With Mercury gone and Ford moving upscale what happens at the bottom?

[2005Explorer]

I'm just curious about your thoughts on this. Is the Ford brand versatile enough to be able to market the cheapest stripped down Fiestas and Focuses next to a loaded Taurus SHO? Is the idea of a economy youth brand dead or not? I know that Toyota has had its issues with Scion, but some of that has been the lack of product. I know the mission is to now fix Lincoln, but with Mercury gone and Ford moving up into the premium catagory is there room in the future for a new brand at the bottom?

 

Your thoughts...

[sullynd]

I think the better plan is to not sell cheap, stripped down, fiestas and focuses (focii?). I've seen no indication Ford plans on doing that.

[Mysterio]

Time for a new third brand?

[2005Explorer]

Time for a new third brand?

 

Well not right now, but if done right a youth brand might work. Toyota started off strong with Scion, but lost their way it seems.

 

Ford is still a mainstream builder of automobiles. Even though they want to move upscale I feel they still need to offer vehicles that are affordable to the masses. That was the orginal idea of the Ford Motor Company and it still is what Ford represents today.

Edited June 12, 2010 by 2005Explorer

[papilgee4evaeva]

I see little issue.

 

Ford is EXPANDING upward. Not moving there.

 

It's covering the market that Mercury had (truthfully) left a long time ago.

[blazerdude20]

hell no! there is no reason ford cant still cover the lower end. ford wont be chasing stripper buyers but more so the typical midlevel types. very similar to what vw does here.

 

there is no, no, NO! money at the stripper end of the market.

[silvrsvt]

Well not right now, but if done right a youth brand might work. Toyota started off strong with Scion, but lost their way it seems.

 

 

 

Youth buyers are fickle and a mirage for the most part

 

 

[92merc]

[blazerdude20]

 

where'd you find a pic of kevin james?

[ironhorse]

Youth buyers are fickle and a mirage for the most part

 

 

Exactly. It's like chasing the wind.

[92merc]

Ford is EXPANDING upward. Not moving there.

I think that is the best way to put it. I'll bet if you look at the mix of current Focus models sold, very few are in the "stripper" category. Most are the top 2 tiers. So to me, there is no incentive for Ford to do anything in the "stripper" model area that they already aren't doing. Keep the SE trim levels. But keep with the Limited, Platinum, Titanium lines (or features thereof)

[ausrutherford]

Who says they cant cover the lower end...

 

[ANTAUS]

They can introduce other Fiesta/Focus based vehicles that are available worldwide. Ecosport as one example...

[akirby]

Youth buyers are fickle and a mirage for the most part

 

Yeah, that worked out well for Mitsubishi. Almost put them out of business. Not that it would have been a great loss.

[battyr]

Ford is to make affordable cars for everyone.

 

If they can keep the quality up, the low end will the small cars and used cars.

 

Also consider that the best deal for the poor is not necessarily the cheapest car. If a car is more reliable, cheap to maintain and fuel efficient, then it is worth borrowing or finding the extra money to buy it.

[LarryQW]

Low Price * Low Volume * Low Margin = Neglible Business Value

 

I justed looked up the Fiesta and it starts at $13,320. (You need to pay another $3K for cool stuff like SYNC, ambient lighting, nice sound.)

 

Any lower price than that and one should be looking at used cars, which will be bigger and safer. Teaches one how to fix and maintain cars too.

 

I'm personally more impressed by the Focus and Fusion which are good value for most people.

 

I may 'cost support' my daughter to buy a Focus/Fusion in the $25K range some day, perhaps as ecoboost and Hybrids become more common and cheaper over the next few years. But she needs a few more years of pennance in my safe big old Sable wagon. And she first needs to learn about changing oil, watching the tires, and other things.

 

When I look at the higher end Fords, I don't see any of the Platinum packages mentioned, just the Limited at best. I bought a fully loaded Taurus X Limited that is nice on features. But I always really liked the Mercury improvements in touch and feel. My T-X has hard plastic interior, OK but not great leather seats, no telescope steering wheel, and pretty crappy overall for a top of the line model. Maybe I'll need to go to Lincoln, which I always thought as an old man's car. Oh snap, I'm becoming an old man.

