2024 FORD EXPLORER SPIED WITH CHINESE COUNTERPART’S FEATURES

[akirby]

4 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

That's correct, but a moot point for D4 and CD6 platform Ford Explorer because those vehicles are both unibody and crossover.

Most crossovers are transverse FWD/AWD and share a car platform.  CD6 Explorer is a bespoke RWD platform designed as a SUV.  Just like Grand Cherokee.

Edited June 24, 2023 by akirby

[akirby]

1 hour ago, Hugh said:

IIRC, didn't Ford push the "SUV" moniker for the current generation of Explorer?

Yes but if you look now they’re all called SUVs including Escape and Mach-E.

[AGR]

On 6/23/2023 at 10:20 PM, akirby said:

Most crossovers are transverse FWD/AWD and share a car platform.  CD6 Explorer is a bespoke RWD platform designed as a SUV.  Just like Grand Cherokee.

 

The CD6 platform is only "bespoke" because the sedans and coupe(s) that were supposed to share it were canceled.  The CD6 Explorer is absolutely a crossover, no matter what Ford calls it. The earlier Grand Cherokees (and the XJs) were an odd hybrid of truck suspensions and running gear with unibody construction. I'm not sure what you'd call them, but I would say they're SUVs(except for the Comanche of course). The new/current GC is based on the same platform as the Alfa Romeo Guilia, so it's a crossover.

Edited June 25, 2023 by AGR

[ANTAUS]

Just as with "Coupe" on 4 door vehicles. BMW and MB love to throw that "coupe" label on what are clearly tall sedans. Or wait, is that a crossover...?

[AM222]

On 6/26/2023 at 1:32 AM, AGR said:

 

The CD6 platform is only "bespoke" because the sedans and coupe(s) that were supposed to share it were canceled.  The CD6 Explorer is absolutely a crossover, no matter what Ford calls it. The earlier Grand Cherokees (and the XJs) were an odd hybrid of truck suspensions and running gear with unibody construction. I'm not sure what you'd call them, but I would say they're SUVs(except for the Comanche of course). The new/current GC is based on the same platform as the Alfa Romeo Guilia, so it's a crossover.

Manufacturers calling their crossovers "SUVs" is more of a marketing thing. 






 

Edited June 28, 2023 by AM222

[AM222]

On 6/24/2023 at 11:20 AM, akirby said:

Most crossovers are transverse FWD/AWD and share a car platform.  CD6 Explorer is a bespoke RWD platform designed as a SUV.  Just like Grand Cherokee.

I call the Explorer an SUV because Ford still calls it an SUV, but it's pretty much a lifted station wagon, sort of like the Australian Falcon-based Ford Territory. They both have car-like suspension and have limited articulation. SUVs use to have "off-road capable" as part of its ingredient, in recent years "more capable than a car" is good enough.

Back in the day, today's Grand Cherokee would have probably been considered a crossover. The Original Cherokee and Grand Cherokee were unibody with a "Uniframe" design, an integrated full length frame and they were very capable off-road. Very different from today's unibody "SUVs".


Ford's Equator Sport (China) which it exports as the Territory (replacement for non-hybrid Escapes in some markets), has no "car" equivalent but it's definitely a crossover even if Ford calls it an SUV. Its platform and suspension are pretty much like that of a car.

Edited June 27, 2023 by AM222

[ice-capades]

SUV vs. CUV... Who really cares? It's only important to the enthusiasts that focus on the details. To the average consumer, there is no difference. If it's not a coupe, sedan or pickup, it's an SUV!  

[akirby]

11 minutes ago, ice-capades said:

SUV vs. CUV... Who really cares?

What else are we going to argue about right now?  ???

[rmc523]

9 minutes ago, akirby said:

What else are we going to argue about right now?  ???

 

The sky is blue.

[HotRunrGuy]

2 hours ago, rmc523 said:

 

The sky is blue.

 

Here in the Chicago area, we can't tell,,,,,

 

HRG

[rmc523]

22 hours ago, HotRunrGuy said:

 

Here in the Chicago area, we can't tell,,,,,

 

HRG

 

Add that to the list of Chicago issues....at least if the news is to be believed lol.

