hllywd Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said: Big difference in the reaction on the MAP Facebook groups I’m in vs the post on the UAW International page. There’s 1 guy in particular I know is going to be very, VERY bitter for the next 4 years if this passes. It's going to be difficult to work with some of these people moving forward. The same ones screaming solidarity and saying vote no are the ones who don't get along with anybody and do whatever they can to make their work life better at the expense of others when we're not on strike. There are many examples but one is especially egregious. This poor woman was getting berated for working overtime. She was on medical leave for 6 months. If she doesn't get hours now she'll lose vacation time and profit sharing next year. These a-holes said she should've planned better. Are you freaking kidding me? How do you plan ahead for a long term, unexpected medical leave? I've learned that what they really mean by solidarity is that we're all supposed to drink the same kool aid and subscribe to their ways of thinking. To me, however, solidarity goes both ways. We don't know people's situations outside of work. We should all be supporting each other. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 3 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: Big difference in the reaction on the MAP Facebook groups I’m in vs the post on the UAW International page. There’s 1 guy in particular I know is going to be very, VERY bitter for the next 4 years if this passes. Dude should go fucking work somewhere else. If he thinks he’s worth more than that, go find it. Nobody is making him stay at Ford. The company is under no obligation to pay him or anybody else what they want to be paid. People like that piss me off. I can only imagine the quality of work a guy like that will put out with all of his bitterness. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 2 hours ago, hllywd said: It's going to be difficult to work with some of these people moving forward. The same ones screaming solidarity and saying vote no are the ones who don't get along with anybody and do whatever they can to make their work life better at the expense of others when we're not on strike. There are many examples but one is especially egregious. This poor woman was getting berated for working overtime. She was on medical leave for 6 months. If she doesn't get hours now she'll lose vacation time and profit sharing next year. These a-holes said she should've planned better. Are you freaking kidding me? How do you plan ahead for a long term, unexpected medical leave? I've learned that what they really mean by solidarity is that we're all supposed to drink the same kool aid and subscribe to their ways of thinking. To me, however, solidarity goes both ways. We don't know people's situations outside of work. We should all be supporting each other. Ford has some really despicable people working for them. This strike has been pretty enlightening in a negative way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfan Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 13 hours ago, paintguy said: You are right Chicago is old. Some sections still there where Model T was assembled. Had many discussions with VO Engineering regarding "on the bubble" status. Quite a few questioned that Chicago was open and Wixom, in much better condition, was closed. At the time thought it was related to the value of the land. Closed plants were marketable as real estate. Chicago is in an area dotted with long closed factories. A lot of it is politics. Closing Chicago would mean a loss of political support from the governor, two senators, and US representatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 Let’s hope the UAW Ford membership votes in favor of this contracts and ends this situation for 4.8 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said: Let’s hope the UAW Ford membership votes in favor of this contracts and ends this situation for 4.8 years. Yes, enough already and time for regular workers to get back on the job and earning money, Christmas will be here soon enough. Take the win and go. Edited October 26, 2023 by jpd80 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 7 hours ago, ausrutherford said: Anyone heard of product placement? 7 hours ago, silvrsvt said: I'm guessing that won't come out for a couple more days. I can't remember the last time if it was done before or after it was voted on, but I'm guessing before. Full details will be out Sunday evening after the Ford council votes on whether or not to send it to membership for a vote. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 1 hour ago, jpd80 said: Yes, enough already and time for regular workers to get back on the job and earning money, Christmas will be here soon enough. Take the win and go. Agreed, I believe it will be ratified. I think most of the people want to get back to work. You will have your it’s not good enough element but I don’t think it will be enough to prevent ratification. The paltry 500 a week strike pay doesn’t pay the bills. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 Most of the shit talkers have been pretty quiet the last 10 hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 8 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: Most of the shit talkers have been pretty quiet the last 10 hours. its pretty easy to talk shit behind a screen... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 2 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: Most of the shit talkers have been pretty quiet the last 10 hours. Good maybe the keyboard warriors also want to get back to work lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 IMO, best settlement is one in which neither side wins. That indicates compromise was made by both. Unfortunately Fain will be pounding his chest like he really delivered on all of his unrealistic proposals. No mention will be made of lost real wages and stress he created for a lot of households. Hopefully Bill Ford will continue taking the high ground and do his best to keep Ford an American institution-something that is not in Fain's long term playbook I fear. