Ford Oakville to get some Super Duty Production 1800 jobs created.

[silvrsvt]

9 hours ago, 7Mary3 said:

 

It's also good in that even if the Super Duty leaves Avon Lake, that plant will still have plenty of work. 

OHTP makes larger Super Duties like the 450 and higher and I’m guessing frames that are used by other companies. 
 

Oakville will most likely just be building F250 and F350 variants as overflow and will be building the electric variants at the end of the decade 

[Oac98]

24 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

OHTP makes larger Super Duties like the 450 and higher and I’m guessing frames that are used by other companies. 
 

Oakville will most likely just be building F250 and F350 variants as overflow and will be building the electric variants at the end of the decade 

Thanks, that makes sense.

[Oac98]

Ford will have alot of truck plants. I can see all EV truck production eventually at Blueovalcity. I can’t see Dearborn building that old lightning long term. 

[silvrsvt]

1 hour ago, Oac98 said:

Ford will have alot of truck plants. I can see all EV truck production eventually at Blueovalcity. I can’t see Dearborn building that old lightning long term. 

 

That has been pretty much spelled out by the UAW contract with the people working on the Lightning having firs dibs for jobs at BOC. I don't see why the Lightning would continue with the new T3

[Harley Lover]

2 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 I don't see why the Lightning would continue with the new T3

 

Maybe for Ford Pro customers exclusively?

[ExplorerDude]

1 minute ago, Harley Lover said:

 

Maybe for Ford Pro customers exclusively?

There are two other Ford Pro “white space” commercial vehicles in development that will be built at the Dearborn EVC and the OHAP EVC.

 

The next gent F-150 EV “Lightning” is going to BOC.

[fuzzymoomoo]

2 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

That has been pretty much spelled out by the UAW contract with the people working on the Lightning having firs dibs for jobs at BOC.

That’s weird since a bunch of them are already here at MAP… 

[7Mary3]

4 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

OHTP makes larger Super Duties like the 450 and higher and I’m guessing frames that are used by other companies. 
 

Oakville will most likely just be building F250 and F350 variants as overflow and will be building the electric variants at the end of the decade 

 

Very true.  The volume of some of those commercial Super Duty trucks  is actually very small and since Avon Lake does not produce pickup models the plant really doesn't help the lack of capacity at KTP for more consumer type Super Duty trucks.  It appears Oakville will in that regard.  My hunch is with Oakville fully on line Ford may find eventually that Avon lake won't be needed for Super Duty production.  Oakville is a much larger facility than Avon Lake, and though Avon Lake has been expanded in recent years it's all been to support BEV's.  

[silvrsvt]

58 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

That’s weird since a bunch of them are already here at MAP… 

 

Well that was before everything changed and EV sales slowed down 

 

Quote

Tennessee Electric Vehicle Center (TEVC) Agreement Dearborn Truck Plant and REVC employees will have rights under a transfer of operations to relocate to the TEVC. Additionally, facilities with surplus employees will also be eligible for voluntary transfers. At the point of lawful recognition, TEVC will fall under the provisions of the Master Agreement in accordance with Article I, Section 4.

 

https://uaw.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/HourlyHighlighter-Ford_FINAL.pdf

Edited July 20 by silvrsvt

[Harley Lover]

1 hour ago, ExplorerDude said:

There are two other Ford Pro “white space” commercial vehicles in development that will be built at the Dearborn EVC and the OHAP EVC.

 

Will the new vehicles be BOF ala current gen Lightning, or a more bespoke 'true' EV chassis (or is that too much info to reveal)?

[Captainp4]

On 7/18/2024 at 3:52 PM, Texasota said:

Super Duty trucks are used for, well, super duty towing and hauling which is the the use case where BEVs perform poorly. With current battery technology I think it will be a very long time before we see Super Duty BEVs. But, contractors would love a Super Duty with F-150 hybrid design that will provide them with Pro Power Onboard.

Well, my sooper poopy is used for towing ~10k lbs on a set route 4-5 days out of the week, no day more than 75 miles total and less than 200 miles for the week. Sits in the driveway still hooked to the trailer while I drive my other toys when I'm not working. No highway driving, so plenty of regen. Home every night to charge. A BEV 250 is exactly what I want and need, the half ton BEVs aren't quite enough truck for my use. I know tons of other contractors/small business people in similar situations that would benefit greatly from one, but as I'm sure you know most contractors and owners of small business let politics get in the way of rational thinking on BEVs for some reason. Fuel is my largest expense behind payroll.
 

On 7/18/2024 at 3:02 PM, Deanh said:

given the Superduty being a gooseneck/ 5 th wheel mainstay Id bet hybrid being the better option....we will see

Obviously you wouldn't try to tow a 40ft 5th wheel camper hundreds of miles with a bev super duty unless you like sitting at chargers, well at least not until batteries/charging speed improve for the large packs.
 

