans wouldn't be worth the investment.They can now focus on making their crossovers more competitive. GM has put all but 2 traditional sedans on the back burner. Honda feels the next HR-V will outsell the Civic in the next generation, is reintroducing the Passport as an Edge competitor and is studying a longer Pilot with more cargo room. Its not just the US market where higher riding vehicles are taking off. It is Europe and Asia as well. The whole market is waiting to see where sedans level out but that hasnt happen yet and the change seems to be accelerating. Once Toyota and Ford introduce the next generation RAV4 and Escape it will become even worse for the Camry and Fusion. I suspect the Camry wont stop bleeding until it is about 200k units while the RAV4 will probably be close to 500,000. Edited August 3, 2018 by jasonj80 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted August 4, 2018 Share Posted August 4, 2018 Toyota is preparing a second plant for RAV4 Production and have openly admitted that they expect that Camry buyers will increase their migration to utilities. FCA, Ford and GM are just the first to get out of least profitable car segments and build more Utilities. Their reduction / withdrawal from those segments is exactly why Asian car makers sales of cars are not decaying as quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted August 4, 2018 Share Posted August 4, 2018 (edited) Sales By Type..................July 2018...........July 2017..........Change Cars...................................34,879................48,259..............-13,380 Utilities...............................69,994................71,067................-1,073 Trucks................................89,153................80,866...............+8,267 Total................................194,026..............200,212................-6,186 It's unfortunate that Ford's figures are still down 3%, that masks the very good effort Ford has made in selling more Trucks and Commercial vehicles. Utility sales were down a mere 1.5% which is more than explained by one less selling day compared to July 2017. While Ford's utilities may be generally old, the Explorer is still putting up a good fight and the Edge has just received a nice power train update with the 8-speed auto.but yes, Escape is down significantly by around 7,000 which conceals the good result achieved by Explorer. It's easy to look at figures generically and assume that Ford is not achieving anything positive but look deeper at the shift Escape sales down, Explorer sales up and the nett is more revenue. Edited August 4, 2018 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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