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Bob Rosadini said: IMO, best settlement is one in which neither side wins. That indicates compromise was made by both. Unfortunately Fain will be pounding his chest like he really delivered on all of his unrealistic proposals. No mention will be made of lost real wages and stress he created for a lot of households. Hopefully Bill Ford will continue taking the high ground and do his best to keep Ford an American institution-something that is not in Fain's long term playbook I fear. I believe Fain knew some of the demands were unattainable and part of the strategy. They didn’t get 46 percent 4 day work week or legacy pensions for all. I believe it was all part of the strategy. He will no doubt be pounding his chest. I supposed the UAW pushed as far as they could. Edited October 26, 2023 by Oacjay98 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 54 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said: I believe Fain knew some of the demands were unattainable and part of the strategy. They didn’t get 46 percent 4 day work week or legacy pensions for all. I believe it was all part of the strategy. He will no doubt will be pounding his chest. I supposed the UAW pushed as far as they could. For sure..std procedure you always have proposals that are throw aways in the negotiating process. I think Fain had some that were just plain unrealistic-raw meat he was throwing out . These unattainable proposals just fuel the fire with the dummies in the bargaining unit that just make it tougher to get a majority vote from the membership. IMO, responsible union leadership doesn't let unrealistic proposals or "demands" get on the table. A guy like Fain will in the long run prove detrimental to the fate of a lot of junior members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 It’s interesting to see the change in public tone once both parties are close to an agreement, even asking member to go back to work while the proposal is reviewed is a big thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 14 minutes ago, jpd80 said: It’s interesting to see the change in public tone once both parties are close to an agreement, even asking member to go back to work while the proposal is reviewed is a big thing. It wouldn’t surprise me to find out whoever runs UAW social media is deleting negative comments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 12 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: It wouldn’t surprise me to find out whoever runs UAW social media is deleting negative comments Yes, scrubbing sites ahead of a ratification vote is key to proclaiming victory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 1 hour ago, Bob Rosadini said: For sure..std procedure you always have proposals that are throw aways in the negotiating process. I think Fain had some that were just plain unrealistic-raw meat he was throwing out . These unattainable proposals just fuel the fire with the dummies in the bargaining unit that just make it tougher to get a majority vote from the membership. IMO, responsible union leadership doesn't let unrealistic proposals or "demands" get on the table. A guy like Fain will in the long run prove detrimental to the fate of a lot of junior members. I agree with you but my question is in what way will he be detrimental? Do you believe he will cost junior members to lose their jobs somehow down the road?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted October 26, 2023 Author Share Posted October 26, 2023 While it may seem positive that Ford and UAW have agreed to a tentative agreement regarding the strike, Bill Ford needs to stop thinking that the relationship with the UAW is either friendly or a partnership. Other than the concessions that the UAW agreed to in the “Great Recession” contract, the relationship is strictly one of employer/employee. The UAW members are employees and paid to do a job and paid according to the terms of the CBA (Collective Bargaining Agreement). The recent and/or current labor dispute has been anything other than a negotiation, but a matter of the UAW issuing a list of non-negotiable demands. As the UAW has issued strike related work stoppages at specific plants, the “Big 3” have continued to make revised offers with improved wages and benefit. There are terms in the Tenatative Agreement that make no sense. Right to strike over plant closures. A major concession to the UAW to protect future job requirements based on anticipated lower labor requirements for BEV vehicle production. Ford and the Big 3 should have rejected this as a “non-negotiable” issue. Part of the past agreements related to UAW contract concessions included profit-sharing agreements. With the current market situation (transition to BEV vehicle production and related costs) the profit-sharing agreement should be cancelled. Employees are paid to do a job per the CBA (Collective Bargaining Agreement) Contract employees are not entitled to profit sharing. If employees want to profit in the Company’s success, they have the option to invest in the Company by the purchasing the Company’s stock. I have no problem with payments for contract ratification which are common. Ford and Bill Ford, in particular, need to stop thinking about the UAW being a partner or friend. With the events of the current strike situation, it’s time for Ford to send a message to the UAW that Ford will make future decisions based on what’s best for the Company, regardless of the impact on the UAW. One of the messages that Ford could send to the UAW is the announcement that Ford will either construct a new plant in Mexico or resume construction of the San Luis Postito site. In addition, although the costs would be similar to UAW costs, it would be to build a new facility in Canada or expand the Oakville Assembly Plant for additional vehicle production. Ford’s Tentative Agreement with the UAW mortgages the financial future of the company and leaves little margin for error with potential and substantial changes in the economy going forward. At the new top wage of at least $40 per hour, the result is a weekly gross of $1,600 or $83,200 per year not including additional benefits which easily put the average well above $100,000 per year including profit-sharing. I think that a lot of non-automotive workers would line up to earn those wages and benefits. The UAW should enjoy the new contract terms as the situation could change radically in the next four years. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 56 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: It wouldn’t surprise me to find out whoever runs UAW social media is deleting negative comments Yah think?????? take it to the bank! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NitroRichFire Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 Ice-Capades, it would NOT surprise me at all if FORD builds a plant in Mexico or resumes the construction of the San Luis Postito site like you stated. Mr. Fain can only push so far until the other side takes actions to make sure the company does NOT go under. I can NOT imagine what Mr. Fain will ask for next time. Something my granddad always said "Money Is The Root Of All Evil, It Creates Greed, Which In Turn Creates Self-centeredness!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 Good analysis of the proposed contact by the Detroit News. Worth a read. https://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/2023/10/26/uaw-strike-ford-deal-gains-losses/70985807007/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 16 minutes ago, mackinaw said: Good analysis of the proposed contact by the Detroit News. Worth a read. https://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/2023/10/26/uaw-strike-ford-deal-gains-losses/70985807007/ Paywalled Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 35 minutes ago, akirby said: Paywalled Damn, sorry about that, I didn't now it was paywalled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-dubz Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 Has it been mentioned what will happen to ford’s future battery plants? Did they give in like GM? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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