[Hugh]

On 6/27/2023 at 12:38 PM, HotRunrGuy said:

 

Here in the Chicago area, we can't tell,,,,,

 

HRG

Sorry...

[joseodiaga4]

 

 

 

Edited June 29, 2023 by joseodiaga4

[rmc523]

1 hour ago, joseodiaga4 said:

 

 

 

 

When I first saw that top image, I thought someone had crunched the corner in in an accident lol.

 

I really don't like those wheels at all.

Edited June 29, 2023 by rmc523

[tbone]

3 hours ago, rmc523 said:

 

I really don't like those wheels at all.

That’s a hard pass on those wheels!  I hope those are not production wheels.  Ford wheels are typically pretty good, but as a current ST owner I would not buy those on the next one. 

[DeluxeStang]

4 hours ago, tbone said:

That’s a hard pass on those wheels!  I hope those are not production wheels.  Ford wheels are typically pretty good, but as a current ST owner I would not buy those on the next one. 

Respect,  but I kinda dig 'em. They find a good balance between clean,  but unique imo. 

[DeluxeStang]

On 6/25/2023 at 11:32 AM, AGR said:

 

The CD6 platform is only "bespoke" because the sedans and coupe(s) that were supposed to share it were canceled. 

I'm still so pissed about this. This decision makes even less sense now that BORG is claiming there will be no electric escape, edge, or second gen mach-e. It just seems so strange for Ford to just back out of all these segments. I understand profitably and all that,  but damn. It seems like they're regressing to a mustang/transit/f-series company again while giving up on everything else. 

[Ares]

25 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

I'm still so pissed about this. This decision makes even less sense now that BORG is claiming there will be no electric escape, edge, or second gen mach-e. It just seems so strange for Ford to just back out of all these segments. I understand profitably and all that,  but damn. It seems like they're regressing to a mustang/transit/f-series company again while giving up on everything else. 

I will forever be saddened at the loss of the CD6 sedan and coupes. I was a young teen lurking this site when those were still supposedly happening and I was hyped.

But seriously? That's the first I've heard that they're exiting those segments. Jesus - no second gen Mach-E is a shame. So are all those names supposed to just die out?

[ice-capades]

4 hours ago, matt6 said:

I will forever be saddened at the loss of the CD6 sedan and coupes. I was a young teen lurking this site when those were still supposedly happening and I was hyped.

But seriously? That's the first I've heard that they're exiting those segments. Jesus - no second gen Mach-E is a shame. So are all those names supposed to just die out?

 

The information for the Escape and Mustang Mach-E is just speculation and not based on facts or confirmation from Ford at this point. 

[akirby]

1 hour ago, ice-capades said:

 

The information for the Escape and Mustang Mach-E is just speculation and not based on facts or confirmation from Ford at this point. 

From someone who is frequently wrong.  But it’s possible based on the comments from Farley about the 2 row crossover segment being commoditized and crowded.

[DeluxeStang]

5 hours ago, ice-capades said:

 

The information for the Escape and Mustang Mach-E is just speculation and not based on facts or confirmation from Ford at this point. 

True, but BORG clearly has a line to ford's product development. He said his concern is Farley is basically speaking out against any new two row crossovers, and focusing more on three row stuff. But he thinks the three row bullet train ev is going to flop due to it's looks. 

 

On a more positive note, he says t3 and the te1 based super duty w/ range extender both look very promising, and are "revolutionary". He hasn't said much about t3 other than it would have three rows of seats with sliding jump seats. My biggest concern with t3 is it's going to look shocking in the same way the explorer ev looks shocking. 

[akirby]

48 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

True, but BORG clearly has a line to ford's product development. He said his concern is Farley is basically speaking out against any new two row crossovers, and focusing more on three row stuff. But he thinks the three row bullet train ev is going to flop due to it's looks. 

 

On a more positive note, he says t3 and the te1 based super duty w/ range extender both look very promising, and are "revolutionary". He hasn't said much about t3 other than it would have three rows of seats with sliding jump seats. My biggest concern with t3 is it's going to look shocking in the same way the explorer ev looks shocking. 

