Farley Says Boring Vehicles Are Going Away

[silvrsvt]

https://fordauthority.com/2024/01/ford-ceo-farley-says-boring-vehicles-are-going-away-video/

[Oac98]

There’s that COMMODITY talk again from Farley! I hope these passion and work products live up to the hype! 

[Dequindre]

Farley needs to go. Why should Ford cede a massive amount of market share to foreign brands that will only continue to edge into Ford's "non-boring" vehicle segments? Look at the Hyundai Palisade and Kia Telluride. Hyundai and Kia can upsell those more premium products to their prior Sonata buyers, this Soul buyers, their Forte buyers, etc. Ford is going to have a hard time peeling buyers like this away when they're in the news for recall after recall rather than building quality products. It's hard to get buyers in the showroom to buy your "premium" products when you have a bad reputation for reliability (warranted or not). 

[Willwll313wll]

21 minutes ago, Dequindre said:

Farley needs to go. Why should Ford cede a massive amount of market share to foreign brands that will only continue to edge into Ford's "non-boring" vehicle segments? Look at the Hyundai Palisade and Kia Telluride. Hyundai and Kia can upsell those more premium products to their prior Sonata buyers, this Soul buyers, their Forte buyers, etc. Ford is going to have a hard time peeling buyers like this away when they're in the news for recall after recall rather than building quality products. It's hard to get buyers in the showroom to buy your "premium" products when you have a bad reputation for reliability (warranted or not). 

 

I'd prefer desirable vehicles over market share. 

They need to do something about their quality though!! You are right about that.

[Bob Rosadini]

16 minutes ago, Dequindre said:

Farley needs to go. Why should Ford cede a massive amount of market share to foreign brands that will only continue to edge into Ford's "non-boring" vehicle segments? Look at the Hyundai Palisade and Kia Telluride. Hyundai and Kia can upsell those more premium products to their prior Sonata buyers, this Soul buyers, their Forte buyers, etc. Ford is going to have a hard time peeling buyers like this away when they're in the news for recall after recall rather than building quality products. It's hard to get buyers in the showroom to buy your "premium" products when you have a bad reputation for reliability (warranted or not). 

Amen..My first thought when I saw the thread title.  If you forget about Ford's horrible recall history, the next thing that comes to mind, is the bullet proof quality image the likes of Toyota and Honda have.

Never owned either...diehard Ford..but I do own 8 assorted "machines" powered by Honda !  

 

It seems to me Farley is constantly trying to be "creative" with the next catchy trend/phrase.

[silvrsvt]

13 minutes ago, Bob Rosadini said:

Amen..My first thought when I saw the thread title.  If you forget about Ford's horrible recall history, the next thing that comes to mind, is the bullet proof quality image the likes of Toyota and Honda have.

 

That is the problem, its an image....it's a far cry from their products they made 20-30 years ago. 

[T-dubz]

 

I thought this quote was telling:

 

“There are a lot of car companies, but what is going to make Ford different? And for me it’s very simple: we don’t make commodity products,” Farley said. “We make products for people who work, and work with their hands, and we make passion products like Bronco and Mustang. And that’s what we do at Ford, and when we’ve gotten away from that formula, it hasn’t worked out. We want Ford to be a powerhouse when it comes to passion products and work products. No more boring products, and that’s what this night is all about.”

 

The reason ford vehicles don’t usually work out is because ford doesn’t update them, not because they were commodities. Most of these “commodity” vehicles were big sellers until ford left them high and dry. Also, look at all the top selling vehicles in each segment, most of them could be considered commodities. I’m sure the rav4 and crv are bringing in plenty of money for Toyota and Honda.

 

Most people don’t buy work vehicles or passion products. They need good, reliable transportation to get them where they need to go. It seems shortsighted to get rid of “boring” vehicles when that’s what most people buy. 
 

Here’s my problem with all of this. “Passion” and “exciting” when used to describe a vehicle are usually also associated with the word “expensive”. 