[waymondospiff]

Interesting idea, but I think the situations between Toyota & Ford were different. Toyota had very little appeal to youth audiences, probably a result of making boring, undesirable cars like the Camry and Corolla. I'd say, not too unlike Ford making the 96-06 Taurus and 97-02 Escort. Ford decided (eventually) to make desirable cars as the core products - as seen in the Fiesta, 2012 Focus, Fusion, and heck, even the Taurus SHO. Toyota, on the other hand, decided that they didn't want to risk alienating their existing Corolla & Camry customers by making better, more "youthful" cars, instead they decided to introduce a new "youth" brand with "youth" vehicles and "youth" marketing.

 

So, Toyota decided the best method was to talk solely to the youth market with bespoke vehicles and images. Ford, instead, has decided to make one set of vehicles for all customers, and integrate "youth marketing" into the marketing plan for the same cars.

 

What's better? I don't know if there is an answer, but I think it's pretty clear that Scion has lost its way while Ford is coming off of its largely successful Fiesta Movement.

[jpd80]

Ford has been Laser Focused (he he) on increasing average transaction prices,

I wouldn't expect them to undo all of that by trying to compete with entry level

brands like Kia and Hyundai...

 

Yes, Ecosport may have a chance in the US but I can't see the returns on Figo justifying the effort.

[2b2]

I'm just curious about your thoughts on this. Is the Ford brand versatile enough to be able to market the cheapest stripped down Fiestas and Focuses next to a loaded Taurus SHO? Is the idea of a economy youth brand dead or not? I know that Toyota has had its issues with Scion, but some of that has been the lack of product. I know the mission is to now fix Lincoln, but with Mercury gone and Ford moving up into the premium catagory is there room in the future for a new brand at the bottom?

 

Your thoughts...

imho FORD-US can handle from $~12~k up to $50k

then Lincoln's MAIN sales would be in the $40k & up

hopefully eventually going to $99,999.99 (and not a penny more )

BUT

think about Ford-India, Ford-SAm etc

They need lower $$ models (Dacia-ish?) and just maybe they could eventually be designed to sell here too??

 

 

Time for a new third brand?

how about an established heritage Brand?

I was soooo desperate to keep Merc alive, I even made One post elsewhere about taking them small/low

 

 

...When I look at the higher end Fords, I don't see any of the Platinum packages mentioned...

luxury Truck(s) are Platinum

luxury Cars/Cuvs will be Titanium

go figure

 

 

Ford has been Laser Focused (he he)....

anyone else think FORD *really REALLY* needs a model called "LASER"??? :D

maybe if they do a small Fwd hot coupe/hatch -- instead of REFLEX!!!

Edited June 13, 2010 by 2b2

[nelsonlu]

I don't think Ford necessarily needs an entry brand. As it stands, the entry level trims that Ford has are competitive price-wise with entry-level brands with more/better features. For example, the Focus S is currently priced at $16,290; I'd expect it to go up to no more than $18,000 after the new model is introduced next year. By comparison, the Scion tC starts at $18,570. (The Kia Forte does start at a much lower price -- $13,695 -- but I still wouldn't say that the Focus is completely out of its price range, and, again, I think that the Focus has a better reputation.)

[2005Explorer]

I don't think Ford necessarily needs an entry brand. As it stands, the entry level trims that Ford has are competitive price-wise with entry-level brands with more/better features. For example, the Focus S is currently priced at $16,290; I'd expect it to go up to no more than $18,000 after the new model is introduced next year. By comparison, the Scion tC starts at $18,570. (The Kia Forte does start at a much lower price -- $13,695 -- but I still wouldn't say that the Focus is completely out of its price range, and, again, I think that the Focus has a better reputation.)

 

Well your probably right that Ford can use trim levels instead of brand to cater to different market segments with the same cars. I always thought that Scion was a neat concept, but it seems like many things Toyota the concept has kind of fallen apart.