On 7/18/2024 at 3:28 PM, akirby said:

Only with a range extender of some kind.

That'd be great for the long range towing guys that everyone in every comment section thinks they are. Personally don't want or need that, but it would certainly placate a lot of buyers that think they need that, and give the ones that actually do a viable electrified option.

[ausrutherford]

2 hours ago, ExplorerDude said:

There are two other Ford Pro “white space” commercial vehicles in development that will be built at the Dearborn EVC and the OHAP EVC.

 

The next gent F-150 EV “Lightning” is going to BOC.

 

I am hoping one of those will be the Transit Custom. 

[ExplorerDude]

6 hours ago, Harley Lover said:

 

Will the new vehicles be BOF ala current gen Lightning, or a more bespoke 'true' EV chassis (or is that too much info to reveal)?

I believe 1 is BOF and is actually based on the next gen F-150 EV but it is completely different. Rumors are this is the F-200.

 

The other is unclear. It could be BOF but I believe this is more of a unibody Van based vehicle.

 

They are serious about Ford Pro and the products it will have especially since this part of FMC’s business is booming.

[jpd80]

11 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

OHTP makes larger Super Duties like the 450 and higher and I’m guessing frames that are used by other companies. 
 

Oakville will most likely just be building F250 and F350 variants as overflow and will be building the electric variants at the end of the decade 

Correct as F250 & F350  models make up the bulk of SD sales,

100k annual production is about 8,300 per month so maybe

just enough to free up more EXPY/NAV builds at KTP?
 

Electrified versions later tin the decade is an exciting proposition 

with some version of hybrid or extended range electric vehicle

 

[akirby]

A lot of SD sales are to businesses even if they don’t go through fleet sales.  My brother in law buys a new one every 2 years.  I don’t think that counts as Ford Pro.

[jpd80]

7 hours ago, Captainp4 said:

Well, my sooper poopy is used for towing ~10k lbs on a set route 4-5 days out of the week, no day more than 75 miles total and less than 200 miles for the week. Sits in the driveway still hooked to the trailer while I drive my other toys when I'm not working. No highway driving, so plenty of regen. Home every night to charge. A BEV 250 is exactly what I want and need, the half ton BEVs aren't quite enough truck for my use. I know tons of other contractors/small business people in similar situations that would benefit greatly from one, but as I'm sure you know most contractors and owners of small business let politics get in the way of rational thinking on BEVs for some reason. Fuel is my largest expense behind payroll.
 

Obviously you wouldn't try to tow a 40ft 5th wheel camper hundreds of miles with a bev super duty unless you like sitting at chargers, well at least not until batteries/charging speed improve for the large packs.
 

That'd be great for the long range towing guys that everyone in every comment section thinks they are. Personally don't want or need that, but it would certainly placate a lot of buyers that think they need that, and give the ones that actually do a viable electrified option.

Your case is interesting to me and is an example of why Ford should be listening to contractors in your situation, be that needing an EV F250 for towing or some kind of EV Transit Van for bulk deliveries.

As you mentioned, fuel bills are a major cost and that’s where Ford needs to come up with an affordable BEV SD for you as  hybrid or PHEV is probably not the answer..

[DeluxeStang]

11 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

That has been pretty much spelled out by the UAW contract with the people working on the Lightning having firs dibs for jobs at BOC. I don't see why the Lightning would continue with the new T3

The only good reason to keep lighting around imo would be to appeal to Ford's base that wanted a more conventional truck that just so happened to be electric. That seems to be a major part of the lightning's appeal to a lot of their owners, the fact that it looks, and acts like the trucks they're used to. 

 

It sounds like t3 is very radical with Farley commenting in the past how it won't "look like a truck" and how the design would be controversial, that it had to be in order to hit areo targets. Add in far more advanced tech, and a higher price point, and I can see how that wouldn't really appeal to hardcore truck buyers who just want a truck to be a truck. 

 

T3 could perhaps be Ford's lifestyle truck designed to be as radical and futuristic as possible, closer to the cybertruck and r1t than the current lightning. Whereas the current lightning could remain, maybe with some tweaks and modern touches influenced by t3 development to keep it fresh. The safer and less polarizing electric truck compared to t3. 

 

 

[silvrsvt]

10 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

The only good reason to keep lighting around imo would be to appeal to Ford's base that wanted a more conventional truck that just so happened to be electric. That seems to be a major part of the lightning's appeal to a lot of their owners, the fact that it looks, and acts like the trucks they're used to. 

 

It sounds like t3 is very radical with Farley commenting in the past how it won't "look like a truck" and how the design would be controversial, that it had to be in order to hit areo targets. Add in far more advanced tech, and a higher price point, and I can see how that wouldn't really appeal to hardcore truck buyers who just want a truck to be a truck. 

