silvrsvt Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 http://www.carscoops.com/2013/03/lincoln-accepts-its-fate-and-launches.html Lincoln said the 2013 MKS Livery sedan starts MSRP of $43,865 and will be available in AWD and FWD versions, with three different types of product packages. According to the company, fleet discount incentive for the MKS is $3,000 per vehicle, the same as on the MKT Town Car. The automaker noted that it will allow QVM-certified manufacturers to extend the MKS sedan up to 4-to-6 inches "based on Ford engineering recommendations". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfeg Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 I think that this will go over better than the MKT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 "We listened to market needs to enable the Lincoln MKT Town Car to become a worthy successor to the Town Car Executive L, and now look forward to doing the same with the new MKS Livery sedan," said Matt VanDyke, Director, Lincoln Global.".... He is suffering from bad hearing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hbalek Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 (edited) I've already seen a few 2013 "Town Cars" in Washington, D.C. and they are perfect for this role once they catch on. My dealership uses a Flex as a shuttle and it's so roomy and comfortable! It makes sense to have an MKS version too, just like there are fleet versions of the Taurus and Explorer Interceptors. In my opinion they should add a livery Flex too! Also here in the D.C. area I've been seeing a lot of non-police uses of Explorer and Taurus Intercepters for government fleets. Maximize D3 sales. Edited March 7, 2013 by hbalek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 To me this confirms that Flex and MKT are dead and D3 will become the new Panther. Taurus, Explorer and MKS retail versions move to CD4 derivatives. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 Hmmm....MKT limo, and now MKS limo. Maybe Lincoln should change its name from Lincoln Motor Company to Lincoln Livery Company. Navigator is also a favorite of Limo Companies. That is disappointing news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 Hmmm....MKT limo, and now MKS limo. Maybe Lincoln should change its name from Lincoln Motor Company to Lincoln Livery Company. Navigator is also a favorite of Limo Companies. That is disappointing news. How is this disappointing?? Cadillac is likewise committed to the Livery market. It is a valuable segment to their business model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 How is this disappointing?? Cadillac is likewise committed to the Livery market. It is a valuable segment to their business model. Lincoln is down to 5 vehicle lineup, and THREE are limos or becoming limos. Not my idea of a desirable luxury car maker. Just shows you how weak the Lincoln lineup is right now that they have to get into livery market to keep the MKT, MKS, and Navigator going somehow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 (edited) Why is Ford releasing a livery version of the MKS in standard wheelbase when the market is asking for a Town Car replacement. I don't think that Ford is listening to the right people, otherwise MKT Town car would have been a much better success. This looks like Ford trying option "B" instead of actually tailoring a Town Car replacement. An MKS with 117.9" wheelbase would be a more appropriate Town Car replacement to meet Livery market requirements, those asking why Lincoln (Ford) is even considering Liveries should consider the size of the market and the money to be made... 1. Replace MKT with Explorer based Aviator 2. Allow FoA to develop a LWB version of Falcon as a new Town Car replacement ( the numbers don't have to be huge) 3. Allow Lincoln to develop CD4 version of MKS as a predominantly retail oriented vehicle Edited March 7, 2013 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 Why is Ford releasing a livery version of the MKS in standard wheelbase when the market is asking for a Town Car replacement.I don't think that Ford is listening to the right people, otherwise MKT Town car would have been a much better success. This looks like Ford trying option "B" instead of actually tailoring a Town Car replacement. An MKS with 117.9" wheelbase would be a more appropriate Town Car replacement to meet Livery market requirements, those asking why Lincoln (Ford) is even considering Liveries should consider the size of the market and the money to be made... Probably because MKT and MKS sales are so dismal, even just after MCE. It's like they have thrown in the towel on selling the Navigator, MKS, and especially the MKT as a desirable retail sale. They are basically turning 3/5ths of their lineup into livery queens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 Alright. I'm reinstating FB's five post limit. You've been warned. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 After Town Car died, representatives from the Livery market were brought in and asked if they would prefer a MKS or MKT variant instead. MKT won the vote, and development started on the 2013 MKT Town Car. Sales haven't lived up to the research, and since retail MKS sales aren't setting the world on fire, this seems like a no-brainer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Probably because MKT and MKS sales are so dismal, even just after MCE. It's like they have thrown in the towel on selling the Navigator, MKS, and especially the MKT as a desirable retail sale. They are basically turning 3/5ths of their lineup into livery queens. They're making livery versions of vehicles that are approaching the end of their lives and/or have replacements on the horizon - so what? I don't see it as that big a deal. 1. Replace MKT with Explorer based Aviator2. Allow FoA to develop a LWB version of Falcon as a new Town Car replacement ( the numbers don't have to be huge) 3. Allow Lincoln to develop CD4 version of MKS as a predominantly retail oriented vehicle Well, at least 1 and 3 are in the works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 "extend the MKS sedan up to 4-to-6 inches" For what it must cost, that probably won't happen very often, considering the alternative vehicles out there, IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 (edited) Probably because MKT