[Rick73]

59 minutes ago, T-dubz said:

Most people don’t buy work vehicles or passion products. They need good, reliable transportation to get them where they need to go. It seems shortsighted to get rid of “boring” vehicles when that’s what most people buy. 
 

Here’s my problem with all of this. “Passion” and “exciting” when used to describe a vehicle are usually also associated with the word “expensive”. 

I was thinking similarly.  “Passion” and “exciting” are words to describe a Ferrari, not a daily driver to commute in.  I think I know what he meant though, and it was probably marketing and sales talk which carries very little actual meaning.  The underlying message is that he wants Ford to have successful vehicles like Maverick and Puma.  I find both of these examples attractive (good looking) for what they are, but not sure success is due to some unusual emotional feature other than they look good.  Both Maverick and Puma seem basic and practical transportation to me, which is a lot closer to typical “commodity” designation.  And they are both also affordable, again closer to typical commodity vehicle.  I don’t think we should read a lot into these types of comments from Farley, or anyone for that matter.

[DeluxeStang]

6 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

That is the problem, its an image....it's a far cry from their products they made 20-30 years ago. 

Yeah, both of Toyotas trucks these days are kinda terrible in terms of quality and reliability. The ranger has ranked near the top for quality in the midsized segment, whereas the Tacoma is mid-pack. The tundra engines are notoriously unreliable, the 3.5 inline 6s they switched to in '22 I mean, not the old school v8s. 

 

From a quality/reliability standpoint, the only Ford truck that seems iffy is the f-150 in various trims. But even then, it seems like those issues are blown out of proportion.

[DeluxeStang]

2 hours ago, T-dubz said:

 

I thought this quote was telling:

 

“There are a lot of car companies, but what is going to make Ford different? And for me it’s very simple: we don’t make commodity products,” Farley said. “We make products for people who work, and work with their hands, and we make passion products like Bronco and Mustang. And that’s what we do at Ford, and when we’ve gotten away from that formula, it hasn’t worked out. We want Ford to be a powerhouse when it comes to passion products and work products. No more boring products, and that’s what this night is all about.”

 

The reason ford vehicles don’t usually work out is because ford doesn’t update them, not because they were commodities. Most of these “commodity” vehicles were big sellers until ford left them high and dry. Also, look at all the top selling vehicles in each segment, most of them could be considered commodities. I’m sure the rav4 and crv are bringing in plenty of money for Toyota and Honda.

 

Most people don’t buy work vehicles or passion products. They need good, reliable transportation to get them where they need to go. It seems shortsighted to get rid of “boring” vehicles when that’s what most people buy. 
 

Here’s my problem with all of this. “Passion” and “exciting” when used to describe a vehicle are usually also associated with the word “expensive”. 

To be fair, look at the maverick. It's not expensive, it's not some exotic vehicle offering. It is that reliable A to B transportation device than many buyers want. But it's not some generic commodity product either. It's a passion product that broke the mold, and captured everyone's attention by being radically different to what was being offered by other brands. Aside from the model 3, it's probably the only affordable entry level product in my lifetime that people have cared about, that people have been excited about. 

 

So I don't see Farley's comments as saying Ford will only selling broncos and mustangs in a few years. I see his comments as Ford rethinking it's offerings in high volume segments to make something worthy of your money. Alter that transit van to make it a better tool for your business, or a better option for the van life folks. Making thinks like the explorer more visually daring, and forward thinking, same goes for the escape, instead of making a small crossover vanilla blob on wheels, offering a small crossover that actually has a reason to exist in the space. 

 

Basically look at Ford's lineup, and reimagine most of those products as class leading, sexier, faster, more versatile takes on what Ford's already offering. That's how I envision this. 

[92merc]

Ford could have exciting vehicles again.  But unless they also give us more reliable vehicles, they'll be stuck where they are. 

 

Jaguar and Range Rover have exciting vehicles.  Look where they are at with their crappy reputation.

[akirby]

7 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

To be fair, look at the maverick. It's not expensive, it's not some exotic vehicle offering. It is that reliable A to B transportation device than many buyers want. But it's not some generic commodity product either. It's a passion product that broke the mold, and captured everyone's attention by being radically different to what was being offered by other brands. Aside from the model 3, it's probably the only affordable entry level product in my lifetime that people have cared about, that people have been excited about. 