[630land]

No, 1,000,000,000 times no. Scion is not selling that well, and no other Asian make wants to bring out a 'youth' brand, and dliute their existing ones. Scion promotes a 'hip' image, but kids aren't buying them. Guess who is? Aging Boomers in 60's who do not want a Grand Marquis/Lucurne, since they think of themselves as still 'younger'.

 

Younger buyers are not interested in all the old brands Detroit used to have. They shop size and class segments. Car buffs love to look at lots of brands so they can memorize and quiz each other. Buyers don't want to pay more $$$ for a 'special' grille, tailight, or hood.

Edited June 14, 2010 by 630land

[Mysterio]

Now that I've thought about it, no way.

 

Ford doesn't need a discount brand, because the Chinese will destroy that segment very soon. And even in tn the meanwhile it will exist only to undermine Ford's own brand value by being a "Ford" for less.

[rmc523]

Youth buyers are fickle and a mirage for the most part

 

 

That best says it, IMO. You all would probably lump me into the "youth" buyer category, but I feel like I fit in better with the "older" buyer category when it comes to things like brand loyalty, etc.

 

From what I've noticed though, younger buyers don't seem to have much (if any) brand/product loyalty. I for one am obviously a Ford guy and more than likely always will be - chances are you'll always see nothing but Ford products in my driveway - I can't tell you how many driveways down here have a whole shmorgishborg of different branded vehicles, new and old - very few driveways with one brand of vehicles in them. I only personally know one family with all the same brand of cars....unfortunately they're all Toyotas.

 

Anyway, back on the subject - todays buyers (and myself included to an extent: within the Ford brand) appear to me to be the "next big thing" generation.....as in once the next "big" car comes along that everyone's talking about, everybody wants one......the next car comes along, everybody dumps that "old" car and wants one of the new "in" car, etc.

 

Who says they cant cover the lower end...

 

 

Anyone else think that everybody in that Figo picture except the guy on the right look like cardboard cut-outs?

 

The Figo I believe is supposed to be India-only.

 

----

 

I believe we ARE to get the next-gen EcoSport here - the only reason we didn't get that one is because Fields didn't deem it good enough to enter the US market with the high-quality image Ford was/is crafting.

 

You know, one has to wonder which direction the EcoSport will go if the Escape does lose it's trucky look in favor of the Kuga's swoopy styling?

[ausrutherford]

That best says it, IMO. You all would probably lump me into the "youth" buyer category, but I feel like I fit in better with the "older" buyer category when it comes to things like brand loyalty, etc.

 

From what I've noticed though, younger buyers don't seem to have much (if any) brand/product loyalty. I for one am obviously a Ford guy and more than likely always will be - chances are you'll always see nothing but Ford products in my driveway - I can't tell you how many driveways down here have a whole shmorgishborg of different branded vehicles, new and old - very few driveways with one brand of vehicles in them. I only personally know one family with all the same brand of cars....unfortunately they're all Toyotas.

 

Anyway, back on the subject - todays buyers (and myself included to an extent: within the Ford brand) appear to me to be the "next big thing" generation.....as in once the next "big" car comes along that everyone's talking about, everybody wants one......the next car comes along, everybody dumps that "old" car and wants one of the new "in" car, etc.

 

 

 

Anyone else think that everybody in that Figo picture except the guy on the right look like cardboard cut-outs?

 

The Figo I believe is supposed to be India-only.

 

----

 

I believe we ARE to get the next-gen EcoSport here - the only reason we didn't get that one is because Fields didn't deem it good enough to enter the US market with the high-quality image Ford was/is crafting.

 

You know, one has to wonder which direction the EcoSport will go if the Escape does lose it's trucky look in favor of the Kuga's swoopy styling?

 

The Figo is actually suppose to go all over the Southeast Asia and Africa. South Africa sales start in July infact.

 

 

A design study rendering got out onto the web of the next EcoSport's tail and it was very kuga-ish.