and MKS sales are so dismal, even just after MCE. It's like they have thrown in the towel on selling the Navigator, MKS, and especially the MKT as a desirable retail sale. They are basically turning 3/5ths of their lineup into livery queens. To be a "livery Queen", you first need to attract a lot of sales....none of those vehicles does that. This is nothing more than ass covering for products that refuse to sell at acceptable levels. Why not give FoA a nice Town Car contract, something they can build mostly to order and some inventory and satisfy the market with a purpose built vehicle that doesn't draw from any other North American product. That way, the profile of the Livery Town car and some private Town Car sales has far less influence on how the rest of the Lincoln Range is presented. I would be much more comfortable about the business case for FoA building Town Cars than Holden building Chevrolet SS To me it's Holden presenting a reconfigured Pontiac G8 where as a Falcon based Town car would probably win back a lot of Livery car buyers, give Australia some more production ...and maybe win back some RWD / Panther fans too... Edited March 8, 2013 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Why is Ford releasing a livery version of the MKS in standard wheelbase when the market is asking for a Town Car replacement. For the same reason they will not build the Explorer-EL you keep asking for. Building a LWB version of a MkS or Explorer is not an inexpensive proposition. Doing a LWB MkS for very limited fleet sales is putting good money after bad. I see quite a few MkTownCars. On average I'd say one a day, often more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 (edited) For the same reason they will not build the Explorer-EL you keep asking for. Building a LWB version of a MkS or Explorer is not an inexpensive proposition. Doing a LWB MkS for very limited fleet sales is putting good money after bad. And I keep telling you that the engineering for LWB D3 is already done and manifest in Flex and MKT, turning them into Explorer EL and LWB Aviator is not the mountain you think Doing a LWB MkS for very limited fleet sales is putting good money after bad. It is not as bad as you make out and acts more as incremental sales than a separate unique vehicle. Done properly, a LWB MKS becomes a true large luxury vehicle and becomes much more than a livery vehicle, Think Jaguar XJ...7 Series ect... Edited March 8, 2013 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2b2 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 And I keep telling you that the engineering for LWB D3 is already done and manifest in Flex and MKT,turning them into Explorer EL and LWB Aviator is not the mountain you think It is not as bad as you make out and acts more as incremental sales than a separate unique vehicle. Done properly, a LWB MKS becomes a true large luxury vehicle and becomes much more than a livery vehicle, Think Jaguar XJ...7 Series ect... agree imho the only mistake would be continuing the MKT imho2 it woulda been better to do the E386 from the start Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 The issue is not the engineering, it's the extra tooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 The issue is not the engineering, it's the extra tooling. But before that happens, Ford has to 1) admit that Flex / MKT is a mistake and 2) see value in changing to something else As much as I would like to see Explorer EL and a LWB navigator, sense tells me that OakVille will be switching to CD4 based products which also gives Ford the opportunity to review the style of Edge / MKX as well as Flex / MKT vehicles produced there. It may well be that solutions are already in hand and better execution of said products will yield better results... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2b2 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 meant to say before with a new Navi based on the superlight-F-150 and a CD4+ Aviator, the MKT wouldn't be missed even if it HAD been less of a failure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfeg Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 One of the problems that I see with the MKT, especially as a livery vehicle, is it's look. The thing looks like a scaled down styleized hearse. When someone hires a car, they generally do not want the neighbors to think that the local funeral director is stopping by to pick up a body. In the livery market looks can matter. Even though the MKS is not the best looker out there, since it is styled as a car I feel that it will do much better than the MKT. And just my opinion, Lincoln needs to ditch the current front end styling if they want to increase sales. The grilles remind me of the grin of the Cheshire Cat, and not in an attractive way. The new MKZ is the worst offender - the front detracts from the rest of the look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 And just my opinion, Lincoln needs to ditch the current front end styling if they want to increase sales. The grilles remind me of the grin of the Cheshire Cat, and not in an attractive way. The new MKZ is the worst offender - the front detracts from the rest of the look. The MKZ represents the "ditching" of the current front end styling, and hasn't sold much due to low inventory, and you already want to write it off as a failure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 The MKZ represents the "ditching" of the current front end styling, and hasn't sold much due to low inventory, and you already want to write it off as a failure? Of course! If >I< don't like something, it's obviously wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Why is Ford releasing a livery version of the MKS in standard wheelbase when the market is asking for a Town Car replacement.You missed the most important statement ! The automaker noted that it will allow QVM-certified manufacturers to extend the MKS sedan up to 4-to-6 inches "based on Ford engineering recommendations". I ave been crying for this for a long time now ! They used to slice the old Panther Towne Cars in half to make "stretch" limos, so this is nothing new. This will be a "game change" in the current livery market and it can not happen soon enough ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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