 

So I don't see Farley's comments as saying Ford will only selling broncos and mustangs in a few years. I see his comments as Ford rethinking it's offerings in high volume segments to make something worthy of your money. Alter that transit van to make it a better tool for your business, or a better option for the van life folks. Making thinks like the explorer more visually daring, and forward thinking, same goes for the escape, instead of making a small crossover vanilla blob on wheels, offering a small crossover that actually has a reason to exist in the space. 

 

Basically look at Ford's lineup, and reimagine most of those products as class leading, sexier, faster, more versatile takes on what Ford's already offering. That's how I envision this. 

 

You nailed it.  This isn’t about cost it’s about market segments and designs.  Maverick and Bronco sport are perfect examples.  
 

People think commodity means cheap but it really means the product isn’t differentiated from the competition which leads to price wars which reduces profitability.  Think condiments.  There isn’t much difference between mustard, ketchup or mayo brands.  Some have a preference but almost nobody is paying a premium for blue plate vs. duke’s or Heinz vs. hunts.  If one cuts prices the others have to follow or lose a lot of business.  
 

Is there differentiation between Escape and RAV4 and CRV and the S. Korean models?  Not really.  But there would be with a longer Bronco Sport with hybrid options.

[akirby]

30 minutes ago, 92merc said:

Ford could have exciting vehicles again.  But unless they also give us more reliable vehicles, they'll be stuck where they are. 

 

Jaguar and Range Rover have exciting vehicles.  Look where they are at with their crappy reputation.

I agree it needs to improve but sales and market share are still pretty strong despite the problems.  The costs are hurting the bottom line but it hasn’t affected sales a lot.  Yet.  That’s probably why they haven’t done as much about it as we would like.

[akirby]

8 hours ago, Rick73 said:

I was thinking similarly.  “Passion” and “exciting” are words to describe a Ferrari, not a daily driver to commute in. 

Completely disagree.  Maverick and Bronco Sport buyers are very passionate about their vehicles.  They customize them, give them names, buy lots of accessories.  That doesn’t happen with Corollas and Camrys and Escapes.

[akirby]

10 hours ago, T-dubz said:

 

 

The reason ford vehicles don’t usually work out is because ford doesn’t update them, not because they were commodities. Most of these “commodity” vehicles were big sellers until ford left them high and dry. Also, look at all the top selling vehicles in each segment, most of them could be considered commodities. I’m sure the rav4 and crv are bringing in plenty of money for Toyota and Honda.

 

I guess I’ll just have to keep repeating this.  Don’t work out refers to profits not sales volume or market share.  The products didn’t get updated because they weren’t very profitable to begin with.  Ford had more expensive platforms and in some cases like focus higher labor costs.  
 

You can obviously make money with commodity products but it takes strict cost control (getting decades out of platforms with only minor updates) and global volume.  And the returns will still be modest.  If you’re Honda or Kia it makes sense because they don’t have the commercial vehicle and truck heritage that Ford has and they don’t have historic icons like Bronco and Mustang.  They just wouldn’t be successful in those markets.

 

Farley is just saying they’re going to play up to their strengths as far as where they’re going to invest in future products.  And as long as they can maintain market share without having to increase fixed overhead and generate higher profit margins it will be a success.  This myth about needing entry level boring vehicles to rope in customers is hogwash nowadays.  That was proven when they killed Focus and Ecosport.

[fordmantpw]

21 minutes ago, akirby said:

Completely disagree.  Maverick and Bronco Sport buyers are very passionate about their vehicles.  They customize them, give them names, buy lots of accessories.  That doesn’t happen with Corollas and Camrys and Escapes.

 

Not completely true.  My wife nicknamed her 2020 Escape Karen.  She could be a real b*$ch with all her sensors going off when there appeared to be no need! LOL!