 

T3 could perhaps be Ford's lifestyle truck designed to be as radical and futuristic as possible, closer to the cybertruck and r1t than the current lightning. Whereas the current lightning could remain, maybe with some tweaks and modern touches influenced by t3 development to keep it fresh. The safer and less polarizing electric truck compared to t3. 

 

 

 

Yes but given how the market will be in a few years, will customers support it? It seems like the Cybertruck and RT1 pickups are expensive playthings for influencers (at least the cybertruck) and the T3 would focus on that market. I’m not sure how much demand there would be for a “work EV truck” with people who buy them being on the conservative side. 
 

It would seem like the T3 would appeal to light duty fleet that an EV truck would excel at. 

[DeluxeStang]

3 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

Yes but given how the market will be in a few years, will customers support it? It seems like the Cybertruck and RT1 pickups are expensive playthings for influencers (at least the cybertruck) and the T3 would focus on that market. I’m not sure how much demand there would be for a “work EV truck” with people who buy them being on the conservative side. 
 

It would seem like the T3 would appeal to light duty fleet that an EV truck would excel at. 

You'd be surprised, I was when I learned apparently Ford's commercial customers are apparently adopting EVs are at faster rate than their other consumer base's. It's impossible to make predictions, we've all been wrong, myself especially, but I just see a funky looking spaceship crashing and burning with Ford's more conservative base. But the current lightning still appealing to them.

 

I hope I'm wrong about that. But yeah, I do think there's demand for more radical, and more restrained EV trucks alike considering how broad the tastes of EV truck buyers seem to be. Furthermore, I think it would be wise for Ford to hedge their bets so to speak, offering multiple types of trucks rather than going all in on one or the other. 

[tbone]

1 hour ago, DeluxeStang said:

You'd be surprised, I was when I learned apparently Ford's commercial customers are apparently adopting EVs are at faster rate than their other consumer base's. It's impossible to make predictions, we've all been wrong, myself especially, but I just see a funky looking spaceship crashing and burning with Ford's more conservative base. But the current lightning still appealing to them.

 

I hope I'm wrong about that. But yeah, I do think there's demand for more radical, and more restrained EV trucks alike considering how broad the tastes of EV truck buyers seem to be. Furthermore, I think it would be wise for Ford to hedge their bets so to speak, offering multiple types of trucks rather than going all in on one or the other. 

I thought the Ram Revolution EV concept was a pretty good balance between being modern/radical and still maintaining proper truck elements that would appeal to traditional buyers. If T3 is similar to this I think it will achieve very good successes.  
 

When it comes to radical, the Cybertruck looks ridiculous in form and function.  I like Tesla, but that was just trying to be too cute.  

[Texasota]

On 7/20/2024 at 12:46 PM, Captainp4 said:

That'd be great for the long range towing guys that everyone in every comment section thinks they are. Personally don't want or need that, but it would certainly placate a lot of buyers that think they need that, and give the ones that actually do a viable electrified option.

The different use cases and opinions on EREVs are interesting. Only my opinion, but I think a Super Duty Powerboost  (similar to the F-150 Powerboost) would work very well for long range towing guys.

 

With an EREV I see two huge downsides. First, I have seen very few charging stations that can accommodate a large trailer. That means unhitching your 40' 5th Wheel RV before charging and re-hitching after charging. Second, after charging you still have a limited number of miles (perhaps 250ish?) before the small displacement ICE is overwhelmed. Not the driving experience I would want traveling from Minnesota to my Florida snowbird location.

[Oac98]

On 7/20/2024 at 9:33 AM, silvrsvt said:

 

That has been pretty much spelled out by the UAW contract with the people working on the Lightning having firs dibs for jobs at BOC. I don't see why the Lightning would continue with the new T3

That makes sense to me, maybe abit of overlap for a year but that’s it.

[sullynd]

Do people think T3 eventually replaces F150? I don’t. Assuming it doesn’t, continuing the Lightning makes sense, as eventually ICE will go away. I’m 

[Oac98]

47 minutes ago, sullynd said:

Do people think T3 eventually replaces F150? I don’t. Assuming it doesn’t, continuing the Lightning makes sense, as eventually ICE will go away. I’m 

EV trucks are a long long way away to achieving ice pick up sales. The T3 isn’t replacing the f-150 anytime soon.

[mackinaw]

4 hours ago, Texasota said:

With an EREV I see two huge downsides. First, I have seen very few charging stations that can accommodate a large trailer. That means unhitching your 40' 5th Wheel RV before charging and re-hitching after charging. Second, after charging you still have a limited number of miles (perhaps 250ish?) before the small displacement ICE is overwhelmed. Not the driving experience I would want traveling from Minnesota to my Florida snowbird location.

 

You don't need to charge an EREV.  Once the battery pack is exhausted, the gas engine turns on and charges the battery.  The only stop you'll have to make is to fill the gas tank for the ICE.