Not saying he’s wrong about 2 row crossovers but he has been wrong in the past - more than once - so take anything he says with a grain of salt.  That’s why he left here - didn’t like us pointing out when he was wrong.

 

Let me reiterate how corporate projects work.  There is a finite budget each year for both expense and capital (and they’re completely separate and you can’t move money between them).  There are finite resources including people and facilities and suppliers which are supported by those budgets,   There is never enough resources to do everything so the vehicles and projects are prioritized by financial and strategic benefits and resource requirements.  Then you go down the list until you run out of a resource and you draw the line.  Above the line is funded, below is not.  
 

It’s like having a grocery list with $200 worth of food but you only have $150.  You prioritize and when you get to $150 you stop.  At that point if you want Oreos then you have to put back the apples.

 

So the question is whether they have plenty of other BEVs to develop and 2 row crossovers are therefor below the line right now or if they don’t see the ROI being worth the effort.  If they have better things to build (see Bronco sport/Maverick vs Fusion and Ranger/Bronco vs Focus) then it makes sense to skip those for now.

[DeluxeStang]

1 hour ago, akirby said:

The question is whether they have plenty of other BEVs to develop and 2 row crossovers are therefor below the line right now or if they don’t see the ROI being worth the effort.  If they have better things to build (see Bronco sport/Maverick vs Fusion and Ranger/Bronco vs Focus) then it makes sense to skip those for now.

I agree. I see the reasoning behind not offering the focus/fiesta, the maverick is a much better entry level vehicle anyway. I feel as though the Tarus/fusion should have been consolidated into one model, just to keep a Ford sedan on the market. Sedans may not sell as well as crossovers, but they still sell over a million of them a year. Walking away from that completely was a bone head move.

 

What makes even less sense is gradually pulling out of the two row crossover space. I get it's a crowded and competitive segment, it's also extremely lucrative. The bronco sport is solid, I understand that the escape is struggling. But instead of just walking away from it, invest in it to give it more design appeal. Create something that's sleeker, more car like, with better handing dynamics inspired by the mach-e, something that's seen as one of the best products in it's segment. Make it look like this abandoned mach-e sketch and I'd beg Ford to make it. 

[akirby]

59 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

I agree. I see the reasoning behind not offering the focus/fiesta, the maverick is a much better entry level vehicle anyway. I feel as though the Tarus/fusion should have been consolidated into one model, just to keep a Ford sedan on the market. Sedans may not sell as well as crossovers, but they still sell over a million of them a year. Walking away from that completely was a bone head move.

 

What makes even less sense is gradually pulling out of the two row crossover space. I get it's a crowded and competitive segment, it's also extremely lucrative. The bronco sport is solid, I understand that the escape is struggling. But instead of just walking away from it, invest in it to give it more design appeal. Create something that's sleeker, more car like, with better handing dynamics inspired by the mach-e, something that's seen as one of the best products in it's segment. Make it look like this abandoned mach-e sketch and I'd beg Ford to make it. 

 

There is no such thing as lucrative when you’re competing on price with 8 or more competitors especially Nissan, Hyundai and Kia.  Considering published margins from Ford and other companies it’s reasonable to think a $30k family sedan or crossover only nets about $1500 profit.  If you then have to put $2K cash on the hood you’re losing money.  
 

I understand your point that a uniquely styled 2 row crossover would have a more unique market like Bronco Sport but that’s really hard to do outside of the boxy off road segment.  The bigger point is it’s probably far riskier than other things Ford has in the hopper.
 

[T-dubz]

Yes those wheels are terrible. They look like stars or flowers, neither of which should be on the sporty version of a vehicle.

 

As for 3 row vehicles, not sure I agree with that. While large 3 rows make a good profit, they don’t sell in large numbers. Midsize 3 rows sell better, but the 3rd row is often too small for anything but very small children. 
 

Also, the added weight of having 3 rows seems to go against what ford is trying to accomplish with better aero and smaller batteries. 
 

I personally find an edge/nautilus sized vehicle to be the perfect size. Better mileage, easy to park, fits easily in a garage, can hold the average size family comfortably with ample legroom and you don’t have to mess with stowing the 3rd row seats to maximize storage.