[silvrsvt]

20 minutes ago, akirby said:

Is there differentiation between Escape and RAV4 and CRV and the S. Korean models?  Not really.  But there would be with a longer Bronco Sport with hybrid options.

 

The issue with the LWB Bronco Sport vs Escape vs the Bronco is size.

 

An Escape is 180 inches, the Bronco Sport is 172 inches

 

The Bronco is 173.7/189.4 depending on the two door vs four door. Adding a LWB BS would dilute the lineup IMO. 

 

IMO Ford would be better off leaning more into the sporty side with the next gen Escape replacement, like they are trying to do with the current model and letting the Bronco Sport take care of the people who want a tougher image with their vehicle. 

[T-dubz]

7 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

To be fair, look at the maverick. It's not expensive, it's not some exotic vehicle offering. It is that reliable A to B transportation device than many buyers want. But it's not some generic commodity product either. It's a passion product that broke the mold, and captured everyone's attention by being radically different to what was being offered by other brands. Aside from the model 3, it's probably the only affordable entry level product in my lifetime that people have cared about, that people have been excited about. 

 

So I don't see Farley's comments as saying Ford will only selling broncos and mustangs in a few years. I see his comments as Ford rethinking it's offerings in high volume segments to make something worthy of your money. Alter that transit van to make it a better tool for your business, or a better option for the van life folks. Making thinks like the explorer more visually daring, and forward thinking, same goes for the escape, instead of making a small crossover vanilla blob on wheels, offering a small crossover that actually has a reason to exist in the space. 

 

Basically look at Ford's lineup, and reimagine most of those products as class leading, sexier, faster, more versatile takes on what Ford's already offering. That's how I envision this. 

I’ll say he’s never been good at choosing his words because he often says things that can be interpreted multiple ways. It sounds to me like he wants to go more profitable niche markets instead of focusing on the masses, but maybe I’m wrong. I would be a big fan of some exciting vehicles, especially if the price was right. Most of ford’s vehicles have been boring lately, minus the broncos and raptors, which of course are very expensive.

 

Bronco - exciting

Bronco sport - exciting

Ranger - boring, probably the most boring in its segment

Escape - most boring in its segment, dated

explorer - neither boring or exciting, but the most exciting out of the vehicles in its segment

maverick - boring, but good qualities that make it appealing

mach e - somewhat exciting but already looks dated

mustang - somewhat exciting, but looks dated for being brand new

edge - boring dated design

expedition - boring and bloated looking but better then it looked a few years ago

f150 - neither boring or exciting 

lightning - boring

F250 - exciting

transit - boring

[GearheadGrrrl]

Ford's most boring vehicles are the F series, hope Farley doesn't make them "go away".

[GearheadGrrrl]

I've got no problem with Ford making "passion" vehicles that sell for six figure prices- The profits can subsidize lower priced and even boring vehicles for the rest of us. But Mr. Farley needs to remember that he's got a bunch of factories and thousands of workers to keep busy...

[ExplorerDude]

What Farley really means is any vehicle without good margins of 10% or better are going away. Because less than 10% is boring to him…..

[fuzzymoomoo]

1 hour ago, fordmantpw said:

 

Not completely true.  My wife nicknamed her 2020 Escape Karen.  She could be a real b*$ch with all her sensors going off when there appeared to be no need! LOL!

That’s what I call the cross traffic alert whenever it goes off when I’m backing down the driveway and it goes off when it senses the house 

[fuzzymoomoo]

12 minutes ago, ExplorerDude said:

What Farley really means is any vehicle without good margins of 10% or better are going away. Because less than 10% is boring to investors…..

 

FTFY

[GearheadGrrrl]

12 minutes ago, ExplorerDude said:

What Farley really means is any vehicle without good margins of 10% or better are going away. Because less than 10% is boring to him…..

That strategy works until you have to pay for autoworkers and factories that aren't building cars.

[akirby]

1 hour ago, fordmantpw said:

 

Not completely true.  My wife nicknamed her 2020 Escape Karen.  She could be a real b*$ch with all her sensors going off when there appeared to be no need! LOL!

Aptly named!