rmc523 Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 (edited) 54 minutes ago, jpd80 said: Is this Jim Farley hitting the go button on products that maybe Jim Hackett wasn't prepared to do on his watch? Could be? Though someone earlier pointing out Ford's history of including all powertrain variants when tallying up electric models (i.e. an Edge ICE, hybrid, and PHEV counts as "3" models, "2" electrics) makes me skeptical of their "5 electric models" terminology. Interpreting Ford speak in normal people talk, that could easily mean only 3 new models: vehicle 1 - a Ford PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Edge) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models vehicle 2 - a Lincoln PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Nautilus) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models vehicle 3 - a new BEV model. FORD'S TALLY - "1" model Or it could be even "worse" - that it could easily mean 2 new models (in normal people talk): vehicle 1 - a Ford ICE/PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Edge) FORD'S TALLY - "3" models vehicle 2 - a Lincoln PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Nautilus) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models Edited September 22, 2020 by rmc523 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Harley Lover said: BZ, is it possible that the use of a skateboard chassis negates some of the time element of a "traditional" development cycle, and consequently these vehicles could be ready sooner? I don't think so. Skateboard chassis is no different than C2... Ford is not redesigning the drivetrain package on every C2 vehicle either but it still takes at least 36 months to finalize the body design, interior, and integrate all the sub-systems. Plus all the regulatory requirement and timeline doesn't change... you still have to do crash test evaluations even if the chassis is the same. And EV calibration and software optimization probably takes a lot more time than we all imagine. Ford will have MPGe targets it wants to hit and that number doesn't just go up by itself. You have to torture the drive system algorithm to do what you want. Edited September 22, 2020 by bzcat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valve Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 23 minutes ago, rmc523 said: Could be? Though someone earlier pointing out Ford's history of including all powertrain variants when tallying up electric models (i.e. an Edge ICE, hybrid, and PHEV counts as "3" models, "2" electrics) makes me skeptical of their "5 electric models" terminology. Interpreting Ford speak in normal people talk, that could easily mean only 3 new models: vehicle 1 - a Ford PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Edge) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models vehicle 2 - a Lincoln PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Nautilus) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models vehicle 3 - a new BEV model. FORD'S TALLY - "1" model Or it could be even "worse" - that it could easily mean 2 new models (in normal people talk): vehicle 1 - a Ford ICE/PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Edge) FORD'S TALLY - "3" models vehicle 2 - a Lincoln PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Nautilus) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models Ford is unlikely to develop a new platform that can be either ICE or EV. Either one would be trade off at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 Any speculation on the 6.8 liter engine Windsor is getting? A version of the 7.3? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 22, 2020 Author Share Posted September 22, 2020 1 hour ago, rmc523 said: Could be? Though someone earlier pointing out Ford's history of including all powertrain variants when tallying up electric models (i.e. an Edge ICE, hybrid, and PHEV counts as "3" models, "2" electrics) makes me skeptical of their "5 electric models" terminology. Interpreting Ford speak in normal people talk, that could easily mean only 3 new models: vehicle 1 - a Ford PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Edge) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models vehicle 2 - a Lincoln PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Nautilus) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models vehicle 3 - a new BEV model. FORD'S TALLY - "1" model Or it could be even "worse" - that it could easily mean 2 new models (in normal people talk): vehicle 1 - a Ford ICE/PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Edge) FORD'S TALLY - "3" models vehicle 2 - a Lincoln PHEV (or regular hybrid) and EV version of the same body (i.e. Nautilus) FORD'S TALLY - "2" models I agree I somehow don’t think it will be 5 separate vehicles. We had four here and obviously it was the two platforms D 471/472 and U387/388. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 22, 2020 Author Share Posted September 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Trader 10 said: Any speculation on the 6.8 liter engine Windsor is getting? A version of the 7.3? All the details will be released to us online on Sunday. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 3 hours ago, Trader 10 said: Any speculation on the 6.8 liter engine Windsor is getting? A version of the 7.3? What 6.8 engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 37 minutes ago, Bob Rosadini said: What 6.8 engine? Agreed, I haven’t heard anything about a new 6.8L. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stray Kat Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 Baby Godzilla at Windsor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, Stray Kat said: Baby Godzilla at Windsor. Why do they need that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausrutherford Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 Likely means the next Edge/Nautilus are either full-EVs or they will move to Mexico. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausrutherford Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 1 minute ago, silvrsvt said: Why do they need that? 6.2L replacement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 23, 2020 Author Share Posted September 23, 2020 25 minutes ago, ausrutherford said: Likely means the next Edge/Nautilus are either full-EVs or they will move to Mexico. I’m wondering if the Edge Nautilus go all electric as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 6 hours ago, valve said: Ford is unlikely to develop a new platform that can be either ICE or EV. Either one would be trade off at this point. I would agree, but as pointed out, Ford has a history of exaggerating their offerings by counting multiple powertrains as "extra" electrified vehicles. Where normal people hear that, they think 5 new EV nameplates, when in Ford talk, it could mean a couple of new nameplates with multiple powertrains. I may be wrong, but just going off history here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGR Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 (edited) The language in the official announcement will tell all. If the 5 vehicles are announced as EVs, that will indeed be big news. If they're called "electrified" that probably just means that the next Edge/Nautilus will be hybrid and PHEV only. The 5th vehicle will be the mystery. And what of the Fusion? The dealers have been promised a "Fusion" car of some sorts, they won't be happy if it doesn't materialize. There's now 2 C2 plants which are or will be at full capacity, and Flat Rock and (Mexican city I can't spell or pronounce) that have as of now one product allocation each. The new Fusion would have to come from one of those plants. Edited September 23, 2020 by AGR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oac98 Posted September 23, 2020 Author Share Posted September 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, AGR said: The language in the official announcement will tell all. If the 5 vehicles are announced as EVs, that will indeed be big news. If they're called "electrified" that probably just means that the next Edge/Nautilus will be hybrid and PHEV only. The 5th vehicle will be the mystery. And what of the Fusion? The dealers have been promised a "Fusion" car of some sorts, they won't be happy if it doesn't materialize. There's now 2 C2 plants which are or will be at full capacity, and Flat Rock and (Mexican city I can't spell or pronounce) that have as of now one product allocation each. The new Fusion would have to come from one of those plants. They’re making it sound like it’s all electric here. They say we’re gonna lose some jobs as electric vehicles require less parts. 300 jobs are supposed to be created for battery production. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 Also opens up the idea of a range extended EV with say, 100 miles of electric range and a small ICE to generate enough energy to keep running...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twin Turbo Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 https://windsorstar.com/news/local-news/breaking-unifor-and-ford-reach-tentative-agreement "Dias said Ford’s Windsor engine plants will begin producing a new 6.8-litre engine in 2022 for the F-150 pickup truck and the Ford Mustang" I can understand a new 6.8l for the F150, but for the Mustang, too? Surely not?!? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pffan1990 Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Twin Turbo said: https://windsorstar.com/news/local-news/breaking-unifor-and-ford-reach-tentative-agreement "Dias said Ford’s Windsor engine plants will begin producing a new 6.8-litre engine in 2022 for the F-150 pickup truck and the Ford Mustang" I can understand a new 6.8l for the F150, but for the Mustang, too? Surely not?!? Remember news reports a few years back about a new 4.8L V8 engine to be made in Windsor to replace the old 5.0L? I'm wondering if the 6.8L is actually a misprint and supposed to be 4.8L V8? Here's an old article about it. Looking like the 4.8L engine project may have moved forward if that's the case? https://www.torquenews.com/106/future-ford-f150-could-get-new-48l-v8 Edited September 23, 2020 by pffan1990 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, silvrsvt said: Prayers have been answered, GM may have the LS but Ford has Godzilla It will be interesting to see how Ford makes the 6.8 work for CAFE fuel economy. Perhaps sophisticated cylinder deactivation like GM's new dynamic fuel Management? Edited September 23, 2020 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 2 hours ago, pffan1990 said: Remember news reports a few years back about a new 4.8L V8 engine to be made in Windsor to replace the old 5.0L? I'm wondering if the 6.8L is actually a misprint and supposed to be 4.8L V8? Here's an old article about it. Looking like the 4.8L engine project may have moved forward if that's the case? https://www.torquenews.com/106/future-ford-f150-could-get-new-48l-v8 That makes more sense 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 Autonews are saying 6.8 V8 as well..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 That's so weird to me. It wasn't that long ago Jim Hackett said Ford was done developing new gas engines and from here on they would just be upgrading the current engines and focusing on hybrid/PHEV and BEV drivetrains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 32 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: That's so weird to me. It wasn't that long ago Jim Hackett said Ford was done developing new gas engines and from here on they would just be upgrading the current engines and focusing on hybrid/PHEV and BEV drivetrains. There will be changes to existing engine family's, just new ground up designs will not be done. An engine like the 3.0L I-6 will probably never happen now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 17 minutes ago, jasonj80 said: There will be changes to existing engine family's, just new ground up designs will not be done. An engine like the 3.0L I-6 will probably never happen now. So basically the 6.8L will be a short deck 7.3L. reading inbetween the lines. Interesting, considering the resources they want to use with the Ecoboost lineup in the F-150, or is this just a replacement for the 6.2L in the Super Duty? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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